• This Forum is for adults 18 years of age or over. By continuing to use this Forum you are confirming that you are 18 or older. No content shall be viewed by any person under 18 in California.

Anyone else get irritated with Federals Primer packaging?

Quote from fguffey:
"I like the primers setting on their sides. "

I have to ask WHY?
 
M-61 said:
Quote from fguffey:
"I like the primers setting on their sides. "

I have to ask WHY?

a reloader/shooter was in the bad habit of carrying his loaded ammo to the range in baggies. One day he drobed a bag, one of the primers struck the rim of another case, when the primer went off it pushed off from the case and hit the shooter in the inside of his leg. They say he almost bled to death before they could stop the bleeding.

If the primers are on their edge the primer can not push itself off, the blast is contained and the primer stays in the package.

F. Guffey
 
fguffey said:
M-61 said:
Quote from fguffey:
"I like the primers setting on their sides. "

I have to ask WHY?

a reloader/shooter was in the bad habit of carrying his loaded ammo to the range in baggies. One day he drobed a bag, one of the primers struck the rim of another case, when the primer went off it pushed off from the case and hit the shooter in the inside of his leg. They say he almost bled to death before they could stop the bleeding.

If the primers are on their edge the primer can not push itself off, the blast is contained and the primer stays in the package.

F. Guffey


That doesn't make sense.. Not sayin it didn't happen, but I'd have to see it. I have experience with discharging ammo that is loose and not in a chamber. Every time the bullet doesn't go far and the case takes off..
 
That doesn't make sense..

I have R. Lee's book on modern reloading. I have read the book, he said he did not test Federal primers. Other parts of the book on primers, R. Lee checked the speed of primers leaving the primer pocket, he had them leaving at about 600 fps. The primers pushed off of the case, the case had a bullet and powder. The victim was a shooter/writer for shooting magazines.

F. Guffey
 
fguffey said:
Then there was that story about a FedX driver blowing his tail gate off, I do not believe that happened.

Funny, I heard it was an airplane crash caused by Federal Primers that caused them to change their packaging.

I guess it just depends on which gun shop you go to.
 
amlevin said:
fguffey said:
Then there was that story about a FedX driver blowing his tail gate off, I do not believe that happened.

Funny, I heard it was an airplane crash caused by Federal Primers that caused them to change their packaging.

I guess it just depends on which gun shop you go to.

I would have had to say 'FANTASTIC', then added the part about 'flying low' because primers are shipped ground only.

F. Guffey
 
zillla said:
fguffey said:
M-61 said:
Quote from fguffey:
"I like the primers setting on their sides. "

I have to ask WHY?

a reloader/shooter was in the bad habit of carrying his loaded ammo to the range in baggies. One day he drobed a bag, one of the primers struck the rim of another case, when the primer went off it pushed off from the case and hit the shooter in the inside of his leg. They say he almost bled to death before they could stop the bleeding.

If the primers are on their edge the primer can not push itself off, the blast is contained and the primer stays in the package.

F. Guffey


That doesn't make sense.. Not sayin it didn't happen, but I'd have to see it. I have experience with discharging ammo that is loose and not in a chamber. Every time the bullet doesn't go far and the case takes off..
I know a guy that that was showing his anealer to another guy. The case he annealed a couple of times and his anealer dumps the cases out when done. It was laying on the counter and went off. The case went across the room and the primer went into his abdomen. He went to the hospital and they x-rayed him and said they wouldn't remove it. They said they would do more damage trying to find it and it would heal and cause no problems. I think the problem with the Federal Primers was because a forklift driver ran over a case and set them off. They made them use the current holders to transport after that. Matt
 
Nevertheless, Lee Precision still carries warnings about the dangers of primers despite the redesign of their tools. Though they don't specify brands these days, it seems evident who they're talking about:

The packaging in which the primers are shipped seems to have a direct correlation to the probability of mass detonation. The larger the shipping package, the more likely a mass detonation could occur.

http://leeprecision.com/cgi-data/instruct/90250.pdf

http://leeprecision.com/cgi-data/instruct/PT1204.pdf
 
JohnKielly said:
Nevertheless, Lee Precision still carries warnings about the dangers of primers despite the redesign of their tools. Though they don't specify brands these days, it seems evident who they're talking about:

The packaging in which the primers are shipped seems to have a direct correlation to the probability of mass detonation. The larger the shipping package, the more likely a mass detonation could occur.

http://leeprecision.com/cgi-data/instruct/90250.pdf

http://leeprecision.com/cgi-data/instruct/PT1204.pdf

Funny thing is that ONLY Lee puts out those warnings. I wonder how much of that is R. Lee's personal issue with Federal. Maybe they ignored him once and he's carried a chip on his shoulder since then.
 
The packaging in which the primers are shipped seems to have a direct correlation to the probability of mass detonation. The larger the shipping package, the more likely a mass detonation could occur.

More dangerous, that is what I was looking for, if the primers are more dangerous they are more powerful. Deductive reasoning?

