Copper bullets, I am over it.

[SixFive]

Yeah it's a great cartridge settling the debate between 270 and 30-06 on which is better.
Its almost like you can hear P.O.Ackley tell Jack O'Connor "Hold my beer" lol
The mono through both shoulders was like Thor's Hammer with no lead or copper fragments left behind preforming exactly the way I'd hoped. But trust me I was worried about bullet performance from the beginning from all the gospel of failed performance I'd read on the internet.
Further testing on game is planned.

I read where you have a plentiful stash of TA, that's a good thing.

A buddy just paid $1.80 per bullet for 140gr TA for his 270, I'd say he's in love cuz that ain't a cheap date. Lol

Yeah they are not cheap but they are unique in design. Bonded lead frontal area and the back half is solid copper. I really like them but they are hard to get and expensive when you do find them. I got real lucky when I found them in bulk. I would like to have the 7mms also but I am not paying that much!

 

[Fclassfool]

Copper bullets like to be pushed fast to work well drop your bullet grains and pick up the powder charge. I wasn't getting the performance I expected out of Barnes and hammers till I pushed them fast ymmv

 

[SixFive]

Is that Terminal Accent still being marketed as a reloading bullet? I always assumed it was just in Federal’s loaded ammo.

Oh yeah! They sell them as reloading component bullets, just usually out of stock Sometimes if you are lucky you can find the Federal Trophy bonded in bulk on Gun Broker, they are almost the SAME bullet in design, TA just got a few tweaks but on game they seem to work the same for me. If I remember correctly the lineage was Trophy Bonded, Edge TLR, Then Terminal Ascent, each rendition getting a tweak towards perfection. All of them however are Half Copper and Half Bonded construction. To me they perform like Nosler Partition bullets but with near match grade accuracy, my experience.

This is the ONLY bullet I have ever seen BLOW gel blocks in HALF in testing

Yeah I am a FAN BOY, sorry

 

[1K6BRA]

But trust me I was worried about bullet performance from the beginning from all the gospel of failed performance I'd read on the internet.

Performance of bullets by Internet experts is one thing. I’m just glad I trusted the Internet gossip for meeting my French model girlfriend! She’s the bomb

Brett, that picture you posted is normally what I see using TTSX slugs, on the exit side.

 

[Kracken McGraw]

Oh yeah! They sell them as reloading component bullets, just usually out of stock Sometimes if you are lucky you can find the Federal Trophy bonded in bulk on Gun Broker, they are almost the SAME bullet in design, TA just got a few tweaks but on game they seem to work the same for me. If I remember correctly the lineage was Trophy Bonded, Edge TLR, Then Terminal Ascent, each rendition getting a tweak towards perfection. All of them however are Half Copper and Half Bonded construction. To me they perform like Nosler Partition bullets but with near match grade accuracy, my experience.

Yeah I am a FAN BOY, sorry

Someone said the Speer Impact bullet might be like the TA, but I have no idea if there even close.

 

[SixFive]

Someone said the Speer Impact bullet might be like the TA, but I have no idea if there even close.

Doing a quick look it does not appear so. I wish though!!!!

 

[Doug Casner]

I was worried they wouldnt open up. So I got 90 gr. 25 cal. Shot them max. in a 257 wyb. mag. I dont remember the speed but they were moving on. Shot under an in. The elk I shot was with a .308 and it opened up. Yet to shoot game with the Weatherby. Doug

 

[Kracken McGraw]

Doing a quick look it does not appear so. I wish though!!!!

While we’re on the subject, do you have a cut out of the Accubond LR for a comparison?

 

[SixFive]

While we’re on the subject, do you have a cut out of the Accubond LR for a comparison?

Sure my friend! Notice the base looks very similar to a Nosler Ballistic Tip, a little extra copper helping drive the round deeper and a tapered jacket. Very nice design but I have ZERO experience with them.

 

[Bc'z]

Is that Terminal Accent still being marketed as a reloading bullet? I always assumed it was just in Federal’s loaded ammo.

He just told me he got them from BiMart special order took a week to get them. Price was $1.35 per 100 not the $1.80 I said above

 

[Kracken McGraw]

Sure my friend! Notice the base looks very similar to a Nosler Ballistic Tip, a little extra copper helping drive the round deeper and a tapered jacket. Very nice design but I have ZERO experience with them.

Hey Thanks!
I have some 142 grain ABLR loaded for the Creedmoor, maybe I will get a chance to try one out.

 

[SixFive]

Hey Thanks!
I have some 142 grain ABLR loaded for the Creedmoor, maybe I will get a chance to try one out.

I have been shooting 120gr Ballistic Tips FAST in my Creedmoor with very good success! I bet the ABLR will work just fine, You know they will be accurate, they are Nosler. I have a box of the ABLR in 6.5 and I am going to try them eventually in my Rem 260.

As the picture below demonstrates, I am sick I am testing bullets and powders constantly. I think I enjoy testing and shooting more than hunting sometimes.

 

[searcher]

Yeah that is a GREAT example of copper performance I am referring to, it can happen with them hitting heavy bone. Next time you "might" get a pin hole, that is my issue with these bullets, sometimes they act like hand grenades, sometimes they act like arrows. That picture really looks like an Alien exploded out of that deer LOL!

