Interesting Criteria for Private Firearms Sale...
- Thread starter RockyMtnMan
- Start date
shortgrass
Silver $$ Contributor
The examples I provided are Federal laws/regs. They apply everywhere in the USA. Those laws/regs are rarely applied to the average citizen, but they do exist. ATFE is much 'harder' on FFLs than they are the average citzen , in cases like this. They made an 'example' of the seller, in the instance I provided. Probably needed to. There are far more unlicensed sellers at the gunshows than there are FFLs, to the point its about 75% 'collectors. 99% of these sellers are looking for profit, not to expand or dispense of pieces in their 'collection'. I've personally seen many instances where a firearm was purchased from someone in the isle and, within minutes, was on the table with a price tag on it. Wonder why the libs are calling for background checks at gunshows? A citizen has the right to sell his or her personal property, are they entitled to make a business out of it in a highly regulated industry? "What's good for the goose is good for the gander". CYA, as you'd not want to be an "example". The example I provided in my previous post happened in a Western State where firearms laws are very lax. I know this isn't popular. But it could become more common and 'uglier' as there's only one more year in Office.
A forum I belong to here in Virginia has a form that we can use for private sales. Tried to copy it but couldn't do it. I've have used it twice since moving to VA. I feel OK with it. If interested, you can find it at, "Virginia Gun Trader".
When I want to sell a firearm, I take it to one of the local gun shops and put it on consignment; that way, they make a few bucks and they handle the transfer, which makes me happy. A buddy of mine sold a firearm at a gunshow as a private party sale, and a couple of months later, the cops showed up at his front door, it seems the firearm he had sold was used in an armed robbery.
A word to the wise is usually sufficient.
Phil
A word to the wise is usually sufficient.
Phil
Gentlemen,
Think about it this way. Every time you submit yourself or another, to a background check, you are in essence begging permission from the FBI, or the state as it may be. Is this exercising a "right"? How about this: Lets presume everyone we meet to be a criminal first, and force them to prove their good intentions before they may exercise any action at all. What if, when you went to buy anew car, the dealer said to you,
"You're gonna use this car to rob banks, get away from the police and run over children, aren't you? AREN'T YOU? No? Well, we'll just see about that, we'll do a background check on you and if we find no evidence of criminal activity, maybe we'll benevolently "allow" you to make the purchase."
The very concept is repugnant to me. Criminals aren't going to submit themselves to background checks. Right? Duh! So these background checks really aren't aimed at criminals are they? They are aimed at YOU. Did you know that more than 98% of the time the NICS system response is a "proceed"? That means that over 98% of the time, this whole system serves no legitimate purpose at all. Jeepers, thats a good way to spend billions of dollars in crime prevention money. This whole thing is conditioning the public to the idea that they must beg permission first. My Grandfather is rolling over in his grave.
Think about it this way. Every time you submit yourself or another, to a background check, you are in essence begging permission from the FBI, or the state as it may be. Is this exercising a "right"? How about this: Lets presume everyone we meet to be a criminal first, and force them to prove their good intentions before they may exercise any action at all. What if, when you went to buy anew car, the dealer said to you,
"You're gonna use this car to rob banks, get away from the police and run over children, aren't you? AREN'T YOU? No? Well, we'll just see about that, we'll do a background check on you and if we find no evidence of criminal activity, maybe we'll benevolently "allow" you to make the purchase."
The very concept is repugnant to me. Criminals aren't going to submit themselves to background checks. Right? Duh! So these background checks really aren't aimed at criminals are they? They are aimed at YOU. Did you know that more than 98% of the time the NICS system response is a "proceed"? That means that over 98% of the time, this whole system serves no legitimate purpose at all. Jeepers, thats a good way to spend billions of dollars in crime prevention money. This whole thing is conditioning the public to the idea that they must beg permission first. My Grandfather is rolling over in his grave.
