Scope leveling concern

[browningwgm]

I've had a rifle sitting in the back of my safe for a while. I purchased a 1 piece rail (0 MOA made by EGW) and mounted it when I first bought the rifle. I've never fired the rifle.

I've finally gotten around to buying a scope for it.

I'm using the Wheeler scope leveling tool to mount the scope.

First thing I noticed was when I mounted the rings to the base, the level wasn't equal at the rear and front of the rail. It's off quite a bit. I pulled the rail off the gun and checked level on a flat surface and it's equal at the front and back. Seems like it might be being twisted when mounted to the gun.

Here's a couple photos showing what I'm seeing. Is this something to worry about? Thanks.

 

[46and2]

I've had a rifle sitting in the back of my safe for a while. I purchased a 1 piece rail (0 MOA made by EGW) and mounted it when I first bought the rifle. I've never fired the rifle.

I've finally gotten around to buying a scope for it.

I'm using the Wheeler scope leveling tool to mount the scope.

First thing I noticed was when I mounted the rings to the base, the level wasn't equal at the rear and front of the rail. It's off quite a bit. I pulled the rail off the gun and checked level on a flat surface and it's equal at the front and back. Seems like it might be being twisted when mounted to the gun.

Here's a couple photos showing what I'm seeing. Is this something to worry about? Thanks.

This is the exact reason I stress free bed one piece rails. Use Devcon 10110 or MarineTex.
Also the exact reason I lap every pair of scope rings that aren't Burris Signature rings.

 

[drop_point]

The only thing that matters is that the reticle is level with the earth when you fire. If you have a strong concern, put a scope-mounted bubble-level on the tube and set the reticle level with a plumb bob and make them match.

 

[jpx2rk]

I try to get the action as level as possible with the Wheeler levels, (in a rest/bags, etc) and mount the scope in the rings, then use a plumb bob string at 50 yds to level the CH's, and snug the rings down. I check the level of the action and CH's while I am snugging down the ring screws. Just my method.

 

[browningwgm]

This is the exact reason I stress free bed one piece rails. Use Devcon 10110 or MarineTex.
Also the exact reason I lap every pair of scope rings that aren't Burris Signature rings.

Thanks, unfortunately I don’t have the skill to do any bedding. I’m going to try another base.

 

[wildcatter]

Thanks, unfortunately I don’t have the skill to do any bedding. I’m going to try another base.

Bedding compound and scope base threads are a bad idea, it's just asking for problems! A plumb bob, and centering the bore to the scope is 100% positive. The farther you can hang it for confirmation is better, then keep your vertical hair dead on it/ You can't get better than that!

 

[46and2]

Thanks, unfortunately I don’t have the skill to do any bedding. I’m going to try another base.

That's ok, the reason it's important to have a stress free base is those tiny #6 screws will be under stress! Under so many recoil cycles very bad things can happen to those tiny screws. ( ask me how I know).

Kiwi neutral shoe polish on the base screws and action for a release agent.

You can try a new base. If that doesn't work, I'd suggest getting a set of Burris Signature rings with the self aligning inserts. They'll minimize stress on the scope, rings, fasteners and action.

 

[browningwgm]

You can try a new base. If that doesn't work, I'd suggest getting a set of Burris Signature rings with the self aligning inserts. They'll minimize stress on the scope, rings, fasteners and action.

I appreciate the assistance. If the new base doesn’t help I’m going to get a set of Burris rings with inserts.

 

[boltfluter]

Thanks, unfortunately I don’t have the skill to do any bedding. I’m going to try another base.

If the base is flat and not bowed the base is not the problem, it's a receiver problem. Another base will not fix the problem. Time to get some professional help on this one. This is a very simple bedding job if you are so inclined to learn.
Paul

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

Since you seem to be leaning towards trying a different base, pull this one off. Put it on a flat surface and repeat the level check. A change in the levels tells you the receiver is the issue, if the base is still warped EGW will probably just send you a new one. If you go the Burris ring route, take the time(ammo) to zero with the inserts.

