A few 7mm questions

[Pawpawdawg]

My last (actually, only) centerfire rifle was a 30-.06 my dad got me as a teen for deer hunting. Skip forward about 5 decades into retirement and my bucket list desire to hunt elk and pronghorn has me prowling this and other forums to come up to speed. Things have changed a bit. At this point, I’ve settled on a 7mm as a reasonable compromise for both of those game animals, but the current pace of change within that category is impressive. I have some questions that I’d be grateful to hear back on. I should add that reloading is a distinct possibility as load optimization sounds like a lot of fun. Also, I’m not particularly concerned about barrel life:

1. Regarding overbore cartridges such as the 28 Nosler, is it not true that one could use a smaller powder charge to replicate both the performance AND barrel erosion rate of one of the slightly less potent 7mm cartridges? I understand, why buy the additional capacity if you’re not going to use it, but I want to make sure I have a handle on the relevant performance aspects.
2. Regarding the 7mm Backcountry, I’ve read early claims of improved barrel life that I do not understand. Is it that with the higher chamber pressures the powder charge burns faster so one isn’t sending combusting powder down the barrel? I’d have thought that the higher pressure was detrimental to barrel life. Or are both of these true, and we really need to wait and see what the net reality will be?
3. Also re/ the 7mm BC, I’ve seen reports of excellent accuracy and reports of good but not best-in-class accuracy (I think it was a statement that extremely high chamber pressure is not optimal for accuracy). Again maybe it’s a wait and see thing, but I’m guessing that for hunting out to 500 yards or less, accuracy is likely a non-issue for this cartridge. Does that sound right?
4. Having read the fly-in-the-ointment about Hornady’s advertised performance vs. what is practically attainable with the 7mm PRC, have their been permanent/indefinite changes in gun powder availability in recent years such that it’s best to assume that Hornady’s initially published numbers are mostly out of reach for the reloader?

Thanks in advance.

 

[STOMP442]

The tried and true .30-06 has killed plenty of elk and pronghorn. If you want a hot rod 7mm that's fine nothing wrong with that but, the 06 will work fine too and the elk and pronghorn will never know the difference. When talking about a dedicated hunting rifle barrel life should be a minor concern, most people never put more than a few rounds a year through them and 800 rounds of barrel life is a lifetime.

 

[358WCF]

My last (actually, only) centerfire rifle was a 30-.06 my dad got me as a teen for deer hunting. Skip forward about 5 decades into retirement and my bucket list desire to hunt elk and pronghorn has me prowling this and other forums to come up to speed. Things have changed a bit. At this point, I’ve settled on a 7mm as a reasonable compromise for both of those game animals, but the current pace of change within that category is impressive. I have some questions that I’d be grateful to hear back on. I should add that reloading is a distinct possibility as load optimization sounds like a lot of fun. Also, I’m not particularly concerned about barrel life:

1. Regarding overbore cartridges such as the 28 Nosler, is it not true that one could use a smaller powder charge to replicate both the performance AND barrel erosion rate of one of the slightly less potent 7mm cartridges? I understand, why buy the additional capacity if you’re not going to use it, but I want to make sure I have a handle on the relevant performance aspects.
2. Regarding the 7mm Backcountry, I’ve read early claims of improved barrel life that I do not understand. Is it that with the higher chamber pressures the powder charge burns faster so one isn’t sending combusting powder down the barrel? I’d have thought that the higher pressure was detrimental to barrel life. Or are both of these true, and we really need to wait and see what the net reality will be?
3. Also re/ the 7mm BC, I’ve seen reports of excellent accuracy and reports of good but not best-in-class accuracy (I think it was a statement that extremely high chamber pressure is not optimal for accuracy). Again maybe it’s a wait and see thing, but I’m guessing that for hunting out to 500 yards or less, accuracy is likely a non-issue for this cartridge. Does that sound right?
4. Having read the fly-in-the-ointment about Hornady’s advertised performance vs. what is practically attainable with the 7mm PRC, have their been permanent/indefinite changes in gun powder availability in recent years such that it’s best to assume that Hornady’s initially published numbers are mostly out of reach for the reloader?

Thanks in advance.

This is an interesting series you might enjoy. It will take a while to watch the whole thing (19 or 20 videos) but should answer your questions & then some.

 

[Pawpawdawg]

The tried and true .30-06 has killed plenty of elk and pronghorn. If you want a hot rod 7mm that's fine nothing wrong with that but, the 06 will work fine too and the elk and pronghorn will never know the difference. When talking about a dedicated hunting rifle barrel life should be a minor concern, most people never put more than a few rounds a year through them and 800 rounds of barrel life is a lifetime.

I hear you, although my old .30-06 is long gone so I’m starting over anyway.

