Why doesn't Hornady make match grade bullets capable of competing with Berger bullets?

[bozo699]

I disagree. Their bullets are very 'soft'

I said decent, not top shelf!…. There’s been a lot of game taken with Hornaday interlocks, there as good or better than a Remington core lock and I would venture to say there’s been more game taken with core locks than any other bullet. I think Joyce Hornaday was a great innovator. He was a hunter and back in the day before partitions, bonded and solids came along he made good hunting bullets, By today’s standards not so much. I’ve shot thousands upon thousands of 50 and 55 grain v-max out of 22 caliber rifles and 65 and 75 grain v-max out of 6mm rifles for groundhog and predator hunting with great success. I tried both Hornaday and Nosler 105bthp “match”
Bullets for 1000 yard BR they did not pan out!… for production bullets Berger is the only way to go. Other than that it’s custom bullets
Wayne

 

[lyle2231]

If what’s your using fulfills your expectations then it’s the best thing going.
Whether it’s BR, F, or ATC A LOT of variables can affect the performance of a bullet on the way to the target not to mention the law of physics thrown in for good measure. I used the same bullet in two different ARs one would blow up the MK every 3 to 4 rounds in the other things just fine.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Hornady spent a lot of years building a good hunting bullet. Berger, from day 1 was about competition bullets. If I were guessing, I'd say most of the magic is jacket quality and not just concentricity. I think the annealing may be just as important to the end product. It takes a very good rifle and shooter to see the differences we're talking here. That makes it tough for any other company, just testing alone. Walt Berger was a HOF BR shooter and many of his customers are in that kinda league. Not so much the market Hornady has built it's reputation and product on...or with the benefit of having.

 

[DHuffman]

Does Hornady sponsor any competitive shooters, do they have “team Hornady”
that competes. I brought up Hornady bullet in another topic mainly because you can find them for sale. And now they seam to be a hot topic on this site but very few positives other for hunting

Yes I believe they do but mostly in field type shooting, feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. Hornady puts a lot of product on prize tables at the BR and PRS matches I've attended so for that reason as well as performance and availability I shoot a lot of Hornady bullets in my hunting and PRS style rifles.

They donate a lot back to the shooting sports and people ought to think about that before jumping on the Internet and talking shit about them in my opinion.

 

[urbanrifleman]

MOST ACCURATE BULLET IN THE WORLD

I was just thinking some of the most accurate bullets in the world will be on the line this fall in SC So if you are someone who thought that silvertip and their abilities were up to the challenge that would be a good place to make a splash! I'll bring my 6.5PRC with the Hellfire brake. They...

forum.accurateshooter.com

Johara1 and his opinion of the 110 Atip. I believe he was one of the most accomplished shooters on the board. Do a search about his opinion on the Atip, he did not agree with the assessment that are "match bullets" at all.

BTW, Johara1 was the guy that Cortina was asking for HIS opinion...

He was also the guy that revealed the fact that the "automated" Vapor Trails are made by Hornady (also considered a "match" bullet I would guess).

 

[urbanrifleman]

I have been around this game long enough to have a healthy suspicion of equipment lists.

Right?

 

[Tommie]

Hey wait a minute. I got distracted and lost track. Is this a Hornady bashing thread or a short range BR versus everyone else thread?
I’m sure the OP would like to know as well.

 

[Dimner]

As mentioned, Hornady may simply not want to compete in the market for benchrest bullet.
I'm guessing that the market for benchrest bullets is small compared to non benchrest market.

I think this is it. Like them or not, business wise, Hornady has a great marketing department or a great marketing agency working for them.

I would expect that they have great analytics department as well. That means they would have done extensive research on the market, market share and trends in customer usage.

I bet they are very happy providing products to the shooting disciplines like PRS, XTC, High power, NRL, 3 gun, etc. All very high volume bullet consuming sports. And those shooting formats have many more participants than BR or Fclass. Probably on a factor of 10x to 20x participants.

They purposely develop products for the competitors who put the most lead downrange.

 

[bozo699]

MOST ACCURATE BULLET IN THE WORLD

I was just thinking some of the most accurate bullets in the world will be on the line this fall in SC So if you are someone who thought that silvertip and their abilities were up to the challenge that would be a good place to make a splash! I'll bring my 6.5PRC with the Hellfire brake. They...

forum.accurateshooter.com

Johara1 and his opinion of the 110 Atip. I believe he was one of the most accomplished shooters on the board. Do a search about his opinion on the Atip, he did not agree with the assessment that are "match bullets" at all.

BTW, Johara1 was the guy that Cortina was asking for HIS opinion...

He was also the guy that revealed the fact that the "automated" Vapor Trails are made by Hornady (also considered a "match" bullet I would guess).

Jim was an outstanding guy that taught me a lot!.. I always appreciated his opinions. I bought a B&M powder dispenser from him and ask him to sign it for me, he did and I will never get rid of it.
Wayne

 

[Dimner]

To put it a other way. If the competition disciplines that put the most lead downrange demanded more accuracy and precision, Hornady would develop something to meet their needs. Or develop something that kinda met their needs and marketed the snot out of it.

