FClass Dreamer

[AZLongGunner]

Hello all, Well I am new to this forum and as the title says I am a Aspiring for FClass T/R shooting competition. Little about myself, live in southwest Arizona, 46 year old self taught long range shooter. I have a couple questions that hopefully you more experienced comp shooters can help me with.
Thanks in advance for any help and opinions I look forward to gleaning all the info I can from some other experienced shooters.

Question 1, Rifle weight, I will be using a Rem 700 .223 20" 1:9 Twist Does my rifle with bi-pod optics and attached gear have to weigh less than 18lbs or at 18lbs

Question 2, Bullet weight, I still have load development to do but so far the gun likes to pop 69g match ammo. I believe that is a little on the light side for 500y wind but was wondering if anyone here shoots that weight pill in comp? As the stability calculations for that round and my barrel show Im deep in the green zone for stability.

Question 3, As I am in Arizona in the Surprise area, I was wondering if there are any people in here that shoot FClass in the area and could point me in a general direction to enter and get started, practice shoots. I have been shooting long and ELR on my own for 5-10 years but would love to dip my toes into the FClass TR arena.

 

[NZ_Fclass]

Welcome to the forum, and hopefully to FTR.

The 223 is really only competitive against other 223's. I shoot one,a Savage, on a nice summer, windless day out to 600, and yes I can be competitive. To 600, when the wind isn't blowing.

I suggest that you invest in a 308. Look for a good target rifle. If you have to go with a "shop" rifle, there's plenty to choose from, but my choice would be , perhaps, Tikka, with a heavy barrel or a Savage FTR rifle would also do good service.

Theres plenty of good shooters on this forum, Im sure that you will get a few more opinions.

 

[aussiepowderburner]

I started F class with a 223 due to a shoulder reconstruction.
Quickly found it was just competitive to 600 yards with 80 gr Bergers
That was with a 30” 1/8 twist
As above - first comp at 1000 yards got my proverbial handed to me after a dual clean at 600.
Went home and mad3 plans for a 308
Been shooting one for 10 + years now
223 great to 600 on mild days - nil recoil
But honestly a 20” just wont cut it past 400 in my opinion
Just a frustrating experience

 

[Medic505]

You are lucky. You live in a hotbed of F-Class. Desertsharpshooters.com. Lots of good people and talented shooters.

 

[CharlieNC]

The 223 can be competitive out to 600yd, but with the twist and chamber to facilitate shooting 90gr high BC bullets. My initial 8 twist pushing 80.5 full bore hung in out to 500yd but scores plummeted at 600 due to the shooter not being able to handle the wind. New barrel and 90vld is competitive against the 308 big boys. Your 69gr may be suitable at 300yd depending on the competition, but you will learn and gave fun nonetheless.

 

[Falfan2017]

Lots of matches around you. Id say shoot a few matches with your current set up and talk to the folks at the matches and if you enjoy it chances are you’ll be building or buying a dedicated target rifle before long.

 

[Medic505]

Lots of matches around you. Id say shoot a few matches with your current set up and talk to the folks at the matches and if you enjoy it chances are you’ll be building or buying a dedicated target rifle before long.

^^^^^^^^^ This!

 

[dcali]

I've got a partly completed series on getting into F Class on my website now. Maybe it will be helpful. https://bisonballistics.com/articles/f-class-basics-part-1-introduction-and-equipment

Shoot the heaviest bullets that that 1:9 can handle until you get a feel for what you what direction you want to go with the game. Keep in mind that altitude will help quite a bit, so you can go heavier than the box might suggest. Maybe look at a Sierra 77? Those would really be on the edge, so I'd try a few before buying a lot, but it *might* work. Best of luck!

 

[Matthew Schwartzkopf]

You are lucky. You live in a hotbed of F-Class. Desertsharpshooters.com. Lots of good people and talented shooters.

We shoot F Class at Ben Avery several time a weeks (Not right now with COVID-19) go to Dersertsharpshooters.com to see our schedule and come out and shoot with us.

 

[Longtrain]

...Your 69gr may be suitable at 300yd depending on the competition, but you will learn and gave fun nonetheless.

Get out and shoot a match, learn the process, scoring, pit duty, relay rotation, what equipment you’ll need etc.
If you can find 300 yard matches that would be a good place to start. 500 or 600 yards will be challenging with 69 SMK’s or the like.

I’ve seen shooters do very well shooting 69’s at 300 yards. At 300, the 10 ring is if I recall 2.85” in diameter, less then 1 MOA, good shot execution and wind reading are very important. Can be done, just a bit tougher.

Once you get your feet wet, talk to other shooters, see what they’re shootings and go from there. A 308 with a 30” barrel in a 1:10 or 1:11 twist, chambered to shoot 185 Berger Juggernauts would not be a bad choice IMO. Easy bullet to tune, accurate and consistent. Good luck, have fun.

