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Bore Solvent/ Carbon Removal/ Borescope "proof"

Fellows: I fully realize that the topic of bore carbon removal has been beaten to death over the years. What I'm asking is to the point.

What solvent will remove bore carbon that has been shown to do so based on the use of of a BORESCOPE?

ptf18

A wise man I know once told me...

All bullet / powder / barrel combo's will behave somewhat differently.
There is no absolute one size fits all...

The Only Sure way to know how clean, fouled or anything your bore is is to have a borescope or one of these... >>>> https://www.opticsplanet.com/lyman-borecam-digital-borescope-with-monitor-04055l.html

If you don'r have one... You should get one... :)

Cheers,
G-
 
Is there a way to seal the chamber and fill the bore with a cleaner / liquid that would soak to loosen the carbon ?
I have not tried soaking a chamber with the stuff, but there exists a product called piston kleen that is a very mild liquid that does amazing things to carbon. It doesn’t work terribly fast, so I doubt it would work with patches. But it might be worth a shot at softening up some of the cooked on stuff if you could rig up a way to soak it.
 
I have not tried soaking a chamber with the stuff, but there exists a product called piston kleen that is a very mild liquid that does amazing things to carbon. It doesn’t work terribly fast, so I doubt it would work with patches. But it might be worth a shot at softening up some of the cooked on stuff if you could rig up a way to soak it.
pull the cylinder head on a car with a blown head gasket and that affected cylinder /piston top will be squeaky clean. I wonder if so good old Prestone would loosen up a bad one.
 
New way im applying iosso to that carbon ring area is on a VFG pellet on a rod. One caliber size up and a bit of polish is all it usually takes to keep it clean every 100 rounds, if it needs a bit more work Ill use a vfg “intensive” pellet felt
 
I am curious about CLR but I am hesitant to use it in cleaning my rifles. Although I do not know whether it may harm stainless, it is corrosive.
 
Is there a way to seal the chamber and fill the bore with a cleaner / liquid that would soak to loosen the carbon ?
Yes, it's called a chamber plug and it works. It's designed to be used with the barrel on but I take mine off.
I soak a barrel for 24 hours with C4 and then brush a couple of times and then patch out. It totally demolishes the carbon ring and does a pretty good job on hard carbon.
Buy several sets of spare seals for the chamber plug.
 
For rifles that need to be cleaned fairly often, including at matches, long soaking is not an option.

I would not use a particulate cleaner with a bronze brush or for that matter a stiff nylon brush.

I learned to use IOSSO back in the day from published accounts of how Tony Boyer did it between every match , probably because the T powder that was using back then while very good in most respects, was bad about making hard carbon. (This it how the manufacturer suggests using their product, and I am sure that their way works just fine.)

Back then there were not stiff nylon bore brushes and the ones that were available were quite a bit softer. Dewey sells brushes that work for me for this application. They can be reversed in the bore pretty easily.

After my full normal cleaning, including brushing, I put on a nylon brush and fill it to the ends of the bristles for its entire length with IOSSO, and using a bore guide that has a separate bushing on the rod that plugs into the back of the guide, I work carefully being particularly careful to keep the rod straight and in line withe the bore throughout its entire stroke. I work over the throat with about 20 very short strokes, about 3" and then continue that stroking as I slowly move the rod farther into the bore with the same short strokes, to the point that I am half way down its length. Then I pull back and do it one more time from the beginning, and remove it and clean the bore, chamber, lug recesses, rod guide, bushing, and rod as many times as required to remove all of the IOSSO.

I find that a very light oil works better for this than a solvent. Then I finish with a couple of wet patches of my regular solvent, dry the bore and chamber, and lube the lugs and cocking cam.

Different powders will build carbon at different rates, as will different case volume to bore size ratios. The trick it to only do this as often as it takes to maintain accuracy, without overdoing it. More is not better.

This is where a bore scope can really come in handy. You can clean a bit, clean out the IOSSO and take a look. Once you know how much to clean during a session, and how often you need to with that powder and caliber, you will be all set.

The extreme other end of things is VV133. In my 6PPC I have been able to keep my barres clean with cotton patches, regular solvent, and bronze brushes without accumulating hard carbon. No IOSSO or JB is required.

A friend of mine who shoots LT32 in his 6PPC match rifle has settled on using IOSSO every hundred rounds or so, carefully. He has a bore scope. He is on his second barrel and has experienced no problems as far as throat wear or barrel life. The first time that he used the IOSSO, at my suggestion, he saw a small increase in accuracy, probably because he was well beyond his first hundred rounds with LT32 on that barrel.

LT32 is a fine powder, and having to do this every so often should not be taken as a criticism, nor should it deter anyone from its use. For less critical applications the frequency of these sorts of cleanings could undoubtedly be extended.

