Electric Cars -- anyone own one?

[rwj]

Fission (nuclear power plants and nuclear weapons) and fusion (stars and thermonuclear weapons) are both nuclear reactions, true, but the similarity ends there. Physicists and engineers have been working on the controlled fusion puzzle for decades, but without much success. Once that is done, though, mankind's energy worries are over - a few gallons of water (hydrogen source) could power a major city for months. A long way to go, though.

Gotta walk before ya run!

 

[Rick300]

I just got this email from Tesla as we have the Powerwall battery backup system. I copied and pasted the pertinent part:

During an Outage

• Minimize EV charging and the use of energy-intensive appliances like air-conditioners, washers, dryers and electric heaters

 

[RegionRat]

With battery storage, you have to keep a perspective on the levels of usage and the capacity of the batteries.

TLDR: have someone else check the math and teach you what it takes to meet your expectations, not the salesmen.

Just my opinion, but... Here, like too many other places in life with big ticket items, the marketing folks like to muddy up the issues. Instead of being straight and clear with folks, they tend to want to keep folks hypnotized and under their spells. Too many folks go willingly because of their environmental emotions, not because of any logical decision.

They too often find they bought into something that didn't meet their expectations, and if/when they complain, the salesmen point out the fine print and it is their tough luck.

The size of a solar array to meet your needs is something that should be researched prior to contacting sales folks. The same goes for the size of a home energy storage system, generator, fuel tank, etc..

Things like home heating and air-conditioning are not commonly understood either, but they have also been an evolution through many years worth of committees (and law suits). ASHRAE has existed since 1894, yet folks still end up with the wrong heaters and air-conditioners too often because they listened to unqualified salesmen.

It will be a very long time before regular folks learn the scales of solar or home energy storage, but only because that industry is exploiting current politics to make quick sales at the taxpayer's/consumer's expense. Eventually, that knowledge will be spread around and there will be more sanity in that market.

Buyer beware applies in bold print when it comes to things like home solar, home energy storage, etc.. Batteries have come a long way in the last 25 years, but they still have limits and so do the electronic controls we use to convert the stored energy into something useful.

If someone tries to sell you home solar or storage, and tells you it can charge your BEV, have someone else independently check their math. Caveat Emptor

 

[wedgy]

Just remember guys, there is no such thing as "renewable" energy. How can you renew energy once it is expended? How can you make it new again?

Scroll down and see the "renewables" section, pretty interesting monitor of California's electricity consumption.

California ISO - Supply, Today's Outlook

View real-time and historical data on generation resources, including renewables, currently on the system.

www.caiso.com

 

[wedgy]

^^^^^^^^
very well stated.

Of course as efficient, and clean in use as nuclear is, there is still the problem of disposal of the by product.

Disposal was my biggest concern also but I read(Prager U) that the entire waste generated by the US could fit on a football field.

 

[Rick300]

With battery storage, you have to keep a perspective on the levels of usage and the capacity of the batteries.

TLDR: have someone else check the math and teach you what it takes to meet your expectations, not the salesmen.

Just my opinion, but... Here, like too many other places in life with big ticket items, the marketing folks like to muddy up the issues. Instead of being straight and clear with folks, they tend to want to keep folks hypnotized and under their spells. Too many folks go willingly because of their environmental emotions, not because of any logical decision.

They too often find they bought into something that didn't meet their expectations, and if/when they complain, the salesmen point out the fine print and it is their tough luck.

The size of a solar array to meet your needs is something that should be researched prior to contacting sales folks. The same goes for the size of a home energy storage system, generator, fuel tank, etc..

Things like home heating and air-conditioning are not commonly understood either, but they have also been an evolution through many years worth of committees (and law suits). ASHRAE has existed since 1894, yet folks still end up with the wrong heaters and air-conditioners too often because they listened to unqualified salesmen.

It will be a very long time before regular folks learn the scales of solar or home energy storage, but only because that industry is exploiting current politics to make quick sales at the taxpayer's/consumer's expense. Eventually, that knowledge will be spread around and there will be more sanity in that market.

Buyer beware applies in bold print when it comes to things like home solar, home energy storage, etc.. Batteries have come a long way in the last 25 years, but they still have limits and so do the electronic controls we use to convert the stored energy into something useful.

If someone tries to sell you home solar or storage, and tells you it can charge your BEV, have someone else independently check their math. Caveat Emptor

I don't own an EV so it doesn't apply to me, but I was amused by them saying to minimize charging during extreme weather. Seems to me that would be the time to make sure your battery is fully charged.
Our solar system is 13 years old now and still produces enough energy to charge the 3 Tesla batteries and then some. We have frequent power outages here and the only way I know it is by the noise of all the neighbors generators.
I'm a big fan of solar energy for (voluntary) household use, but I think it's still in it's infancy and will only get better with time. I just don't want the government telling me I have to have it.

 

[HenWinter]

I thought about buying an electric car, but then read about the operation of electric vehicles in different seasons and changed my mind. An EV can be good if you drive from home to work and don't plan to travel on it. I also read about the operation of electric vehicles in different seasons https://howtechhack.com/the-operation-of-electric-vehicles-in-different-seasons/ Except for the lack of charging infrastructure, you might face issues in winter like reduced battery capacity and charging speed, unpredictable range, the need to warm up the battery, the danger of battery freezing, and power limitation. It seems to me that EVs are not for everyone.

