understanding bore cleaning vs carbon removal

[bpost1958]

Please help me get this straight in my mind.

Is it best to remove the carbon from the bore before using copper solvent?

Is using straight BUTCHES BORE SHINE not going to work the same on the carbon fouling?,remove the copper under the carbon, carbon gone too?)

Why remove carbon from the muzzle side, and get all that gunk in the action/trigger? Yet remove copper from the breech?

Is simple,and cheap)carb cleaner using the spray tube down the bore from the breech side not the same as the expensive GM stuff??

Lastly, I have a 22-250 that will NOT shoot a clean barrel. It takes 5 -8 rounds to settle down. Will just removing the carbon be the same as removing the copper so I can hunt with a cleaner barrel. The barrel has 205 rounds now and has only seen Butches bore shine.

What I am trying to do is understand the CARBON removal in relation to COPPER FOULING removal.

 

[Forum Boss]

Butches should clean your barrel just fine, unless it has really bad chatter marks.

The notion behind using a carbon cleaner first is that you get the carbon fouling out fast and efficiently. This, in turn, allows the copper-dissolvers to "cut to the chase" and work more effectively with less dwell time and less brushing.

but there is no question a good "all-in-one" solvent such as Butches, or MT Extreme, or the new TM Solution, will remove both carbon AND copper.

Personally, I'll use GM TEC or MPro-7 to remove the heavier soot and carbon, then apply Wipe-Out. Some guys just use Wipe-Out all by itself, but I think it works faster if you get some of the soot out of the barrel first with 2-3 wet patches.

If you need something faster than Wipe-Out, the products we're hearing lots of praise for are Bore-Tech Eliminator, TM Solution, and MT Extreme 50 BMG. As to each, a "big name" long-range BR shooter has told me that "this was the best stuff they've ever tried by far." TM is supposed to be super fast, 50 BMG really zaps the copper.

Back to your question. The GM stuff isn't that expensive compared to name-brand "gun cleaners". I do not believe it is the same chemically as the common carb cleaners found in the auto accessory shops.