New to load development and suffering from information overload

[over_thetop]

I suspect you don't need to over think it for the creedmoor. Maybe I just got lucky or maybe its the Bartlein barrel. I load 6 creed but I bet the same principle applies to 6.5. H4350, berger hybrid, smk, or eldm, back it up .010 to .020 off jam, send it. I also use once fired Hornady brass with good results. About a billion people have already done the load development for 6.5 creed, just copy them and you will be in the ball park.

I have done the full load development with 3 to 5 shot groups for powder and seating depth when I started loading. Now I am trying larger samples and bigger changes per Hornady. So far, their observations have been true for me. Many times in the past I thought I was on to something with a certain charge or seating depth. I would then load up 10 or more to confirm and it would all fall apart. Now shooting 25 shot samples with larger changes I find for example .5 gr in a 223 makes very little difference.

the only thing you aren't monitoring is your case headspace... that will effect the OAL and you only mentioned the brass was fired once, who's to say where the shoulder is in relation to the bullet seating. I believe that's where you went wrong.

 

[over_thetop]

Done, done, done & have the VLD's. I don't have a micrometer seater yet though.

the VLD micro seater isn't gonna be good for all VLD bullets, just for Berger VLD's Redding cut thier vld stems for bergers, Forster can cut you one for a particular bullet or do it your self.

 

[Lead Slanger]

Here are the results. Brand new rifle. These are the first shots through it. Velocities all over the place. When loading these rounds last night, I could tell there were inconsistencies in neck tension. Each charge weighed and trickled. Seating depths within .0005. Once fired Hornady brass, AA4350, Hornady 140gr BTHP, Remington 9 1/2 primers.

 

[L.Sherm]

Does that prove to you E.S don't mean squat, although 76 is very high.

 

[over_thetop]

you measuring neck tension before and after bullet seating, and headspace after sizing ?

 

[over_thetop]

Does that prove to you E.S don't mean squat, although 76 is very high.

pressure spikes

 

[Ringostar]

I find the orange dots to be inconsistent with aiming point. I changed to making a plus sign with black sharpie marker. It gives a better way to line up cross hairs consistently.

 

[Lead Slanger]

you measuring neck tension before and after bullet seating, and headspace after sizing ?

I measured some randoms before. You can tell there were some inconsistencies in seating.

 

[over_thetop]

I measured some randoms before. You can tell there were some inconsistencies in seating.

you said .0005 off here and there ? AA4350...... try mag primers. I did, made a big difference. Recommended by load manuals and powder and bullet companies.

 

[Lead Slanger]

you said .0005 off here and there ? AA4350...... try mag primers

.0005 difference in seating depth from base to ogive

 

[Lead Slanger]

you said .0005 off here and there ? AA4350...... try mag primers. I did, made a big difference. Recommended by load manuals and powder and bullet companies.

I've got a few magnum primers, but I'm not going to use them on this. I've never heard of that. Which load manual or powder company said this?

 

[Kracken McGraw]

I would be tempted to load some at 42.5 and see if they group again.

 

[Kracken McGraw]

All of Hornady’s factory loadings with that bullet are listed at 2690mv, if you ever wanted to mix some factory loads in to keep a brass supply.

 

[over_thetop]

I've got a few magnum primers, but I'm not going to use them on this. I've never heard of that. Which load manual or powder company said this?

Speer 9 and13

 

[L.Sherm]

pressure spikes

Hmmm really!!! I doudt it was a pressure spike the way it shot.

 

[ShtrRdy]

It seems the 6.5mm Creedmoor velocity should be around 2700 fps.

If you were to go off of your results I would do seating depth testing at 41.1 grains. The point of impact for it and for 40.8 and 41.4 are very close.

