Small Town Citizen Militia

[Depart123]

I strongly disagree that destruction of property is cause for ending human life. Way too many historical examples of how that reality plays out for the citizenry. I know of another government that enacted a similar policy that resulted in a quite famous incident in Tiananmen Square. Do we want our government to behave similarly to communist dictatorships?

You are correct that the government doing this would have negative consequences.

Refusing to prosecute the citizenry for protecting their own property with deadly force however, would have better effect and put the power and responsibility where it ultimately belongs... With the citizens themselves.

 

[Papa Charlie]

The 2nd amendment aint about hunting or defending yourself. do you think you had to ask the govt permission to fight off Indians if they attacked you? The 2nd is not about being on the defensive but to take the offense against tyrants in govt and to displace them .

Maybe you should read a little more.

 

[Ned Ludd]

I strongly disagree that destruction of property is cause for ending human life. Way too many historical examples of how that reality plays out for the citizenry. I know of another government that enacted a similar policy that resulted in a quite famous incident in Tiananmen Square. Do we want our government to behave similarly to communist dictatorships?

The reason to use deadly force is not the destruction of property itself, it's the threat to the person's own life that often occurs as the property is being destroyed, especially if they try to defend their property. No one is advocating for law enforcement or the military to start hosing down these rioters and looters with .50 cal machine guns. However, if an individual is not willing to use deadly force to protect their own life then what? They just run away and leave their stuff whenever it, or they are threatened?

Where does that kind of thinking stop? It only stops when you're ready to do as you're told, hand over whatever they want, do any trick they order you to do. No thanks. I'd much rather have citizens of a local neighborhood, small town, or even a large city, standing shoulder-to-shoulder, armed to the teeth and stating with a single voice, "Not in our neighborhood". If violence comes after that point, well, they were warned.

 

[Papa Charlie]

The reason to use deadly force is not the destruction of property itself, it's the threat to the person's own life that often occurs as the property is being destroyed, especially if they try to defend their property. No one is advocating for law enforcement or the military to start hosing down these rioters and looters with .50 cal machine guns. However, if an individual is not willing to use deadly force to protect their own life then what? They just run away and leave their stuff whenever it or they are threatened?

Where does that kind of thinking stop? It only stops when you're ready to do as you're told, hand over whatever they want, do any trick they order you to do. No thanks. I'd much rather have citizens of a local neighborhood, small town, or even a large city, standing shoulder-to-shoulder, armed to the teeth and stating with a single voice, "Not in our neighborhood". If violence comes after that point, well, they were warned.

Well said!

When citizens do stand together and say "Not in our neighborhood", generally speaking, like in Klamath Falls, these thugs will back down. They are nothing more than bullies and as such cowards without you backing down and while they are in groups.

 

[Steve Ladino]

Coeur D’Alene,Idaho had a similar experience couple days ago. ARs on 16”centers up and down the streets. Turned out pretty peaceful and VERY polite.
These folks are very well funded and I have an inkling suspicion that violence and unrest are the goals. Not necessarily anything else. So remember to keep it legal, polite and non-violent through the legal show of a defensive demeanor

You cant use an AR but maybe an old hickory on 16 " centers would work as well.

 

[USMCDOC]

Just saw this article..

https://nypost.com/2020/06/01/florida-police-chief-encourages-residents-to-shoot-looters/

 

[JEFFPPC]

You cant use an AR but maybe an old hickory on 16 " centers would work as well.

Well., if the other guy brought Sam your in trouble. You remember Sam Colt I am sure.

 

[Ccrider]

I knew it was going to be an unpopular opinion around these parts, but I stand by it. We all live by the order of the law and rioters and looters should be arrested and sentenced in court. That's different than someone exacting retribution in the form of murder for the destruction of their property.

Just saw this article..

https://nypost.com/2020/06/01/florida-police-chief-encourages-residents-to-shoot-looters/

Very clear statement. Should be law enforcement’s message generally.

The problem is that some people want to use this opportunity for other than protecting their property or making a much needed statement condemning police brutality and demanding proper vetting of law enforcement employees.
These fanatics are on both sides and are dangerous.

 

[JEFFPPC]

It is a felony to cross state lines to commit crimes, and funding that activity. Many in these groups are using stolen vehicles/plates, observe and document and forward to law enforcement(FBI and local). The citizens of this country deserve and should expect peaceful protest, that includes NOT interfering with traffic and commerce.

Looking at the last 11 yrs of our national history how do you think that is working out? NOT TO WELL! Better wear your big boy britches or bend over and drop em. We are at put up or shut up time I believe. Sad but it's the facts. Prissy boys, go home to momma.