 

[Redd]

BTW .....ALWAYS check the 'level' you're using! had one of the exact bubble levels you're using and it was off by almost half! I had to recalibrate it to a 4 ft carpenter's level that was verified true. If you look closely at the bubble level there are two set screws located on the base. These can be adjusted to "correct" for level!!!

 

[browningwgm]

Since you seem to be leaning towards trying a different base, pull this one off. Put it on a flat surface and repeat the level check. A change in the levels tells you the receiver is the issue, if the base is still warped EGW will probably just send you a new one. If you go the Burris ring route, take the time(ammo) to zero with the inserts.

The base is fine when checked off the rifle & on a flat surface. I can remove the front two screws and the base levels up. So, obviously even though there’s no visible gap at the front there must be one because it’s when I install the front screws it goes out of level. Would placing a shim under the front be an acceptable fix? I have a Starrett shim kit that goes down to .001. This is a hunting rifle, 400 yards max.

EGW is sending a new one for me to try.

 

[browningwgm]

BTW .....ALWAYS check the 'level' you're using! had one of the exact bubble levels you're using and it was off by almost half! I had to recalibrate it to a 4 ft carpenter's level that was verified true. If you look closely at the bubble level there are two set screws located on the base. These can be adjusted to "correct" for level!!!

I‘ll do this, thanks for the advice. I have a 4‘ level.

 

[wildcatter]

Checking any level is as easy as reversing 180 degrees, no mater what surface you use, it is either on when you turn it end to end, meaning it's good if the surface is out of level it will be out the same when tuned end to end (+80 degree).

Anytime a level is off a different amount when turning end to end, the correct reading would be half the differance. You don't need another level to check or calibrate a level. You just need the same surface to check or calibrate it with, any level good or bad will tell you when it's level using this proper method of calibrating and checking.

This is also the only method to tell if your good level is lying or not, no need to use a level to level a level. And the same method is used to check a plumb buble, end to end, never change surface side to surface side, that is not testing the Buble, when testing your plumb bubble you use the same surface of the level up to down, then turning down to up reading the same buble.

 

[powderbrake]

What Wildcatter said. It is the correct method of checking a level.

 

[pdog06]

Sounds like either the scope base or the action has the scope base screws drilled slightly off center?
Either that or the action is warped. Have you or anyone else swapped barrels on that action?

 

[CSLR grandpa]

Browningwgm good morning screw the front of base to the rifle, shim the rear, cut your shims to fit under the base, locktite.
If you don’t like the looks bed it with shim in place, Brownells sells shim kits for different actions.
Shimming, bedding, lapping ( remove high spots only) all have their place on a hunting rifle.
CSL grandpa

 

[AlNyhus]

What action is this?

 

[AlNyhus]

Bedding compound and scope base threads are a bad idea, it's just asking for problems!

I've been bedding scope bases to correct receiver issues and provide for stress free scope mounting for a couple decades. A stress free mounting system pays off in many ways and correctly fitting bases are where you start.

Good shootin' -Al

 

[wildcatter]

I've been bedding scope bases to correct receiver issues and provide for stress free scope mounting for a couple decades. A stress free mounting system pays off in many ways and correctly fitting bases are where you start.

Good shootin' -Al

No doubt Al, I prefer to have .ine fixed and machined properly, I don't like using bandaid. Or less than permanent fixes.

My issue with this type of bandaid, (something used to cover up improper machining) is how most people comprehend it, and the inferior materials most use to accomplish it. Compounded with the ease at which any of the bedding compound can contaminate the precious space in the female thread space and creat even greater problems.

I have never built a rifle and asked my Smith to cut such a corner. But I can see how protecting the holes with the female threads, and using a proper compound, to do no more than fill a void, with full contact where possible could make a temporary repair.

But in all honesty, if buying such a hacked action, I would walk! I know some benchrest shooters that believe in it, but I know way more that would pay a gunsmith qualified to correct the issue, and make it a perfect permanent fix.

Lastly, the older I get the more ghost I have involved in affecting my accuracy. I just refuse to include glue into my variables of figuring out why, when accuracy isn't up to my expectations.