Back ground checks are useless. Of all the resent mass shootings backround checks made no difference what so ever. Criminals don't participate in the system anyway, just the law abiding. It's all a farce created to eventually separate us from our guns. I have bought and sold literally 100's of guns in my life time. I am not responsible for what a new owner of one of the guns I sold does with it. If I sold somebody a hammer and they went home and beat their wife's head in with it would I be at fault? Should the hammer wielder have had a background check before the sale? Would it have made any difference?
smoooth
Gold $$ Contributor
Save for the last 2 posts in this topic, I am utterly disgusted that fellow members are turning their backs on the Constitution and the blood spilled by the Founding Fathers and military men and women to protect you and your rights. Through your responses they have already won. NONE of this is about guns it is about CONTROL!
Once the Second Amendment is gone, how many minutes do you think the First Amendment will last?
Once the Second Amendment is gone, how many minutes do you think the First Amendment will last?
Amen brother.
timeout
Silver $$ Contributor
The TV news reported this morning that "if you sell two or more guns in a calendar year, you will need to become a licensed gun dealer". I'm not certain if this is true? If it is true, what a crock of bull-puckey! We simply cannot elect another establishment candidate of the Republican party or the insanity that has been forced onto America, will never be overturned! Of course it goes without saying that a Dimocrat must not be elected.
The Head Dude just got done with his presser. He did indeed say more than two sales and you have to be an FFL. When does this take effect? I am currently thinning the heard and have 1/2 dozen guns for sale .
Oh, he cried too, so this is really serious......
Oh, he cried too, so this is really serious......
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Thousands of felons,I forget the exact # attempted to purchase a gun through an FFL and were denied. This is a felony. The Obummer Administration prosecuted 6. In Chicago if they catch a felon with a gun,they confiscate the gun and turn the felon loose. Their excuse,no jail space. The liberal media never mentions this. Scotty
Dusty Stevens
Shiner
And you cant be prosecuted for a law imagined by executive action. It has to become a law thru normal means
+1, I have done that to people I know where I live, that I have sold guns to. We meet at the FFL, transfer the gun, get paid, everybody is happy. That is just being responsible to know who/where a gun ends up.
Acouple of years ago I sold a .40 S&W to a dealer at a gun show in the next town. A year later an officer from that town called me and asked me about the gun since it was used in a homicide .He figured someone stole it from me and I didn't report the theft . I told him I sold it to a dealer at a gun show in his town but no one after me did a background check.Dealer gave me money and I left the gun in his hands. Maybe he wasn't a dealer but he had 150+ handguns on 5 tables and most of them were NIB so I ass umed he was a dealer.
The officer also told me I bought the gun in Rifle,Colorado . I told him I have never been to that town and I bought the gun new in his town at a local brick and mortar gun shop. Wierd . I think there might be cracks in this NICS system ??
Now Colorado has mandatory background checks for all transfers so there will be no more gun crime in this state ! Obama would be proud .
The officer also told me I bought the gun in Rifle,Colorado . I told him I have never been to that town and I bought the gun new in his town at a local brick and mortar gun shop. Wierd . I think there might be cracks in this NICS system ??
Now Colorado has mandatory background checks for all transfers so there will be no more gun crime in this state ! Obama would be proud .
Can't believe how many on here can't see this for what it really is. Maybe too many living in their gated or HOA communities and are used to be told what to do in so many aspects of their lives. Our Nation has become used to being watched and herded all in the name of it being for our own good.
You really think the criminals are going to obey this or any other law for that matter? How about your precious collections when you die or if they decide someone on a certain medication can't own a gun anymore? How about that no fly list? Habitual speeder, might someday look like you are irresponsible.
This is another huge step towards making it harder to own a gun for enjoyment or protection. And if they decide this isn't working there will be another harsher more restrictive law passed.
Wake up, it ain't always rainbows and butterflies. These people have one long term agenda and it's eventually having total control over the populace. They are patient but our "King" and his Court are accelerating it.
It is really disappointing to read some of the previous posts, how easily people are fooled and headed down a slippery slope.
Topstrap
You really think the criminals are going to obey this or any other law for that matter? How about your precious collections when you die or if they decide someone on a certain medication can't own a gun anymore? How about that no fly list? Habitual speeder, might someday look like you are irresponsible.
