I started this thread to gain some knowledge and to hopefully be able to share some information from testing. Please keep the BS out of it and if you aren’t sure what someone meant when they posted, then ask for clarification instead of getting flustered. Now, back to the thread, I loaded up some 109s in my BRA to find a velocity node, and I measured the base to ogive datum point with my hornady comparator and all of my rounds measured 1.8055 to 1.8060. The bullets weighed within .08 grains of each other on a FX120i. It is a small sample but hopefully it is a good representation of what to expect. Hopefully I will be able to shoot them tomorrow.
109 Long Range Hybrid vs 110 A-TIP
- Thread starter KS6mm
- Start date
looking forward to seeing how they do.
I used it because it's pretty common, and guys are switching to either the 109 or 110 from it. Just trying to illustrate that there's not much ballistic difference. The difference between the 109 and 110 would be even smaller.
newbieshooter
:-)
Thanks for the clarification!
I shot the 110 SMK at 1000 and even though they didn't shoot as good as the 110 A tip they did shoot smaller groups than the others on the relay on the average. These were under very bad conditions and cold and I wasn't sure I had the tune for that and I seen a lot hitting the dirt till they dialed in again I doubt if they were tuned either.
The comparison I would like to make is from my 100 yd. zero at 2900 the 110 shoots 2 min. flatter than a a trimmed and pointed 105 at 2998 out of a 6Br Imp. with less powder. With considerable less wind deflection and the A tip the ES. was 6 or less, I never got a chance to shoot them at 1000 but with they sorted, and the BC. and the low ES and easy as they tune they will be good. I think they may have something here with the 110's I have shot the 115's for awhile but the 110 shoots easy and small .... jim
The comparison I would like to make is from my 100 yd. zero at 2900 the 110 shoots 2 min. flatter than a a trimmed and pointed 105 at 2998 out of a 6Br Imp. with less powder. With considerable less wind deflection and the A tip the ES. was 6 or less, I never got a chance to shoot them at 1000 but with they sorted, and the BC. and the low ES and easy as they tune they will be good. I think they may have something here with the 110's I have shot the 115's for awhile but the 110 shoots easy and small .... jim
@johara1 I am hoping to match the velocity of my 107 Sierra load with the 109s, the 109s actually measured a slightly shorter bearing surface than the 107s so I’m hoping to get a similar velocity with close to the same powder, and I’m not pushing them hard. The 107s seem to pressure up early in my BRA. If I can get them to the same speed, the 109s will shoot 1.4 minutes or .5 mils(what my scope is) flatter. My barrel would shoot 105s about 25-30 FPS faster with the same charge, lots of guys saying their 105 load shoots the 109 about 25-30 slower so I’m hoping to be right in there.
I think you will find the 109 and the 105 hybrid are about the same bullet but it may compare better to the old 105 I shot back in 2011, they were about identical except a little heavier. I don't think you will see a huge difference between the pointed 107SMK and the new 109 Berger, but every little bit helps. The 110's are a huge jump in difference, but you need to try them all.... jim
urbanrifleman
Site $$ Sponsor
Did you ever try the 115 DTAC?
Oh yes and I did well with them and even shot 2" with them at a 1000. That was in 2010 and I think they may have changed now The lot of 105 Hybrids I had shot better except in a head or tail wind but I never figured it out...... jim
urbanrifleman
Site $$ Sponsor
Did you have to change your freebore to accommodate the 115?
Well, I didn't exactly get to test the 109s how I want to yet, but I did load one at each charge with Varget from 31.0 to 32.0 in .2 increments just to find pressure, I only had a 40 fps spread from 31.0 to 32.0 and my hundred yard group was .36 inches laying prone with a bag and a bipod, it is 25 degrees and windy, good results but still more testing to do. I know this may not be proper load development, but its what I had time for and a limited amount of light to shoot tonight before the ice gets here.
I shot 105’s most of last PRS season and needed to restock, so went to the 109’s since they’re newer, more farkled, and a only a couple cents more if you shop around.
Yes they’re pointed which seems nice, but the bullet base to tip variance is actually worse than the 105’s, I find that annoying if you just double check COAL like I do every 10 rounds coming off the press.
Load charge is and case prep is identical, seating depth is .010 different for best groups. They shoot “the same” out of my barrel.
105’s trued up to .547 g1, 109’s at .568 g1 for me as far as 1500 yards. but the 109’s are 20fps slower out of that barrel which offsets the minor BC advantage. I’m still hitting and missing the same stuff I was previously
Any talk of improved BC consistency is unobservable by me at 1000 yards. They do have a little more signature on a long steel plate but not much.
You’ve got to jump way up in BC or weight for there to be a noticeable improvement in ballistics. Just shoot what you have in hand now and try something new when those run out. Maybe the 110’s are magical, but the 109’s are not
Yes they’re pointed which seems nice, but the bullet base to tip variance is actually worse than the 105’s, I find that annoying if you just double check COAL like I do every 10 rounds coming off the press.
Load charge is and case prep is identical, seating depth is .010 different for best groups. They shoot “the same” out of my barrel.
105’s trued up to .547 g1, 109’s at .568 g1 for me as far as 1500 yards. but the 109’s are 20fps slower out of that barrel which offsets the minor BC advantage. I’m still hitting and missing the same stuff I was previously
Any talk of improved BC consistency is unobservable by me at 1000 yards. They do have a little more signature on a long steel plate but not much.
You’ve got to jump way up in BC or weight for there to be a noticeable improvement in ballistics. Just shoot what you have in hand now and try something new when those run out. Maybe the 110’s are magical, but the 109’s are not
Last edited:
For sure - the craziest part for me is that I had the freebore in this barrel specifically cut for 115 dtacs but i just couldn’t make them shoot well (.5’s consistently for multiple 5 shot groups at 100-300). on a whim decided to try 105’s jumping a mile and they were immediately better. not like i’m shooting .1’s or anything like some guys here but met my expectation for my setup.
as an engineer, this kind of stuff drives me nuts, but as a pragmatist i’m going to go with what is working.
as an engineer, this kind of stuff drives me nuts, but as a pragmatist i’m going to go with what is working.
You gotta use what works best for you, I was using 107 smk. I didn’t have any real trouble with them except the occasional flier or two at distance, but that could have been me or a loading issue. And I also couldn’t get as much speed out of them as I wanted to without pressure. They were a little soft on steel at 800 plus. If I can equal or exceed the accuracy of the 107s I will be happy. Especially since the cost wasn’t but a few cents more per bullet.
Upgrades & Donations
This Forum's expenses are primarily paid by member contributions. You can upgrade your Forum membership in seconds. Gold and Silver members get unlimited FREE classifieds for one year. Gold members can upload custom avatars.
Click Upgrade Membership Button ABOVE to get Gold or Silver Status.
You can also donate any amount, large or small, with the button below. Include your Forum Name in the PayPal Notes field.
To DONATE by CHECK, or make a recurring donation, CLICK HERE to learn how.
Click Upgrade Membership Button ABOVE to get Gold or Silver Status.
You can also donate any amount, large or small, with the button below. Include your Forum Name in the PayPal Notes field.
To DONATE by CHECK, or make a recurring donation, CLICK HERE to learn how.