FYI, Great caliber you are shooting, maybe one of the best deer rounds ever created!

" Barnes Bullets are not perfect. They are not the optimum bullet for all things or all times. Nor do they always deliver the fastest kills." --- Ron Spomer

What bullet ALWAYS provides the fastest kills and is the optimum bullet for all things and times? If you want to open a can of worms, try answering that one. That ammo manufacturers continue to expand lead-free big game ammo, innovation and bullet availability speaks of actual demand. Most folks don't continue to buy products that don't work.

 

[Bill K]

Didn't Nosler have a solid base ( Copper) bullet some years back, which looked a lot like the TA, however I believe they were in only small caliber (224) and used for varmint shooting. They really came apart.

Sure my friend! Notice the base looks very similar to a Nosler Ballistic Tip, a little extra copper helping drive the round deeper and a tapered jacket. Very nice design but I have ZERO experience with them.

 

[spaniel]

Every bullet has its performance range. IMHO most copper rifle bullets have a narrower range than copper/lead alternatives. Doesn't mean they aren't good, but I wouldn't trust one from 100-800 yards where there are more conventional alternatives I would.

Copper CAN be designed for low velocity expansion...I shoot Maker 500gr .458cal subsonic and they open great. But a subsonic bullet performs in a very narrow range and velocity window, that's an easy design application.

I might be a bit biased though, my first experience with full copper was a Barnes shotgun slug. Shot a wounded, soft yearling in the shoulder trying to put it down from 70 yards, slug splashed on the shoulder blade and created a massive shallow wound but failed to penetrate the yearling shoulder blade and deflected.

I'd have full confidence with modern rifle copper bullet designs within 300ish yards where velocity is high.

 

[searcher]

Every bullet has its performance range. IMHO most copper rifle bullets have a narrower range than copper/lead alternatives. Doesn't mean they aren't good, but I wouldn't trust one from 100-800 yards where there are more conventional alternatives I would.

Copper CAN be designed for low velocity expansion...I shoot Maker 500gr .458cal subsonic and they open great. But a subsonic bullet performs in a very narrow range and velocity window, that's an easy design application.

I might be a bit biased though, my first experience with full copper was a Barnes shotgun slug. Shot a wounded, soft yearling in the shoulder trying to put it down from 70 yards, slug splashed on the shoulder blade and created a massive shallow wound but failed to penetrate the yearling shoulder blade and deflected.

I'd have full confidence with modern rifle copper bullet designs within 300ish yards where velocity is high.

I have high confidence in the rifle bullets from several manufacturers out to certain ranges, depending on the caliber. Never tried the slugs. I have shot many thousands of the varmint bullets from various manufacturers including the NTX, lead-free Ballistic Tips and Barnes Varmint Grenades. The lead-free BT's and the Varmint Grenades are most accurate in my rifles. The 50 Varmint Grenades are downright lethal on coyotes and far superior to any lead bullet for that application and similar weight out to 300 yards or so in respect to knockdown punch (out of a .223) also blows up the squirrels quite well. The 40 and 50 lead-free Ballistic Tips are great squirrel medicine too. If all my shots were within 300 yards, this is an application where I could get by without lead bullets and not feel at a disadvantage. I'd like to see more, heavier lead-free bullets in .204, .224 and 6mm. Pretty niche market, so my dreams may never be realized. I was really pleased to see Nosler release the 50 Lead-free.

 

[searcher]

I wonder what most people feel about having lead fragments scattered throughout the meat of game shot. That doesn't seem to be a topic brought up too much when folks talk about the differences between lead and copper bullets. I'm not knowledgeable about how much lead it takes to make things bad for a person.

 

[SixFive]

I wonder what most people feel about having lead fragments scattered throughout the meat of game shot. That doesn't seem to be a topic brought up too much when folks talk about the differences between lead and copper bullets. I'm not knowledgeable about how much lead it takes to make things bad for a person.

Well, I do not eat the area shot\damaged, I think the amount of lead is minimal at best. I have been eating lead shot game meat 35 years now, humm maybe that explains some things Realistically the bonded bullets I mostly shoot have very high weight retention so there is not a concern. A Berger bullet? Well that is a different animal all together...

 

[Kracken McGraw]

I wonder what most people feel about having lead fragments scattered throughout the meat of game shot. That doesn't seem to be a topic brought up too much when folks talk about the differences between lead and copper bullets. I'm not knowledgeable about how much lead it takes to make things bad for a person.

It was a little scary when you bit down on a piece of shot eating quail, but you always could spit it out.

 

[CharlieNC]

Nathan Foster in NZ is that expert and I urge you to explore his website fully to examine the vast experience gained as a guide and long range shooter.
He also has several books on rifle selection and long range game shooting and works closely with some of the big projectile manufacturers on their projectile terminal performance.
In frustration with a 7mm RUM he developed the 7mm Practical that performs very nearly as well but doesn't suffer from premature throat erosion and I have seen one of these shoot a sub 3" group at 1000yds.

His books are excellent and bullet critiques are based on thousands of autopsy's. A book cost less than a box of cartridges!