Funny thing is that ONLY Lee puts out those warnings. I wonder how much of that is R. Lee's personal issue with Federal. Maybe they ignored him once and he's carried a chip on his shoulder since then.

Federal did not donate primers to be tested, R. Lee made that very clear. He also made it very clear he did not test Federal primers.

F. Guffey
 
Reminds me of the battle between Lee and Speer a few years ago. Lee advertised their Factory Crimp Die for rifle cartridges produced more accurate handloads. Speer began a campaign ad shortly thereafter stating not to use Lee's Factory Crimp Die on their bullets that don't have a cannelure. Heck, if reloading manufacturers can't even agree on proper reloading methods, how could one ever expect agreement from the hordes of keyboard shooters. ::)
 
Heck, if reloading manufacturers can't even agree on proper reloading methods, how could one ever expect agreement from the hordes of keyboard shooters.

I have Lee factory crimp dies, I do not use them but JIC*.

*JIC: Just in case.

If not for Federal primers in big boxes I would be out of primers.

F. Guffey
 
Just one more, Snert. Back in my younger days a couple of beers gave me the courage to put a CCI 200 on the heating coil of our kitchen stove. My wife was not home to supervise me. I hit the dial and ran for cover. Seconds later the stove hood had a little dent on it from the inside. Extreme speed anvil, ya see. We're talking avocado 70's color. She never noticed it. ;)
 
bobm said:
Just one more, Snert. Back in my younger days a couple of beers gave me the courage to put a CCI 200 on the heating coil of our kitchen stove. My wife was not home to supervise me. I hit the dial and ran for cover. Seconds later the stove hood had a little dent on it from the inside. Extreme speed anvil, ya see. We're talking avocado 70's color. She never noticed it. ;)
\

Finally got a post here that was worth reading!!! LOL! That avacado color made we want to blow things up too!
 
I always heard R. Lee had a dispute with Federal and boycotted their primers.


If all I have to complain about is packaging, then my problems of bullet's true BCs and lot to lot consistency of bullets and powder, and my wife saying my hobby is too expensive. Are gone!!!!

I just hate the tape used on Hornady bullet boxes, so I'm switching!!!!! Not....
 
I'm always amused that some people seem to be prepared to accept conspiracy theories rather than fact. Consider these facts:

Lee once warned against certain specific primer types, but now, since they have installed an isolating mechanism into their primer seaters, has softened their warning to state that the relative risk of priming tray content detonating directly relates to the complexity of packaging.

Federal claims that their primers have a different igniting compound to other common brands and are packaged individually isolated according to government hazard requirements. We all know that other brands aren't subject to that requirement.

RCBS's hand tool has for a considerable time included an isolating mechanism. Their internet listing states: The safety gate isolates the primer seating operation from the primer supply to reduce the risk of tray detonation. The removable primer tray orients their primers for use and will fit any manufacturer’s primer packaging.

Seems to me both parties are conceding the same thing but applying their own spin to it & that it is universally acknowledged that primers can chain fire under certain circumstances. Google the web for some time & you will find individual instances of Federal primers chain firing. I don't know if you'll find instances from other brands. I didn't do that search.
 
Lee once warned against certain specific primer types, but now, since they have installed an isolating mechanism into their primer seaters, has softened their warning to state that the relative risk of priming tray content detonating directly relates to the complexity of packaging.

The equipment manufactured before 'the new gage' is still out there. Then it is possible Lee read Mr. R. Lee's book on modern reloading. Reloaders assume R. Lee tested Federal primers, Federal did not donate primers to be tested, R. Lee refused to purchase Federal primers.

I'm always amused that some people seem to be prepared to accept....

I am not amused but there are many that can not discern fact from fiction, truth from nonsense.

F. Guffey
 
LHSmith said:
Speer began a campaign ad shortly thereafter stating not to use Lee's Factory Crimp Die on their bullets that don't have a cannelure. Heck, if reloading manufacturers can't even agree on proper reloading methods, how could one ever expect agreement from the hordes of keyboard shooters. ::)

What's so hard to understand about Speer's warning? If you crimp a bullet without a cannelure you run the risk of compressing the core and the jacket springing back slightly leaving a void. Result? An unbalanced bullet that definitely won't be accurate.

Crimping is for cannelures or to merely push the case mouth back against the bullet if it was flared.
 

Upgrades & Donations

This Forum's expenses are primarily paid by member contributions. You can upgrade your Forum membership in seconds. Gold and Silver members get unlimited FREE classifieds for one year. Gold members can upload custom avatars.


Click Upgrade Membership Button ABOVE to get Gold or Silver Status.

You can also donate any amount, large or small, with the button below. Include your Forum Name in the PayPal Notes field.


To DONATE by CHECK, or make a recurring donation, CLICK HERE to learn how.

Forum statistics

Threads
166,262
Messages
2,215,146
Members
79,506
Latest member
Hunt99elk
Back
Top