Winchester brass....

[Cecil S.]

I'm as cheap as they come. Dents and minor dings don't bother me. The last few bags of Win brass I purchased was horrible. Crooked as a crankshaft and base to Datum short. They don't give a hoot about us out here they just want to sell loaded ammo to the blasters. And, their primers have gotten out of spec also. I pick up range brass to look at it. Some of it the primers have fallen out and the bulge on the case above the web tells me that's what they are putting out.

The "BLASTERS".......LMAO..........sad but true. I would rather hit what I am shooting at than just hear BOOM. Just my opinion.

 

[SheepDog]

Winchester used to be my "go to" brass but I suppose the wear is showing on their equipment since the 70s. I am still shooting 3006 brass from that time. Maybe the can't afford to by new dies because I haven't needed to buy more brass.

 

[joshb]

I purchased 50 6.5 Creed PALMA. Small primer is where I want to get to. Looks good and the price was......well.....did I mention "Cheapskate"....LOL

I was happy to find the small primer option on the Creedmore brass. Nice going, Peterson!

 

[Cecil S.]

I just hate the way companies will push JUNK on us consumers. All in the name of some "Bean Counter" crunching the numbers. If the consumer stops buying said product the "Bean Counter" no longer has a job! We here in the USA have the ability to produce the absolute best product out there , BAR NONE. I am an AMERICAN and will support a good American product first......Sorry.....Ok I am done.....Ken Sommerville

 

[bobinpa]

When Winchester came in the blue/white bags it seemed ok. I'm not saying that it was like Lapua, but it was usable. I used it a lot in my 300WSM and never had any major issues, now the stuff that comes in the red/black bag is another story. I haven't used much of it but it is definitely different than the older stuff.

 

[Cecil S.]

I dont wish to jack this thread but I plan to use the Peterson small primer brass with the 147gr ELD and RL26. I am a newbie but all the reading I have done supports this might be good. I just based this on our current problem with powder. I do have a good stock of Berger 140 VLDs but the 147s might help when the wind gets up. Ken Sommerville

 

[Brians356]

For us "Cheapskate" minded Peterson Brass and it is made in the USA......just saying.

Peterson doesn't make 6mm Rem. Or 7x57mm to form it from.

For mid-grade (step up from WW and Rem, but < $1 each) Hornady is the only choice for 6mm Rem. Or Prvi Partizan 7x57mm and form it down.
-

 

[Brians356]

I picked up my Winchester brand 6mm Rem cases from Cabela's yesterday. They were what I expected, worse than the last time I bought WW.

For starters, each 50-ct bag contained exactly 51 cases. So, at least I wasn't outright shorted like a Lapua buyer recently. Secondly, they all have more or less out of round case mouths (or worse for culls, see below), as expected.

Out of the 102 cases, 5 were outright destroyed and beyond salvage, 4 others were dented either on the shoulder or case mouth to the point I will set them aside, but they could probably be salvaged. And 2 more had small dents on the shoulder but not bad enough to cull them. That's a total of 9 culls (plus 2 of which I will probably use, but someone else might reject.)

Of the remaining 91 cases, there were several which were tarnished all over the outside, as if they had been handled with sweaty hands and sat around for a few weeks, i.e. they look like cases which have been in use for a while and never tumbled. There were a couple more with slight scuffing on the outside of the case.

If I rejected all but the bright, shiny cases with no dents, scratches, or tarnish (just needing necks rounded out) there are probably 85 "fine" cases in the 102. From what I've seen of new Hornady brass (270 Win), there would likely be 95 or more "fine" cases. But Hornady is 50% more expensive, so the net cost per case of WW is still a lot lower. You pays yer money ...

I will add some photos of bad cases tonight, one in particular is pretty comical.
-

 

[Rsadams]

I picked up my Winchester brand 6mm Rem cases from Cabela's yesterday. They were what I expected, worse than the last time I bought WW.

For starters, each 50-ct bag contained exactly 51 cases. So, at least I wasn't outright shorted like a Lapua buyer recently. Secondly, they all have more or less out of round case mouths (or worse for culls, see below), as expected.

Out of the 102 cases, 5 were outright destroyed and beyond salvage, 4 others were dented either on the shoulder or case mouth to the point I will set them aside, but they could probably be salvaged. And 2 more had small dents on the shoulder but not bad enough to cull them. That's a total of 9 culls (plus 2 of which I will probably use, but someone else might reject.)

Of the remaining 91 cases, there were several which were tarnished all over the outside, as if they had been handled with sweaty hands and sat around for a few weeks, i.e. they look like cases which have been in use for a while and never tumbled. There were a couple more with slight scuffing on the outside of the case.

If I rejected all but the bright, shiny cases with no dents, scratches, or tarnish (just needing necks rounded out) there are probably 85 "fine" cases in the 102. From what I've seen of new Hornady brass (270 Win), there would likely be 95 or more "fine" cases. But Hornady is 50% more expensive, so the net cost per case of WW is still a lot lower. You pays yer money ...

I will add some photos of bad cases tonight, one in particular is pretty comical.
-

Ya that's what I found also...... I just thought they should be better... Ya they are not high dollar but some are pathetic for new. Some of mine the finish is like they were rolled on concrete... After checking just a few from head to datum they will have to stretch .008 just to fit the chamber I have never measured any factory that short.. I guess after shooting them they will be ok?

