COLT45SA
Silver $$ Contributor
As they say, "to each his own~!!'. Glad to hear that you are happy with it~!
Found a Special Sako, What To Do?
- Thread starter wildcatter
- Start date
wildcatter
Silver $$ Contributor
Set out with 4 loads today, all in new unfired Norma 6ppc USA brass, all with Remington 7.5 small rifle powder, and 65 grain Bib bullets on 790 jackets, 3 shots each of 28.9, 29.0, 29.1, and 29.2 grains of N-133 powder, again .005" into the lands.
The target tell the story. I should have loaded a couple rounds to foul the freshly cleaned barrel. Which after the initial 7 rounds on day one, showed no copper fouling when cleaned.
But the targets were shot in sequence from lightest to hottest. I also setup the chronograph to check both speed and extreme spreads.
So with the 28.9 grain load being first, I forgot to turn on the chronograph for the first shots, but the last load at that charge wieght was 3342 fps. And even the first shot out of the clean barrel was right there with the other 2, common since I always wet patch with lockeze after cleaning to eliminate that first shot straying from the group you get with a dry barrel.
The target shows the 29.0 grain load being the sweet spot, best ES, and grouping. The 29.1 load looked similar to the 28.9 grain load, both group and extreme spread. With all three showing good accuracy, but that 29.0 grain load is exceptional.
Plus in my opinion very good speed for the little ppc. I also don't see any sign of excess pressure, but that 29.2 grain load showed I was getting away from the sweet spot, as the group not only opened up, but the velocity actually dropped, while the extreme spread widened considerably.
So that's it, I work with 29.0 grains next finding its preferred seating depth. I actually thought about saying good enough, and just seeing what 5 shot groups looked like, but I want to be sure it's optimum knowing conditions can make .1 or .2 grains needed to hold tune from one condition to the next.
All in all, a great day, and I am now confident these aren't coincidence. But reliable results
The target tell the story. I should have loaded a couple rounds to foul the freshly cleaned barrel. Which after the initial 7 rounds on day one, showed no copper fouling when cleaned.
But the targets were shot in sequence from lightest to hottest. I also setup the chronograph to check both speed and extreme spreads.
So with the 28.9 grain load being first, I forgot to turn on the chronograph for the first shots, but the last load at that charge wieght was 3342 fps. And even the first shot out of the clean barrel was right there with the other 2, common since I always wet patch with lockeze after cleaning to eliminate that first shot straying from the group you get with a dry barrel.
The target shows the 29.0 grain load being the sweet spot, best ES, and grouping. The 29.1 load looked similar to the 28.9 grain load, both group and extreme spread. With all three showing good accuracy, but that 29.0 grain load is exceptional.
Plus in my opinion very good speed for the little ppc. I also don't see any sign of excess pressure, but that 29.2 grain load showed I was getting away from the sweet spot, as the group not only opened up, but the velocity actually dropped, while the extreme spread widened considerably.
So that's it, I work with 29.0 grains next finding its preferred seating depth. I actually thought about saying good enough, and just seeing what 5 shot groups looked like, but I want to be sure it's optimum knowing conditions can make .1 or .2 grains needed to hold tune from one condition to the next.
All in all, a great day, and I am now confident these aren't coincidence. But reliable results
wildcatter
Silver $$ Contributor
Always when I'm in test mode, or practicing. Testing without wind flags is like driving without watching the road, kinda. The wind was picking up as the morning progressed, as I was waiting about 5 minutes between loads.
Without watching either one is kinda like, never know where your at! I am more accurate with my map reading skills than wind reading, but use both.
But these group would probably better when I get the proper front bag on my Sinclair Varmint rest. Plus I ain't to sure about this new to me, two-stage trigger either?
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Murray Brook
Silver $$ Contributor
What neck tension are you using. Reason I ask is I normally use .002 and get very good results but today with my load also using N-133 I went up a .001 to .003 just for testing and it seemed to work great. Not enough of rounds to really confirm but got a .201 group ( 5 shots) none the less.
jackieschmidt
Gold $$ Contributor
You need to figure out a way to load at the range and go spend an entire day playing with that thing.
Those are REALLY nice Factory rifles. I have seen them capable of .250 five shot groups under Match conditions.
I have always wanted one, but the temptation to stick a custom barrel on it would be heresey.
Those are REALLY nice Factory rifles. I have seen them capable of .250 five shot groups under Match conditions.
I have always wanted one, but the temptation to stick a custom barrel on it would be heresey.
Murray Brook
Silver $$ Contributor
Well Jackie when the time comes to rebarrel mine it will get done in a heart beat. I mean this isn't a ZL-1 Camero or a Hemi Cuda
wildcatter
Silver $$ Contributor
Jackie that was my exact dilemma, I just knew if I bought a used one I would end up needing to rebarrel what someone else already enjoyd.
At over $2200.00 for a used one in desent condition, I kept thinking, if I'm going to rebarel a rifle, it's no longer a factory gun! Defeating the purpose I was buying it.
I was extremely lucky when I found one brand new, unfired in the box. Even luckier a Sako collector didn't see it before the auction run out.
But make no mistake, if I would not have found it brand new. Or if I would have had to pay as much as a new custom action, bedded to a custom stock, with a trigger would cost me, I would not have had one.
