Long range load development at 100 yards.

[284driver]

Email one to me and ill put it up

 

[mac86951]

Well I shot some groups today. Load that I liked was 31.1 grs H4350 with the Berger 90VLD's. If I could the pics to up load, you would be seeing them right now!

Descriptions are close enough (NOT!!!)

I find that lately I tend to group ladder testing at 600y and group testing at 100y into one test at 300y with 5 shots.

I look for grouping and location to zero for a wide gap. The 300y (sorry, this is for 223 Remington) will weed out the velocity fliers, and shows me where to focus more. I started this when powder became scarce, and bullets too. With 1lb of new powder, I'll get 230rnds, and I'll try bullets 100 at a time. Doing my 300y, I'll spend 25 on this type of test, another 15 on 100y grouping if results were good. That leaves me 60 for long-range testing at 600y. Not that my loads will be ideal then, but I'll know if it is worth going further.

I'll start a new thread for my experiment and those interested. I know that .223 isn't what most would consider long-range, but I think it can shoot 100y with the best of them, so I'd like to see how this method compares when applied to a caliber that is stretched to its distance limits.

-Mac

http://forum.accurateshooter.com/index.php?topic=3815169.0

 

[284driver]

Posted for froggyone2

 

[284driver]

http://i1084.photobucket.com/albums/j407/skyav8r/2013-05-15_15-07-43_813.jpg

http://i1084.photobucket.com/albums/j407/skyav8r/2013-05-15_15-10-14_364.jpg

 

[FroggyOne2]

Thanks Brian for doing that for me!

You can see where the node begins and where it ends. As for elevation of the loads, not much change in any of them till the last two.

 

[trailrider121]

Froggy,

I like 31.3grs, looks to be center of node. If you change powder charge by +1% or -1% you are still in the node and will still group very well. That's my guess!

 

[FroggyOne2]

Trailrider,

In the "shooos" ladder, the center was 31.3. But I am liking the 31.1 load, but I will also test the 31.4 and the 31.5 & 6 loads as well at 600 yards. But I have a feeling it will be the 31.1 load that will be the working load. We have a 3X600 coming up that will be great for that test. I am thinking of shooting that match F/Class with irons.

 

[FroggyOne2]

Froggy,

I like 31.3grs, looks to be center of node. If you change powder charge by +1% or -1% you are still in the node and will still group very well. That's my guess!

Just so that you know, weigh all of my loads .00 to .02 of a grain.

 

[BoydAllen]

Nice work. I do it a little differently, but the goal is the same, to identify a node. There are different ways to do the same job, although I should explain that I am developing for short range.

 

[tonysnoo]

Hey Erik,

I am planning on taking my favorited load and going through this exercise to see if I can improve on it. How many grains on each side of it,would you recommend testing? I was thinking of about 1.5 or 2.

I figure, I'll take some targets and mark a grid on then to keep some sort of common measuring stick.

I also was wondering about bullet depth. I got confused on one of your posts. I couldn't figure out if you start at 10 or 20 jam and then work out by .003. Is that correct?

 

[Erik Cortina]

Hey Erik,

I am planning on taking my favorited load and going through this exercise to see if I can improve on it. How many grains on each side of it,would you recommend testing? I was thinking of about 1.5 or 2.

I figure, I'll take some targets and mark a grid on then to keep some sort of common measuring stick.

I also was wondering about bullet depth. I got confused on one of your posts. I couldn't figure out if you start at 10 or 20 jam and then work out by .003. Is that correct?

Go 2 grains on each side of load.

I test at Jam - 0.020", but after finding powder accuracy node, I go back to Jam - .010" and test away from there in .003" increments.

 

[tonysnoo]

Jam minus .020...Start testing at jam minus .010.... Got it through my thick head this time Thanks so much,


Now to pick your brain further. You mentioned how to determine jam with bullet loaded in an unprimed case.

I've been using a fairly secure push on my modified case/stoney point setup. Is that really not a good way to measure "jam". I know it doesn't measure from the bolt face perfectly, but a loaded round will still have little float depending on the sizing.

Thanks again.

 

[Erik Cortina]

As long as you get repetitive results that all that matters. All you're looking for is a reference point.

 

[mshelton]

WEll, I figured I'd give this method a try on a problem child that I can't seem to get to act right, a 6.5x55GWI. Been working with the 140 Berger hunting VLDs and kept getting the same results as the 48.9 load in the picture, first 2 in a hole and the third a 1/2"+ out to the left or right, after 8-9 groups like that I ended up calling it quits on the 140s.

These are with the 130 Berger VLD hunting, moving in .04 increments with H4350 and seated .020 off what I consider jam. I kinda wish I had gone up to 50.9 and maybe 51.3 to see the results but from pretest research 50.5 looked to be the highest I would want to go, at 84 deg it did start to show pressure signs.

These were shot at a 100yds and over flags, not holding but waiting on condition, trying to get some good honest groups off. 48.5, 48.9, 49.7, 50.1 and 50.5 all look right to me, seems the center of the group moves up and then back down, 49.4 seems like it dipped down a little soon. To me it looks like the 50.5 would be the node as it shows a very similar vertical placement to 50.1 and is coming down from 49.7, 50.9 may have shown this to be correct too. 48.9 looks to be in the middle of a curve too but I've seen enough of those type groups from this rifle to make me want to stay away from it (first 2 in a hole and the 3rd spit out left or right).

Anyhow, what do you guys think, am I looking at the right one with 50.5?

 

[Erik Cortina]

I would go with 50.3 since we don't know what it would do going higher than 50.5. Load 50.3 gr and adjust seating depth in .003" increments and you should be able to bring the groups right in.

 

[mshelton]

Thanks Eric, want to make sure I was reading those groups correctly.

 

[diego-ted]

Eric, My turn, my turn, I went out and did some develpment with the newly worked Savage tube. 178 bthp hornady, Varget, lapua brass FGMM 210 primers. I am not sure what to make of it? Did I blow the test by shooting 4 shots? the 45gr test only has three, I used one for a sighter??

Thx Ted

 

[Erik Cortina]

The powder charges are too close together, but looks like 44.6 - 45.0 are the node. Take 44.8 gr and adjust seating depth and that should work.

 

[diego-ted]

Eric, I see you use 1/2 gr incraments? Why is this? Should I re-run the test using the larger increment, or just go with 44.8 and work seating depth?

thx Ted

 

[Erik Cortina]

Eric, I see you use 1/2 gr incraments? Why is this? Should I re-run the test using the larger increment, or just go with 44.8 and work seating depth?

thx Ted

I just find it just as easy to see the node and I can cover a larger powder range with less groups.

Just go with 44.8 and work on seating depth.