 

[ELR LVR]

My last (actually, only) centerfire rifle was a 30-.06 my dad got me as a teen for deer hunting. Skip forward about 5 decades into retirement and my bucket list desire to hunt elk and pronghorn has me prowling this and other forums to come up to speed. Things have changed a bit. At this point, I’ve settled on a 7mm as a reasonable compromise for both of those game animals, but the current pace of change within that category is impressive. I have some questions that I’d be grateful to hear back on. I should add that reloading is a distinct possibility as load optimization sounds like a lot of fun. Also, I’m not particularly concerned about barrel life:

1. Regarding overbore cartridges such as the 28 Nosler, is it not true that one could use a smaller powder charge to replicate both the performance AND barrel erosion rate of one of the slightly less potent 7mm cartridges? I understand, why buy the additional capacity if you’re not going to use it, but I want to make sure I have a handle on the relevant performance aspects.
2. Regarding the 7mm Backcountry, I’ve read early claims of improved barrel life that I do not understand. Is it that with the higher chamber pressures the powder charge burns faster so one isn’t sending combusting powder down the barrel? I’d have thought that the higher pressure was detrimental to barrel life. Or are both of these true, and we really need to wait and see what the net reality will be?
3. Also re/ the 7mm BC, I’ve seen reports of excellent accuracy and reports of good but not best-in-class accuracy (I think it was a statement that extremely high chamber pressure is not optimal for accuracy). Again maybe it’s a wait and see thing, but I’m guessing that for hunting out to 500 yards or less, accuracy is likely a non-issue for this cartridge. Does that sound right?
4. Having read the fly-in-the-ointment about Hornady’s advertised performance vs. what is practically attainable with the 7mm PRC, have their been permanent/indefinite changes in gun powder availability in recent years such that it’s best to assume that Hornady’s initially published numbers are mostly out of reach for the reloader?

Thanks in advance.

1. I don't see any problem with loading down
It may be good to explore using slower powders also for better load density
More case fill, but still lower velocity
3. The 7mm bullets have some of the highest BC's, and still retain winning accuracy
I don't know what your intentions are but a 284 Win / 8 twist is all you need really
Some people are getting velocity that is only 50 fps behind a 7mm MAG
2800 ish with 180's
while using 10 grains less powder to do it
I believe using Reloder 26

 

[Pawpawdawg]

This is an interesting series you might enjoy. It will take a while to watch the whole thing (19 or 20 videos) but should answer your questions & then some.

I’ve watched the first three and all I can say is - WOW. He’s already exploded several things I thought I understood (no pun intended). Many thanks for this reference.

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

As I have aged my idea of what is a walk/hike around a mountain rifle has changed. In my early 50's I didn't care if I had a 9# rifle and 20# pack. Now I would like 7# rifle and 15 # day pack. Keep this in mind, where(elevation, terrain, transportation) and how you will hunt elk/deer/ antelope. As a rifle gets lighter recoil and torque increases, making practice more difficult and MORE IMPORTANT. There is also a financial part of this, practice maybe very expensive with factory "latest and greatest" cartridge. All of the big 7's can be very accurate out of high quality barrels, using "known" hunting bullets. If it helps, you won't need to shoot heavy for caliber bullets for any mountain or US plains game. This may help with recoil/light weight rifles.

 

[tdogg]

I'm a 7mm guy, I have 2 7mm08's, a 7Mag, and a 7PRC. All of them have been used to hunt deer and elk. I've switched my deer caliber to 6mm as I was loosing too much meat with the magnum 7's.

If you don't plan on shooting an elk past ~700-800 yds, there is no reason to punish yourself with an overbore like the 28 nosler. I would be cautious loading them down as you may end up getting increased variability at the least to potentially dangerous conditions if there is too little fill volume of powder. But in reality if you are planning on shooting animals past 800 yds, you should consider a 30 cal to keep it more ethical (there is no replacement for displacement).

I can't comment on the 7 Backcountry.

The 7 PRC is a fine cartridge and if I were getting back into the game it would be at the top of my list. Now that Reloder 26 is gone, you may not get the maximum velocity out of it. It does not deter the fact that it is a modern case/cartridge design that will perform well with a number of other powders (Ramshot Grand may be very close to RL26).

Happy hunting!

Cheers,
Toby

 

[10XSHOOTER]

My last (actually, only) centerfire rifle was a 30-.06 my dad got me as a teen for deer hunting. Skip forward about 5 decades into retirement and my bucket list desire to hunt elk and pronghorn has me prowling this and other forums to come up to speed. Things have changed a bit. At this point, I’ve settled on a 7mm as a reasonable compromise for both of those game animals, but the current pace of change within that category is impressive. I have some questions that I’d be grateful to hear back on. I should add that reloading is a distinct possibility as load optimization sounds like a lot of fun. Also, I’m not particularly concerned about barrel life:

1. Regarding overbore cartridges such as the 28 Nosler, is it not true that one could use a smaller powder charge to replicate both the performance AND barrel erosion rate of one of the slightly less potent 7mm cartridges? I understand, why buy the additional capacity if you’re not going to use it, but I want to make sure I have a handle on the relevant performance aspects.
2. Regarding the 7mm Backcountry, I’ve read early claims of improved barrel life that I do not understand. Is it that with the higher chamber pressures the powder charge burns faster so one isn’t sending combusting powder down the barrel? I’d have thought that the higher pressure was detrimental to barrel life. Or are both of these true, and we really need to wait and see what the net reality will be?
3. Also re/ the 7mm BC, I’ve seen reports of excellent accuracy and reports of good but not best-in-class accuracy (I think it was a statement that extremely high chamber pressure is not optimal for accuracy). Again maybe it’s a wait and see thing, but I’m guessing that for hunting out to 500 yards or less, accuracy is likely a non-issue for this cartridge. Does that sound right?
4. Having read the fly-in-the-ointment about Hornady’s advertised performance vs. what is practically attainable with the 7mm PRC, have their been permanent/indefinite changes in gun powder availability in recent years such that it’s best to assume that Hornady’s initially published numbers are mostly out of reach for the reloader?