 

[rardoin]

Hell, all of us living outside of the Phoenix area are F-class dreamers. LOL You are at ground zero for Fclass with Ben Avery in your backyard

 

[AZLongGunner]

Yeah I really appreciate all of the reply's and keep them coming, I ordered 100 pieces for the 69g to do ladder testing, I will order some more at a heavier grain and do a ladder test there also to see where the harmonics and groups go.
I have the gun built already, I figured I would try and get in on the semi cheap to get experience I am def realizing that 500y-600y matches are prol a pipe dream with my current set up however the 300y is very tempting to maybe dip toes into.

I will def check out the desert sharp shooters site and try and come to some matches and practice shoots. I really am interested in trying it, I love shooting long range, something therapeutic about it.

 

[Falfan2017]

Nothing wrong with getting started with the 69ers if they shoot well and that’s what you have. Main thing is just go to matches and learn as much as possible and have fun.

 

[Ned Ludd]

The 9-twist barrel will be your limiting factor. I would use the heaviest bullet it will effectively stabilize that also gives good precision. I would consider trying the Berger 70 VLD, 73 gr BT, Nosler 70 RDF, or the Sierra 77 MK bullets. All have much better BCs than the 69 gr MKs, and with the possible exception of the 77 MK, ought to work well in your 9-twist barrel. The weight limit on the rifle, bipod, scope, and everything else attached to it as lifted off the ground is 8.25 kg, or 18.18 lb.

There are a couple fellows that shoot in F-TR at Ben Avery that are EXPERTS reloading/shooting .223s for this purpose. John and Justin are both members at the forum here and one or both will hopefully chime in.

 

[AZLongGunner]

The 9-twist barrel will be your limiting factor. I would use the heaviest bullet it will effectively stabilize that also gives good precision. I would consider trying the Berger 70 VLD, 73 gr BT, Nosler 70 RDF, or the Sierra 77 MK bullets. All have much better BCs than the 69 gr MKs, and with the possible exception of the 77 MK, ought to work well in your 9-twist barrel. The weight limit on the rifle, bipod, scope, and everything else attached to it as lifted off the ground is 8.25 kg, or 18.18 lb.

There are a couple fellows that shoot in F-TR at Ben Avery that are EXPERTS reloading/shooting .223s for this purpose. John and Justin are both members at the forum here and one or both will hopefully chime in.

Awesome information thank you, I will probably move up in bullet weight To the envelop edge for stability and do some testing, I am casually looking for a suitable 308 for my next project also.

Here is a group I recently (Last week) shot with Winchester Match 69g BT factory pills at 5-10 mph full value winds at 200y. 5 shot group

 

[243Mendoza]

Awesome information thank you, I will probably move up in bullet weight To the envelop edge for stability and do some testing, I am casually looking for a suitable 308 for my next project also.

Here is a group I recently (Last week) shot with Winchester Match 69g BT factory pills at 5-10 mph full value winds at 200y. 5 shot group

http://www.jbmballistics.com/cgi-bin/jbmtraj_drift-5.1.cgi
is a great resource for exterior ballistics, one of which is bullet stability factor and wind drift.

 

[boltman13]

You may have better luck at 600 yards if you use the Hornady 75 gr non tipped BTHP. I shot 600 yard slow fire with a Bushmaster 1:9 twist 20" barrel AR-15 back in the day and had a few 190+ scores. Weight sorting may help some as well. With the Sinclair bipod screw the height adjuster all the way down and only adjust the legs for height and the bipod will be more stable. Approach FTR with the attitude of learning what you can and making sure you really want to go down this road. If you do you will know where to go next from the many great F-Class shooters who hang out regularly at Ben Avery. As others have said the 223 can be a top performer at 600 yards and at 1,000 it can do well with the right bullet/rifle twist combination until the wind blows. Then the 308 makes the job easier. Notice I did not say it makes it easy. Good luck, have fun.

 

[D-4297]

Yup . a 600 New shooter's Orientation Day shoot at Ben Avery . Calm conditions , and not to hot .....Another one bites the dust .

 

[AZLongGunner]

Well I am definitely going to give it a hard try, long distance shooting is my therapy. Never done any formal comps but I like to push myself and I figure this would be the best way, go get humbled and learn, come back and do better. Thank you all for the awesome responses and encouragement, I will be trying to hook up with some of y'all Fclass shooters when Ben Avery opens back up.

I am at the ladder test stage for my round development 69g and 73g, Then in May when opens back up Ill head that way maybe meet some of y'all there, pick some brains and then SEND IT!

 

[Matthew Schwartzkopf]

Well I am definitely going to give it a hard try, long distance shooting is my therapy. Never done any formal comps but I like to push myself and I figure this would be the best way, go get humbled and learn, come back and do better. Thank you all for the awesome responses and encouragement, I will be trying to hook up with some of y'all Fclass shooters when Ben Avery opens back up.

I am at the ladder test stage for my round development 69g and 73g, Then in May when opens back up Ill head that way maybe meet some of y'all there, pick some brains and then SEND IT!

I don't know if you have already done it, but if you subscribe to our email list at http://www.desertsharpshooters.com/subscribe we will email out out notice when we will be back on the range.

Right now we are reviewing everything on a week to week basis.