It's not a conspiracy, they have a business model and have probably done a lot of research and paid a lot of money into developing and maintaining that model and their market share.

 

[SBS]

My point is everything is not benchrest. I compete in 'cross the course' - many use Hornady. Are they not shooting in matches?

I agree totally. I've used Hornady & Sierra bullets in XC, silhouette + 600 yd. shooting off a sling and they worked well. F Class targets are smaller by 1 ring and I understand why these shooters use better bullets, particularly if their skills are at the top end. For 1000 sling, I've usually used Berger and sometimes Sierra. Same is true of equipment -- sometimes don't need the most accurate rifle, depending on the game played.

 

[Dimner]

Maybe Hornady as a company are like Service Rifle shooters, and they don't give a shit about pretentious people that shoot from benches or $1K rests.

I have met some pretty pretentious service rifle shooters. Many of them.

Sure, there are less gear snobs in that format, but they exist and are just as vocal as in any sport

 

[Dimner]

Hmmm. Looks like PRS competitors don't know they weren't shooting matches. From Precision Rifle Blog:
View attachment 1556208
View attachment 1556209

These graphs are so purposely misleading. That second graph is a poll of SIX SHOOTERS. If you miss that part it looks like hundreds of shooters are using the 140eldm.

The top graph isn't much better at 35 shooters.

 

[jelenko]

These graphs are so purposely misleading. That second graph is a poll of SIX SHOOTERS. If you miss that part it looks like hundreds of shooters are using the 140eldm.

The top graph isn't much better at 35 shooters.

Right.
But, I think the guy who does the blog takes data from just the top 50 or so PRS competitors - I think.

 

[bpm990d]

A jackass statement like that gets you on the ignore list before the boss tells me "I can't do that"!

Yet you fail to call out the OP for making such a stupid post about Hornady just to stir the shit.

Plenty of shooter that don't shoot BR or F-Class have had good results with their bullets and lots of posters have been saying the same thing in this thread and that other stupid thread, yet somehow people keep saying they are a crap product without differentiating what type of matches they shoot.

 

[bpm990d]

I have met some pretty pretentious service rifle shooters. Many of them.

Sure, there are less gear snobs in that format, but they exist and are just as vocal as in any sport

Yeah there are some. All the other ones are just sick and tired of snide comments from F-Class shooters about Hellen Keller targets. Especially when those F-Class shooters were lucky to shoot a 182 @ 600 when they use to be sling shooters.

 

[DiRTY DOG]

Like Cortina said on his podcast last week to Miles's (Hornady) about Miles' best accuracy with his custom rifle in a 200 yard tunnel... "That's just not good enough." Zing!

Miles is pleased with 1-1.5" 20-round 0.75 moa groups at 200 yards in a tunnel. Cortina scraps the load if it shoots over 0.5 moa at 1000 yards.

 

[RED DIRT]

Why doesn't Hornady make match grade bullets capable of competing with Berger bullets?​

Same could be said about their reloading gear, too.
I gave up on their reloading equipment, it got old being their beta tester and fixing their junk.

Back to the topic, i`m not a fan of any of their bullets.
I`ve used their bullets for years, just to fire form my brass.

 

[davidjoe]

MOST ACCURATE BULLET IN THE WORLD

I was just thinking some of the most accurate bullets in the world will be on the line this fall in SC So if you are someone who thought that silvertip and their abilities were up to the challenge that would be a good place to make a splash! I'll bring my 6.5PRC with the Hellfire brake. They...

forum.accurateshooter.com

Johara1 and his opinion of the 110 Atip. I believe he was one of the most accomplished shooters on the board. Do a search about his opinion on the Atip, he did not agree with the assessment that are "match bullets" at all.

BTW, Johara1 was the guy that Cortina was asking for HIS opinion...

He was also the guy that revealed the fact that the "automated" Vapor Trails are made by Hornady (also considered a "match" bullet I would guess).

The 110 A-Tip shot the highest score today, at 600, at my club midrange match. There were no clean scores shot, and this was the sole 199 in tricky conditions. I’m proud to claim it as my own, and I tried as hard as if it was the December championship.

I have had only positive experiences with the 110 A-Tip. I shoot it out of a .243 using Lapua brass, and several powders work very well.

The 110 A-Tip at the velocities I shoot it is right on the edge of being a viable 1,000 yard F-Open alternative in many range conditions.

Don’t have the desire to rub a dozen genie bottles in the age of scarce components? Rub this one!

 

[whatsupdoc]

Funny thread with lots of Hornady bashing, some deserved some not. I use Hornady bullets and they shoot fine, are they Bergers no but for the price and availability Hornady makes an outstanding bullet.

The claims that Hornady cannot make a match bullet or a bullet that compares with Bergers is ridiculous and maybe one day they will. Hornady as a company is there to market and sell their product to make a profit and it appears that they are very very good at it.