 

[onelastshot]

Hornady currently makes 6mm Rem, but it's 50% more expensive than Winchester. Fewer culls and better shape overall, though, probably.
-

Actually, no. My last purchase of Hornady brass a few months ago was my last. THe bag was loaded with dented cartridges, out of round necks and pockets. In general the bag was a mess, even after doing my best to clean them up I still ended up throwing 10% of the brass away. I contacted Hornady and their basic response was to send them the bad pieces and they would replace them. I want brass from the same lot, no a mismatched configuration of different pieces. More than one reloader has stated that Hornady brass is too soft which results in premature loose primer pockets and even brass separation. The cost for me to ship the damaged brass to Hornady would offset any benefit of the replacement brass they offered. It was obvious from the tone of Hornady's agent they really weren't interested in customer satisfaction. His apathy was obvious.

I've maid the decision to refrain from future purchases of Hornady products. Too many reports from other customers of substandard products, bullets that simply didn't perform and a company that really wasn't interested in backing their product or keeping customer satisfaction. The only reason is can see that Hornady products sell is their pricing. Their brass and bullets are typically the least expensive. Norma brass is twice the price but three times the quality.

 

[Rsadams]

They don't get it.. By the time you ship something back spend the money on shipping and for people like me , that also includes driving into town 20 mile round trip and WAIT... Which I didn't want to do in the first place that's why I paid more and bought local I could have just gotten better brass or whatever... When you call a company that wants to keep customers they should just mail you the product with a shipping label to return the defective crap.. Your not the first to contact Hornady or Winchester over this they just hope you will forget about it because it's to much trouble. Of course none of this will help with wanting one lot number product...

 

[Brians356]

After checking just a few from head to datum they will have to stretch .008 just to fit the chamber I have never measured any factory that short.. I guess after shooting them they will be ok?

Yes, they are typical for headspace. It's quite common for shoulders of raw cases to move forward .008" on fireforming. And that's well within SAAMMI spec (Max Chamber minus Min Cartridge at datum is typically .010" or more.)
-

 

[JRS]

Actually, no. My last purchase of Hornady brass a few months ago was my last. THe bag was loaded with dented cartridges, out of round necks and pockets. In general the bag was a mess, even after doing my best to clean them up I still ended up throwing 10% of the brass away. I contacted Hornady and their basic response was to send them the bad pieces and they would replace them. I want brass from the same lot, no a mismatched configuration of different pieces. More than one reloader has stated that Hornady brass is too soft which results in premature loose primer pockets and even brass separation. The cost for me to ship the damaged brass to Hornady would offset any benefit of the replacement brass they offered. It was obvious from the tone of Hornady's agent they really weren't interested in customer satisfaction. His apathy was obvious.

I've maid the decision to refrain from future purchases of Hornady products. Too many reports from other customers of substandard products, bullets that simply didn't perform and a company that really wasn't interested in backing their product or keeping customer satisfaction. The only reason is can see that Hornady products sell is their pricing. Their brass and bullets are typically the least expensive. Norma brass is twice the price but three times the quality.

I don't know where you are purchasing your Hornady brass, but mine are packaged in Hornady boxes, and I have yet to find an unacceptable piece. If you are purchasing in bulk from a vendor, you can expect to find damaged brass.

 

[spaniel]

Winchester brass was a good value until around 3 years ago; every bag I've gotten since then has significant issues. I'm done with it. I buy Lapua for when absolute accuracy matters, and now Norma.

 

[Kurz]

It seems like everyone either has a heart-rending story about how awful American brass is or they just want to pitch a fit.

Good News my friends! Peterson Cartridge has .308 Win. on sale in bulk for $449.30/1,000 pcs. Yes, I know, it's 1,000 pieces and that's a lot to buy all at once. But for what amounts to $44.93/hundred, I bought 1,000 pieces to either share with friends or just keep in reserve. This is the standard rifle primer not the small hole stuff.

Maybe you should palm off that awful Winchester garbage on someone else and buy what amounts to some of the best brass made and Made in the USA.

No I don't own stock in PC nor am I an employee.

Regards.

 

[Brians356]

These are 10 of the 11 worst cases out of 102 WW brand 6mm Rem cases.

The top photo shows definite culls. (Like the melted candle one? "That'll buff out".)

The one of the far left in the bottom photo is probably usable (and there is one more just like it.) The rest in the bottom photo might be ok - the dents will blow out, but I'm leery of the integrity of the shoulders.





-

 

[Brians356]

Good News my friends! Peterson Cartridge ... Maybe you should palm off that awful Winchester garbage on someone else and buy what amounts to some of the best brass made and Made in the USA.

I'm in! What do they charge for their 6mm Rem brass? Or 270 Win? 22-250?
-

 

[Brians356]

The only reason is can see that Hornady products sell is their pricing. Their brass and bullets are typically the least expensive.

I think Speer bullets might be less expensive overall. As for Hornady's bullets, I've found a few culls in boxes of Nosler BTs, but never any bad Hornadys.
-

 

[6MMsteve]

I use to buy Win Brass when it came in 20 round boxes I always thought it was the just grand, fast forward 25yrs suprise, the bean bagger is bagging the beans

 

[Rsadams]

Yes, they are typical for headspace. It's quite common for shoulders of raw cases to move forward .008" on fireforming. And that's well within SAAMMI spec (Max Chamber minus Min Cartridge at datum is typically .010" or more.)
-

Thanks.. I didn't know this... Like I said I just normally buy factory ammo and reload it... First time I actually bought " new " brass.. I am a little less nervous about it if that's common...