Sometimes the Lord answers are prayers, and this is proof of that!
wildcatter
Silver $$ Contributor
You mean like this? I've been loading at the range for over 30 years, and wow,, how it has changed!
The old Kennedy utility box is converted for safe padded transport of my chargemaster lite. The Gerstner machinists chest has about everything and anything I could need to form, turn, trim, load, measure, and tune ammo, for 6br, 222, 6x47L, and 2 sets of 6ppc dies. FL, neck, seat, even body dues to fireform.
This is not only my home loading room setup, but how I travel, and Taylor loads at the range. It really make quick work of fine tuning loads. Like these 65 grain for the Sako, 28.8 has proven repeatable out of once fired brass. That is after fixing my front rest. Getting old is sometimes embarrassing.
28.8 grns of N133 with Remington 7.5 srp.seated .005" into the lands.
Attachments
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COLT45SA
Silver $$ Contributor
SAKO's 6mm PPC is designated as 6MM PPC-USA and is slightly different from the normal 6. However any of the 6MM PPC cartridges will form to the SAKO chamber with the first firing.
As far as accuracy is concerned, the SAKO is tough to beat. You might want to find a competent gunsmith and have the action bedded and make certain the barrel is "free floated". From there it won't take much experimentation with different loads to make it a "one-holer". In fact, if you'll just take your best node found with your cartridge fire-forming you will be close to "found it".
This was shot with a Vixen Hunter before bedding the action. Scope was a 36X B&L Balfor with a target dot.
I'll never forgive myself for having sold that masterpiece~!
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Yes thats the first thing I did to my A1 223 (much to the disgust of the sako forum guys). I guess that was 'the thing' in the 80's to exert a tad of (uneven) upressure to your barrel with 2 wood tabs at the end of a wood stock. After I ground them down I was barely on paper when I went to re-zero!
wildcatter
Silver $$ Contributor
These Rifles come with free floated barrels right from the factory. And even in the factory inletted stock I see no reason to waste any time, or risk blemishing the stock to shoot in the mis ones to low twos, as thus one does all day long!
But when you rest the barrel on a hard surface, then aply pressure to the forearm, free floating is useless, and the best bedding job in the world won't fix STUPID.
Once the forearm stop was changed to the proper one all is good, and in my opinion bedding is just chasing your tail on this rifle!!
This is after removing my head from my backside! With the proper forearm stop, shot back to back. No flags and I think the first group would not have had the left shot out of the group. Forgot to mention I forgot them as well,,,,,,,
But I think we'll live with it and call it as it is, FACTORY! So far it's 1 and 0 in the win column in competition.
As for any brass, if you use Lapua, like I do in my Stevens barreld Bat, you will have to turn necks for use in the no turn Sako chamber!
But as you say, the Norma 6ppc USA, and Sako 6ppc USA it works, but with the Norma and Sako, they are already formed, the Lapua 220R of course needs fireformed,, good luck with one firing to get sharp complete fire forming With one firing if you use Lapua brass.
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COLT45SA
Silver $$ Contributor
As the saying goes, "to each his own~!"
wildcatter
Silver $$ Contributor
Like I said this gun comes free floated with and excellent inletting job. But putting pressure on the barrel is never a good thing!
I just wasn't paying attention or thinking about the forearm stop. But pulling my hair out with the new front bag, only thing I changed, it didn't dawn on my till I came back to the bench after loading five more and got a view from the side what was going on. And yes trust me, I know better, just had my head up my---.
I see mention that you can bedd your barrel as long as the action is floated and getting the same results? I'll just stick to the old fashioned line of thought. To old to change I guess?
Murray Brook
Silver $$ Contributor
@wildcatter I take it your 29 gr load didn't pass the 5 shot test.
Ackman
Gold $$ Contributor
Where did you find the picatinny rail? I've looked all over and couldn't find any. Could use a few.
wildcatter
Silver $$ Contributor
That came from scope list. I think Tyler was who I talked with. But ya, it only took me 2 days find one, and then only because I called and asked for help. I couldn't find them for the sake but really wasn't sure what all I needed. Never having a Sako before, they are unique. Kinda reminded me like when I first bough a Beeman R1 50 years ago.
It is the bases and adjustable rail for them. All I needed was the Burris Signature rings.
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wildcatter
Silver $$ Contributor
That 28.8 grain load was friendly enough to give the Sako's first match a Victory!
Just a 10 shot, 200 yard egg shoot. But only 8 eggs, the last two shots were 2 paint balls. The Sako was the only one to clean all 10 targets in Factory class, With a little Bib 65 grain in the recamended 790 short jackets.
Unbelievably there was another of the "B" series in the 4xx serial number also competing, it took 3rd place in a 4 gun shootoff.
A good day to bleed the Sako, but even better taking first place in Custom class as well shooting the 222 in the Panda. It won Custom class last month as well. But past 200 it struggles.
Just a 10 shot, 200 yard egg shoot. But only 8 eggs, the last two shots were 2 paint balls. The Sako was the only one to clean all 10 targets in Factory class, With a little Bib 65 grain in the recamended 790 short jackets.
Unbelievably there was another of the "B" series in the 4xx serial number also competing, it took 3rd place in a 4 gun shootoff.
A good day to bleed the Sako, but even better taking first place in Custom class as well shooting the 222 in the Panda. It won Custom class last month as well. But past 200 it struggles.
-Al
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