 

[jonbearman]

God Bless your wonderful town. They stood up to a bunch of idiots who think they can topple our country. They are communists and they are a facists not us.This has to stop and let the court fix the problem. Peaceful protest is our right but stealing and destruction is an insurrection and has no place in a civilized society. Did these fools think about what they did to the poor people who have no stores to go to as most will leave the area for good. They are hurting themselves. Like Marx was quoted he called Antifa and the like useful idiots.

 

[JEFFPPC]

The reason to use deadly force is not the destruction of property itself, it's the threat to the person's own life that often occurs as the property is being destroyed, especially if they try to defend their property. No one is advocating for law enforcement or the military to start hosing down these rioters and looters with .50 cal machine guns. However, if an individual is not willing to use deadly force to protect their own life then what? They just run away and leave their stuff whenever it, or they are threatened?

Where does that kind of thinking stop? It only stops when you're ready to do as you're told, hand over whatever they want, do any trick they order you to do. No thanks. I'd much rather have citizens of a local neighborhood, small town, or even a large city, standing shoulder-to-shoulder, armed to the teeth and stating with a single voice, "Not in our neighborhood". If violence comes after that point, well, they were warned.

I agree with most of your statement. But if back in Los Angeles riots years ago the first wave down the street had had a hosing as you put it, think how many lives plus billions in property damage would have been saved since then. It would have passed the message , a riot will be dealt with accordingly. Peaceful assembly and a parade wonderful, its what our Republic is about. Rioting and destruction, WHATEVER force is needed to end it, immediately. Now all the citizens who pay taxes and obey the law will get a greater tax burden to rebuild the destruction.

 

[338 Mollett]

There are some things born of all of this that really upset me.....1)The rampant life long thugs under certain conditions are free to do what they want. ....2) Common peace loving law abiding citizens are shown our government is not in control....3) The police know nobody has their back. Certain elements of our government are milking this for all they can get .You talk about a cocktail for disaster we are looking at a perfect storm !

 

[SPQR70AD]

Maybe you should read a little more.

the communist manifesto? tell me in what book I will find that before the 2nd amendment a pioneer had to ask the govt for permission to fight Indians after he was attacked

 

[Bamban]

I have yet to see proof of a massacre in Tiananmen sq. have you seen pics of piles of dead bodies? I did see the NG shoot a bunch of college hippies

I have, when I lived in China for 4 years working for the company. I also saw pictures of the whole street on the right side of TS as you face The Forbidden City lined up with burned out APCs, trucks, and a handful of tanks.

You will never see any news from China that they deemed not to the best interest of the state. The same way you will never know how many people died there from the pandemic. There are no bad news from China.

 

[Evan]

So Evan what is your suggestion to this scenario?

I think what the folks in your town did was a great way to handle it. Coming together to show a unified front in the face of rioting and looting is admirable and it prevented the whole disaster before it happened. Nowhere in that story did somebody shoot someone else for breaking their windows and stealing their merchandise.

im pretty sure there is a law that says you can protect life and property not just life

I don't know for sure, and it is probably a little different for different jurisdictions. Castle Doctrine isn't universal in this country. I don't want to make a lawyer rich trying to keep me out of prison for "misinterpreting" my rights under the law.

So I gather that you would not shoot someone breaking into your home, to do whatever crime they have intent to do. How fast to you think calling 911 and waiting for the authorities to do something would take in your neighborhood and for them to come and take care of the criminals ? What will you be doing in the meantime ? And how safe will your family members while you wait ?

That's a way different scenario than me sitting in my shop, well after closing hours with a gun, waiting to shoot the first guy to break my window. That's the kind of action that will need a lawyer to explain because that's not the same thing as self defense during a home invasion.

with all the mayhem destruction fires looting the cops found time to arrest him. think of that.

Agreed. Entirely. More often than not this is the story I read or hear: Man shot intruder/burglar, man now arrested and spending every penny on lawyer to keep him out of prison. Man now also has to fight civil suit brought by intruder's family. If I'm the only one shooting then, at least where I live, it's got to be a clear case of self defense. Shooting a guy with a can of gas and a lighter in front of my shop at midnight is going to take a lawyer to help explain, even if there was a riot and looting going on that evening.

The reason to use deadly force is not the destruction of property itself, it's the threat to the person's own life that often occurs as the property is being destroyed, especially if they try to defend their property.