Thanks in advance.

I have a Rem 700 with a unfired 26" Krieger barrel and McMillan stock In 7mm Rem Mag. Cerokoted in Sniper Grey I would love to send down the road. It will make a great Elk rifle

 

[hoz53]

I hear you, although my old .30-06 is long gone so I’m starting over anyway.

oh thats a shame. would be special

 

[slm9s]

For elk 500 yards and under I think I'd be looking for a 280/280ai/7RM/7PRC, maybe even a 7-08. No need to go bigger than those. But if the 'used rack' had a bargain STW/RUM/Nosler/etc I think I could make that work also!

 

[kyotekiller25]

A 30/06 or 7 RM will both kill elk further than 95% of people have any business shooting that far...

With that said, the furthest elk kill I have is with a 7 RM/162g AMAX@2925fps at 1125 yards. Lung shot, bullet exited, spike went 30 yards and fell over dead with all 4 feet in the air.

 

[Orr89rocz]

i think you could load the 28 nosler down, with the right powders. Id still keep it in the 160-180 grain weights to do so however. I havent tried to go low with mine. Some of the starter loads are basically equivalent to hot 7 rem mag loads so not too much reduced. I have probably 600 rounds now on my shilen barrel 28 nosler and i shoot slow, never let it get more than warm to touch and clean every 20-25 or so. It looks good and still shoots good so i expect decent life. Recoil without a brake in a 12 lb long range gun setup is still pretty noticeable.
As others said, depending on range a 7 prc, rem mag or even 280 ai would likely fit the bill

 

[ELR LVR]

I'm a 7mm guy, I have 2 7mm08's, a 7Mag, and a 7PRC. All of them have been used to hunt deer and elk. I've switched my deer caliber to 6mm as I was loosing too much meat with the magnum 7's.

If you don't plan on shooting an elk past ~700-800 yds, there is no reason to punish yourself with an overbore like the 28 nosler. I would be cautious loading them down as you may end up getting increased variability at the least to potentially dangerous conditions if there is too little fill volume of powder. But in reality if you are planning on shooting animals past 800 yds, you should consider a 30 cal to keep it more ethical (there is no replacement for displacement).

I can't comment on the 7 Backcountry.

The 7 PRC is a fine cartridge and if I were getting back into the game it would be at the top of my list. Now that Reloder 26 is gone, you may not get the maximum velocity out of it. It does not deter the fact that it is a modern case/cartridge design that will perform well with a number of other powders (Ramshot Grand may be very close to RL26).

Happy hunting!

Cheers,
Toby

WHEN did RE-26 go away?!!!!!
Dang I didn't know, I was going to do more experimenting with that one

 

[SKWERLZ]

WHEN did RE-26 go away?!!!!!
Dang I didn't know, I was going to do more experimenting with that one

Midway list’s it as discontinued over a year ago

Sad as it’s magical in 7mm short and medium magnums.

 

[ELR LVR]

Midway list’s it as discontinued over a year ago

Sad as it’s magical in 7mm short and medium magnums.

Yes, thats what I read people were getting 2800 fps in a 284 with
I bought some to test in a 260 Rem for the same reason
At least I got a pound to test with and once I find my load
lol, wont be able to get any more

 

[SKWERLZ]

Yes, thats what I read people were getting 2800 fps in a 284 with
I bought some to test in a 260 Rem for the same reason
At least I got a pound to test with and once I find my load
lol, wont be able to get any more

I got enough to burn out about three barrels thankfully.
N565 is close but doesn’t have the exact same density and burn rate.

 

[Orr89rocz]

WHEN did RE-26 go away?!!!!!
Dang I didn't know, I was going to do more experimenting with that one

Its been gone for a couple yrs i think

 

[JLT]

I hope it comes back. This powder gives one another gear (or two) in quite a few chamberings. The first work up with a .243 AI and 105s had me thinking my chronograph was messed up. As it turns out, the chronograph was fine - the velocities were hard to believe.

I still have about ten pounds left. I take it hunting, so it should last me for a good while. It's not for string fire - it'll break your heart late in a string of 20.

 

[Fire Dog]

If you want a “ready to go” 7mm hunting rifle you might consider a 280AI that you can also buy factory ammo to suit, has virtually 7mm Rem Mag performance with a less punishing recoil..
Easy to load for and will drive 180gr bullets 2,850fps and 150’s-165’s over 2,900fps.
Even a tried and true 7-08 that will take virtually anything you might want to hunt and again is a “ready to go” rifle & ammo setup that won’t punish you and can be had in a “light weight” format.