223/556 Heading for Obsolescence Soon?

[DaveTooley]

There are four companies with development contracts for new SAW's. The top brass decided 6.8 would be perfect. New weapons, new round to be determined, reduced weight ammo. Some are pursuing polymer cases. Others steel heads and brass bodies. Chamber pressures between 80K and 90K PSI to get the velocity they want. What could go wrong?
338 Norma machine guns to replace 50's in some applications.
6.5 Creedmoor for sniper rifles and before it's over large frame AR's.
http://soldiersystems.net/2018/10/15/army-chief-of-staff-discusses-next-generation-squad-weapon/
http://soldiersystems.net/2018/10/0...tion-next-generation-squad-weapon-candidates/
http://soldiersystems.net/2018/10/04/161298/

 

[hogpatrol]

There are four companies with development contracts for new SAW's. The top brass decided 6.8 would be perfect. New weapons, new round to be determined, reduced weight ammo. Some are pursuing polymer cases. Others steel heads and brass bodies. Chamber pressures between 80K and 90K PSI to get the velocity they want. What could go wrong?
338 Norma machine guns to replace 50's in some applications.
6.5 Creedmoor for sniper rifles and before it's over large frame AR's.
http://soldiersystems.net/2018/10/15/army-chief-of-staff-discusses-next-generation-squad-weapon/
http://soldiersystems.net/2018/10/0...tion-next-generation-squad-weapon-candidates/
http://soldiersystems.net/2018/10/04/161298/

Gotta love the comments by Kirk on that first link. I agree with him. It's all bovine fecal matter invented to make some company more profitable, fatten their CEO's stock option plan, make it look like the gray hair brass is doing something and provide jobs for some boys & girls in flyover country. For the younger readers, this movie's reruns have been played too many times to remember.

Having said that, I'm sure these new weapon systems will lessen the main killer and maimer of our fighting men and women, IEDs and rogue soldiers.

 

[DaveTooley]

I've seen this over and over again. Leadership rotates out and the new guy has his pet project. Until recently we were busy killing bad guys. Some serious peer on peer factors that are legit.

 

[riflewoman]

 

[joshb]

This reminds me of one of my favorite bits of history trivia. During the space race, NASA spent millions and millions to develop a pen that would work in zero gravity. The Russians just used a pencil!

 

[hogpatrol]

This reminds me of one of my favorite bits of history trivia. During the space race, NASA spent millions and millions to develop a pen that would work in zero gravity. The Russians just used a pencil!

Yeah, Now we have to change to a new super duper weapon system to combat the latest and greatest that the enemy uses, those high tech AK47s and RPGs.

 

[DaveTooley]

For me it's Precision Sniper Rifle I, PSR II and now ASR. They can't select and field a damn bolt action rifle. But that's the way the acquisition system has worked for a long time. The Army just gave Sig a contract for COTS, commercial off the shelf, weapons, scopes, suppressors and optics based on immediate needs. About time somebody got their head out of their butt.

 

[DaveTooley]

Yeah, Now we have to new super duper weapons to combat the latest and greatest that the enemy uses, those high tech AK47s and RPGs.

We are always over estimating the capabilities of our enemy but as we get closer to face to face encounters with the Russians and Iranians or their surrogates, the technologies deployed are more advanced.

 

[jdh47]

Well we have plenty to talk about. The whiz kids went with the 5.56 instead of the 6.5, the original Stoner platform was designed for. The world adopted it and time goes on. They'll consider a lot of other stuff. They went with the M9 Beretta because they needed access to Italian airspace for the first Gulf War.

They make a lot of political decisions so who knows. Over the years the government hasn't been to productive when it comes to cartridge design or rifle design. It took getting our collective asses handed to us in Cuba before the brass finally decided it might be time to adopt a little better cartridge design so they just magnified the 8MM Mauser faults and all and made it a 30 cal. We did win two world wars with it and it's offspring thanks to Mr. Garand and Mr. Browning.

Whatever they do will be stimulating for conversation I'm sure.

 

[msinc]

........the Left/Democrats can no longer whine about.........

I wouldn't count on those worthless ba$tard$ "no longer" whining about anything!!!! You can safely believe that they will find something, anything else...especially if it works, does it's job and makes sense!!!!!

 

[morpheus]

They went with the M9 Beretta because they needed access to Italian airspace for the first Gulf War.

Not sure I understand this comment. The M9 Beretta was adopted in 1985 and the 1st Gulf War was not until 1991. Can you explain further?

 

[A Marsh]

This reminds me of one of my favorite bits of history trivia. During the space race, NASA spent millions and millions to develop a pen that would work in zero gravity. The Russians just used a pencil!

This story is 100% false. Both the USA and Russia started out using pencils which are not ideal. They both adopted the use of Fisher pens after they were developed privately by the Fisher company.

 

[msinc]

Not sure I understand this comment. The M9 Beretta was adopted in 1985 and the 1st Gulf War was not until 1991. Can you explain further?

Not trying to "explain further" but it is my understanding that "rent" or maybe lease money was either owed to Italy or it was coming up on the time to renegotiate the U.S. installations in Sicily and Italy. Not sure how we could "owe" anything to Italy after WWII, but okay {I am sure it had something to do with communist liberal left wing democrats}.
Whatever the case, the fix was in on the M9. The SIG was presented but not even tested and they had a case and sued....but again, the fix was already in and the lawsuit went no where. The fix was pretty obviously made for other than weapons performance reasons...not that the M9 is bad.
I always did say, a 9mm might expand, but a 45 will not shrink!!!!

 

[Bojo]

The only thing more economical from a powder consumption stand point that I load for is 22 hornet and the one I load for is done for me at about 175 ish using a 40 grain sierra hornet bullet. 223 uses 2.5 times the powder and shoots at least 2.5 as far for me. Hornet brass does not last near as long. Mil head stamp 223 brass in a bolt gun just keeps on going.

 

[drover]

I doubt that anyone on this board will be alive long enough to see the 223 become obsolete. Even if there was never another piece of brass manufactured for it there is enough out there right now to keep it going for decades, and the amount of .224 projectiles in an almost mind-numbing number of designs and weights will make the 223 a player for many, many decades.

drover

 

[Rustytigwire]

I keep 25 extra lc556 just in case of a shortage.
25 is 3 feet deep right?

 

[D.Stone]

This reminds me of one of my favorite bits of history trivia. During the space race, NASA spent millions and millions to develop a pen that would work in zero gravity. The Russians just used a pencil!

That's not exactly the truth. It's just one of those things that old people forward in emails that has almost no basis in reality.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/fact-or-fiction-nasa-spen/

 

[joshb]

That's not exactly the truth. It's just one of those things that old people forward in emails that has almost no basis in reality.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/fact-or-fiction-nasa-spen/

Well, I read it on the internet.......
Guess it sounded too good
Ya know what? I like the point of of this “urban legend”. I’ll keep it.

 

[LAH]

Hard to kill off a military round. Even the 45-70 is still doing well.

 

[JohnKielly]

Hard to kill off a military round. Even the 45-70 is still doing well.

50-70's pretty much a gone goose though.