What Boyd said and there isn't a shorter way to say it, I would add that of the barrels commonly used in SR BR only one brand has consistent problems with the hard carbon ring. I won't say the brand but otherwise they shoot great. I haven't had any trouble with Krieger's doing this and shoot both Viht, and LT31 in all of my barrels, the LT is more likely to do this than the Viht. This also happens worse on barrels with low round counts than it does on barrels with 400 rounds plus through them.
 
The only way i've found to remove,hard carbon/copper ring,is stiff Nylon brush like IOSSO,or a over size[ 1 caliber] brass brush w/ cleaner on it.It's also fastest way i know of removing it.IF anyone else has a faster,easier way,Please post
 
Fellows: I fully realize that the topic of bore carbon removal has been beaten to death over the years. What I'm asking is to the point.

What solvent will remove bore carbon that has been shown to do so based on the use of of a BORESCOPE?

ptf18


As other have said Boretech C4 is about a s good as you’ll get without brushing.

I had a bad ring show up on a 22-250 AI last summer and the only thing that removed it was JB and a nylon brush, verified with a Hawkeye borescope.

The foaming cleaners will do a good job preventing carbon rings or build up of carbon if used regularly but one it’s there, brush it out.
 
Is there a way to seal the chamber and fill the bore with a cleaner / liquid that would soak to loosen the carbon ?
Here is a link to the Sinclair Chamber Plug. I use these with BoreTec C4. The BoreTec technician said you can soak a barrel with C4 for as long as you want. They have barrels that have been soaking in C4 for several years with no problems. The link also has a Sinclair video about the chamber plugs.

https://www.sinclairintl.com/gun-cl...er-plugs/sinclair-chamber-plug-prod33214.aspx
 
I buy an appropriate sized rubber cork at my hardware store and plug the muzzle, fill the bore and half the chamber and prop the rifle vertically overnight. Pop the over a pan to reclaim the solvent.
 
There are degrees of cleaning, regular maintenance, slightly abused, and completely ignored bores. Also, calibers with powder amounts and types come into play. Shooting a 223 presents different fouling tendencies than say an F Class 308 barrel where a guy does not like to clean.

An example of an abused, cleaning wise, Krieger 308 barrel that I bought for cheap money off this site, which had cooked on carbon from front to back, SOLID BLACK lands and grooves. This F class barrel was shot hot as hell, NEVER cleaned properly. The Throat looked new when I got the barrel, but I had never seen a barrel carboned up as bad as this barrel. After pushing 6 wet patches then brushing the barrel, I kept looking at the Blackness in the barrel off and on for about two weeks, thinking how in the world did someone ruin a barrel like this?

I tried soaking with wipe out products for a week, patching out every day, with a re soak and brushing, always using Accelerator, then try their Tactical...all to no avail.

Then I went to C4, soaked over night, then wore out a new bronze bristle brush, with the end result, still black from end to end. I repeated brushing and soaking everyday. I would brush for 25 strokes, then another day of soaking. I used a new bronze bristle brush away every 100 strokes. I had bought three 16 oz bottles of C4 after reading posts on this site, obviously drank the Kool Aid. This process went on for 7 calendar days, the cooked on carbon showed no hint of getting thinner.

Then I saturated 5 patches with JB, short stroking the patches in the barrel on a tight fitting punch type jag. This process removed nothing or next to nothing with only the slightest hint of metal starting to come through in tiny spots about the size of a straight pin head. I figured the barrel was probably going to end up a piece of trash.

Next, I brushed again with JB, 25 strokes with a new brush, wet patched out, then dried the bore...Hawkeye showed only a hint of carbon coming out. In frustration, I put new batteries in the Hawkeye, re-focused the eye piece, and cleaned the mirror. I was ready to sling something up against the wall. I decided to use some Isso, then Flitz. I could see the very slightest amount of carbon starting to come out, but not uniform removal, looking like specs of carbon coming out.

If you go back and read my first post, you will see how I got the barrel back to new condition. It did take three, two week sessions of soaking with brushing in between. After the FIRST two week soaking, it was all too obvious that the carbon was coming out. After the third soaking and brushing, the barrel looked as carbon free as a brand new barrel.

With a long Grizzley rod, I checked the bore uniformity, and it was .3000 from end to end, Krieger made one hell of a barrel!

I cut the old chamber off and used a reamer with .090 FB, it is shooting the 155g Palma in the 2's at this point with only 21 rounds on the new chamber in brand new unsized Lapua brass with 44.0g of R#15, with WLRM primer shooting the smallest group of the primers I tried. No group was over 3/8" that I tried with powder charges ranging from 43.5-44.5 in .5g increments with 4 different primer brands used at 44.0g. Again, Krieger makes one heck of a barrel.

It will take further experimenting to see if brushing with a super penetrating oil is an answer for regular cleaning intervals for carbon. The use of penetrating oil may take time to work "under" the carbon. It was obvious that good brushing was needed in between soaking, and that the carbon was getting gooey.

If I had the GM Top engine cleaner that Bill recommended, my cleaning would probably have been a lot easier.
 
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