 

[Florida Wally]

Here are the results. Brand new rifle. These are the first shots through it. Velocities all over the place. When loading these rounds last night, I could tell there were inconsistencies in neck tension. Each charge weighed and trickled. Seating depths within .0005. Once fired Hornady brass, AA4350, Hornady 140gr BTHP, Remington 9 1/2 primers.

Those groups aren’t too bad considering a factory rifle out of the box. The point of impact along the vertical axis of the groups looks okay. Look at 42.9 and 43.2, both from the single shots and groups. They are pretty close. You also have some other flat spots in the lower powder charges as well. Since you weren’t using fireformed brass, I would think your ES will get better when you load the brass you shot today. Do you anneal your brass?

How did the pressure signs look at 43.2? I’m thinking the brass looked okay since you shot the 43.2 group after looking at the brass from the single shot. If it were me, I’d try a seating depth test at 43.0 or 43.1 starting at .020 off and move closer to the lands for 3 or 4 groups with .003 increments and a couple of groups away from the lands also at .003 increments. It may be too early to move to seating depth, but it is worth a try.

It is still early in the process, but you are off to a good start. There are a lot of options going forward, but if you like loading and shooting you are going to enjoy the ride.

Edit to add: For now, don’t worry about the es and sd. Don’t change any components just yet either, just continue with your plan. Along the way, you can add or change a loading technique or component, but first you need a good shooting base load and seating depth to work from. Also, it looks like your reloading process is pretty good based on the targets you posted.

 

[JFrank]

Here are the results. Brand new rifle. These are the first shots through it. Velocities all over the place. When loading these rounds last night, I could tell there were inconsistencies in neck tension. Each charge weighed and trickled. Seating depths within .0005. Once fired Hornady brass, AA4350, Hornady 140gr BTHP, Remington 9 1/2 primers.

Load here and monitor on your neck tension, how much are you applying now ?

 

[Lead Slanger]

Load here and monitor on your neck tension, how much are you applying now ?

.002

 

[Lead Slanger]

Those groups aren’t too bad considering a factory rifle out of the box. The point of impact along the vertical axis of the groups looks okay. Look at 42.9 and 43.2, both from the single shots and groups. They are pretty close. You also have some other flat spots in the lower powder charges as well. Since you weren’t using fireformed brass, I would think your ES will get better when you load the brass you shot today. Do you anneal your brass?

How did the pressure signs look at 43.2? I’m thinking the brass looked okay since you shot the 43.2 group after looking at the brass from the single shot. If it were me, I’d try a seating depth test at 43.0 or 43.1 starting at .020 off and move closer to the lands for 3 or 4 groups with .003 increments and a couple of groups away from the lands also at .003 increments. It may be too early to move to seating depth, but it is worth a try.

It is still early in the process, but you are off to a good start. There are a lot of options going forward, but if you like loading and shooting you are going to enjoy the ride.

Edit to add: For now, don’t worry about the es and sd. Don’t change any components just yet either, just continue with your plan. Along the way, you can add or change a loading technique or component, but first you need a good shooting base load and seating depth to work from. Also, it looks like your reloading process is pretty good based on the targets you posted.

Yes sir. I was happy with the way it shot, first rattle out of the box. I did put a Choate Tactical stock on it and skim bedded it before I ever fired a shot.

Hodgdon says the max charge is 43.5. After shooting the 42.9 and 43.2, I told my shooting buddy/mentor that I should kick my own butt for not loading up a 43.5. Haha. I really would've liked to have seen where it landed. And yes, the pressure was fine at 43.2.

I agree....I believe that the 43ish range would be a good place to do some further testing. The velocity is where it should be and the last two had a good vertical poi. We were noticing the lower flat spots as well, but they're so slow at those charges. While we were waiting on the barrel to cool, we talked about this brass not being fire formed as well. I hope that does help keep the velocity numbers a little tighter.

Yes, sir. All brass was annealed.

Thank you and yes, I love loading and shooting. Once I started loading, I couldn't believe that I didn't get into it sooner. It's a hobby in itself.