We are in agreement here, as I said above, with the clarification that the threat to the individual has to be very real, unless they want some lawyers to get rich. Smash and grab looting is not the same as home invasion and arson. If I shoot a guy stealing something from my shop, and he happens to be entirely unarmed, I should be ready for the police to treat me like a murderer. And if I happen to be a minority or still have my gun near me when they show up, I will likely die as they "attempt to take me into custody" - which is the real reason for these protests before a bunch of opportunists decided to cause some mayhem.

 

[Ned Ludd]

We are in agreement here, as I said above, with the clarification that the threat to the individual has to be very real, unless they want some lawyers to get rich. Smash and grab looting is not the same as home invasion and arson. If I shoot a guy stealing something from my shop, and he happens to be entirely unarmed, I should be ready for the police to treat me like a murderer. And if I happen to be a minority or still have my gun near me when they show up, I will likely die as they "attempt to take me into custody" - which is the real reason for these protests before a bunch of opportunists decided to cause some mayhem.

The problem here is not simply opportunists that decided to cause some mayhem. It is that the looting and riots are planned events. Don't you doubt it for a second. The number of individuals involved in both peaceful protest and the looting/riots represent a tiny fraction of 1% of the entire population of this country. Yet they are using violence and lawlessness as a means to try to make you believe what they believe, or at a minimum, to keep you quiet while they change this country into something it has never been, and was never meant to be. Everyone is free to decide for themselves what response they deem to be appropriate in a situation like this. Unfortunately, if too many people decide our way of life is not worth fighting for, it will be over very soon. They will not ever stop.

 

[Evan]

The problem here is not simply opportunists that decided to cause some mayhem. It is that the looting and riots are planned events. Don't you doubt it for a second. The number of individuals involved in both peaceful protest and the looting/riots represent a tiny fraction of 1% of the entire population of this country. Yet they are using violence and lawlessness as a means to try to make you believe what they believe, or at a minimum, to keep you quiet while they change this country into something it has never been, and was never meant to be. Everyone is free to decide for themselves what response they deem to be appropriate in a situation like this. Unfortunately, if too many people decide our way of life is not worth fighting for, it will be over very soon. They will not ever stop.

The looting and riots are planned events by opportunists that needed a real protest to act off of for their agenda. They are a very small percentage of the population and they are terrorists. The larger population can and should stand up to these groups as in Klamath to stop them. That takes organized preemptive action, not reactionary violence. If we let them start a riot and then shoot them, they've won - that's a key piece of their agenda: to make us the murderous bad guys.

 

[JEFFPPC]

The problem here is not simply opportunists that decided to cause some mayhem. It is that the looting and riots are planned events. Don't you doubt it for a second. The number of individuals involved in both peaceful protest and the looting/riots represent a tiny fraction of 1% of the entire population of this country. Yet they are using violence and lawlessness as a means to try to make you believe what they believe, or at a minimum, to keep you quiet while they change this country into something it has never been, and was never meant to be. Everyone is free to decide for themselves what response they deem to be appropriate in a situation like this. Unfortunately, if too many people decide our way of life is not worth fighting for, it will be over very soon. They will not ever stop.

You are 100 % correct. Our state and national politicians have shown they either A; support what is happening because they want to change our form of govt and are using the unrest to do it , or B;Do not have the political will or guts to do it(Sounds a lot like the Republicans). So the other problem is too many who know what is right and wrong just want to pacify and hope thins will get better....dream on. I was surprised to learn the .bulk of antifa members are young white males. But since they have been indicrinated for the most part with 12 to 16 years of ultra liberal education.....what can you expect.

 

[JEFFPPC]

The looting and riots are planned events by opportunists that needed a real protest to act off of for their agenda. They are a very small percentage of the population and they are terrorists. The larger population can and should stand up to these groups as in Klamath to stop them. That takes organized preemptive action, not reactionary violence. If we let them start a riot and then shoot them, they've won - that's a key piece of their agenda: to make us the murderous bad guys.

Evan, what will you do when one stands in your driveway with a bottle of gasoline and flips his Bic? Better decide ahead of time.It's getting closer.

 

[Rich Lee]

these assholes looting and burning buildings don't give a dam about the guy killed in min. its just an excuse to act stupid and if the law did shoot some of them they might get their head out of their ass. As far as im concerned if they try to burn down somebodys buisnes they deserve to be shot. Somebody said destruction of property dosent warrant taking a life. Come into my house and start acting stupid and see how long you live.I praise the people that have enough guts to stand up to these low life assholes that don't have anything else to do but act stupid.What the milatary should do is have tanks setting in town where Antifa comes in on busses and open fire on their bus and I guarantee they couldent pay anybody enough to get on an Antifa bus.