This is another huge step towards making it harder to own a gun for enjoyment or protection. And if they decide this isn't working there will be another harsher more restrictive law passed.
Wake up, it ain't always rainbows and butterflies. These people have one long term agenda and it's eventually having total control over the populace. They are patient but our "King" and his Court are accelerating it.
It is really disappointing to read some of the previous posts, how easily people are fooled and headed down a slippery slope.
Topstrap
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Criminals are NOT going to obey these laws and they may get a gun by other means from irresponsible dealers and sellers. But they will NOT be getting a gun directly from my hands if I can help it.
There's no law about this in Montana. This is something I am considering if selling to LOCAL folks I do not know. I have every right to control my own dealings and how I decide to conduct firearm sales. I am not putting this on anyone else. I am under no law to do this in Montana. I feel it is a form of responsibility and helps law enforcement with criminal investigations. I have no problem helping with information on investigations. More than willing to put scumbags behind bars. A good friend of mine is a local police officer and I appreciate everything they do to keep my neighborhood safe. I am more than willing to keep a track record of where my firearms are and whom I sold them to if it will aid them in the future.
If parents would quit being losers and lazy deadbeats and start to raise their children with lessons of love, compassion, respect, and hard work ethic, we wouldn't have a fraction of these criminals shooting places up and creating this mess. It sucks and its not gonna change until this nation gets God back in society, the households, and family. We're all hell bent on the dollar and forget about what really matters.
There's no law about this in Montana. This is something I am considering if selling to LOCAL folks I do not know. I have every right to control my own dealings and how I decide to conduct firearm sales. I am not putting this on anyone else. I am under no law to do this in Montana. I feel it is a form of responsibility and helps law enforcement with criminal investigations. I have no problem helping with information on investigations. More than willing to put scumbags behind bars. A good friend of mine is a local police officer and I appreciate everything they do to keep my neighborhood safe. I am more than willing to keep a track record of where my firearms are and whom I sold them to if it will aid them in the future.
If parents would quit being losers and lazy deadbeats and start to raise their children with lessons of love, compassion, respect, and hard work ethic, we wouldn't have a fraction of these criminals shooting places up and creating this mess. It sucks and its not gonna change until this nation gets God back in society, the households, and family. We're all hell bent on the dollar and forget about what really matters.
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/VH
Hillary ain't in jail, so leave me to hell alone!
How do know where the gun "ended up", just because you sold it through a FFL? Who were you being responsible to? An over reaching government? Some lawyer somewhere? Your conscience? Why do you feel responsible for what happens with an item you sold after you no longer have control of it? It seems to me that you're actually trying to dump the responsibility onto the FFL.
Do the buyers ask for your credentials when you sell guns? Are they concerned where the money they tendered "ends up"? Would they be distaught and/or feel responsible if they they found out you spent some of the money at your neighbor's daughter's lemonade stand and it turned out that your neighbor had his daughter raising funds for ISIS?
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If it will bring peace of mind to any of you good folks here fully opposed to background checks, Montana Senator Steve Daines (R) and Montana Representative Ryan Zinke (R), a retired Commander of US Navy SEAL Team 6, both stated that they will oppose the new Obama executive orders on gun laws to the fullest extent of their ability.
Obama needs to secure funding from Congress for his expanded background check laws to take effect. If he can't get the votes to secure the money, he has nothing.
I support background checks to a certain extent and also realize they are not the total solution. However, I do NOT think expanding the depth of the laws and checks in any way is the solution, especially when it will come at the expense of the hard working law abiding American citizens. This country is broke and in debt up to the hairline. We cannot afford any additional expendetures on liberal hogwash.
Obama needs to secure funding from Congress for his expanded background check laws to take effect. If he can't get the votes to secure the money, he has nothing.
I support background checks to a certain extent and also realize they are not the total solution. However, I do NOT think expanding the depth of the laws and checks in any way is the solution, especially when it will come at the expense of the hard working law abiding American citizens. This country is broke and in debt up to the hairline. We cannot afford any additional expendetures on liberal hogwash.
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