 

[JSH]

Been reading up on these and not sure what to believe ? I would rather hear it from an owner. Two sides to every story

I keep seeing this post pop up for some reason. So I will respond.
Yes I have an electric car, several of them actually. They are all in storage, in various states of disarray. Honestly pile not tell you the last time I laid eyes or hands on them. They were a lot of fun for a number of years. As fast and responsive as you hear about. The one down fall was the did not handle well on curves and turns at 3/4-full throttle.
They tend to come out of the SLOT and fly across the room and bounce off the living room wall.
That is my experience with electric cars.

 

[JayHHI6818]

Electric cars soaked by saltwater from hurricane go up in flames, Florida officials say

Read more at: https://www.miamiherald.com/news/state/florida/article278835624.html#storylink=cpy

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/state/florida/article278835624.html

 

[Brians356]

Our solar system is 13 years old now

Where do you live, anyway? My solar system is 4.5 billion years old.
-

 

[Brians356]

Electric cars soaked by saltwater from hurricane go up in flames, Florida officials say

They would have been totaled even if they hadn't burned. That's the real story people ought to ponder. Generally speaking, while it's unwise to drive through water up to your door sills, in an emergency it ain't going to instantly total your ICE vehicle.
-

 

[rr2030]

Have any EV's other than Tesla burst in flames from the salt water?

 

[Brians356]

^^^^^^^^
very well stated.

Of course as efficient, and clean in use as nuclear is, there is still the problem of disposal of the by product.

Not with the modern reactor designs such as France and Sweden, reversing course, have decided to stake their energy futures on.
-

 

[COLT45SA]

When EVs first showed up I said it was the wrong way to go, and that hydrogen was the only way. I applaud Cummins for their dive into the market. If they can get an on-board-hydrogen-generator incorporated in the power train, they will be the Tesla of the hydrogen power world~!

 

[Brians356]

When EVs first showed up I said it was the wrong way to go, and that hydrogen was the only way. I applaud Cummins for their dive into the market. If they can get an on-board-hydrogen-generator incorporated in the power train, they will be the Tesla of the hydrogen power world~!

Do you have a link to an article about Cummins' breakthrough approach? I ask because of an article I read in Forbes magazine "Why Are We Still Talking About Hydrogen" (emphasis added)

The flaw is basically caused by the laws of physics. For hydrogen to be completely green, it must be produced by electrolyzing water, which splits this into the H2 and O that it is made of. You can produce H2 from fossil fuels (usually methane), but this creates either “grey” hydrogen (which still produces lots of CO2) or “blue” hydrogen (which captures 90% of the CO2 and stores it, merely delaying the problem). Only electrolyzing hydrogen from water using electricity generated from renewable sources makes the fuel entirely green. This is an inefficient system that wastes energy. According to a frequently cited study by Transport & Environment, the process of electrolyzing hydrogen already loses 30% of the energy from the process of splitting the H2 from the O. You then have another 26% loss of the remaining energy from transporting the hydrogen to the fuel station, meaning you’ve already lost a total of 48% of the energy before any hydrogen makes it into a vehicle. You can save some of this by making hydrogen on site, but electrolysis plants cost millions, so they will more likely be centralized. In comparison, the typical loss from transferring electricity over wires to a charging station is just 5%, so you still have 95% left.

So Cummins may be planning to make hydrogen "on site" (i.e. onboard a truck or locomotive) but that smells highly aspirational (like nuclear fusion power) rather than just packaging it up before roll-out.

Why Are We Still Talking About Hydrogen?

Hydrogen is still being pitched as the miracle fuel to solve all our environmental issues with transport. But it has a major flaw that must mean it will never be the ideal choice over batteries for personal vehicles.

www.forbes.com

PS I cannot find anything on Cummins' web site about onboard hydrogen generation. I do find crowing about selling so-called "green" stationary generation plants subsidized by you, the taxpayer:

... since the passing of the U.S. Bipartisan Infrastructure Law and Inflation Reduction Act, the business has received committed orders for nearly 300 megawatts (MW) of electrolyzer projects in North America. In total, these projects will produce approximately 150 tons of hydrogen per day once commissioned by the end of 2026.
-

 

[Txhillbilly]

As of yesterday, a new law in Texas will make owner's of electric vehicles to pay an extra $200 each time they register their vehicle each year. They also will add on another $400 to any new electric vehicle purchased for registration fees starting 9-1-23.
The state wants this extra money since electric vehicle's don't pay any fuel taxes.

 

[jackieschmidt]

As of yesterday, a new law in Texas will make owner's of electric vehicles to pay an extra $200 each time they register their vehicle each year. They also will add on another $400 to any new electric vehicle purchased for registration fees starting 9-1-23.
The state wants this extra money since electric vehicle's don't pay any fuel taxes.

That is correct. I got a notice that when my BOLT EUV comes up for inspection and registration in 2024, a $200 fee will be added to the cost of non payment of Hyway taxes because of non gasoline purchase.

I am on a pace to top 30,000 miles a year, (just rolled over 18,000), so that’s not such a big deal.

I certainly have no problem with this.

 

[M-61]

Life has been especially kind to you.
No problem with the extra $200.00 and my guess is the 400.0 won’t bother you either
“Not a big deal “, how fortunate for you.

 

[rr2030]

So now EV owners will pay for upkeep on the roads as well as the national grid ?

 

[Brians356]

So now EV owners will pay for upkeep on the roads as well as the national grid ?

Well, if you think about it (novel idea?) every taxpayer pays for upkeep of all infrastructure. It's just that EV drivers caught a bit of a break in the road usage, for a while, in most states. And the $200 fee for Jackie could still be something of a break, depending ...
-