Savage model 10 hard extraction 6 creedmoor

[DLT]

On my 4th firing of my brass while shooting distance on sunday I noticed I had to wrestle with the bolt to get my fired brass out of the chamber, not super fond of how savage does their primary extraction. The bolt handle makes contact halfway down the ramp of the baffle. Have not noticed any such problems on the previous 3 firings. Details

6mm creedmoor 26” barrel
Anneal prior to sizing every firing, adg brass partially through 4th firing
Federal 200 primer
39.5 H4350
Sierra 107mk
2975 fps
Fired case - 1.537
Sized case - 1.536
Redding full length sizer

My fired cases are a little snug to get back into the chamber have to get firm with bolt to make it close. My sized cases go in easy and will come out on their own with rifle tilted. Maybe a little advise from people who have had the same issue Thanks in advance

 

[RegionRat]

A measurement of the case diameter at the 200 line is in order.


See the difference where the print shows the cartridges at 0.4703 versus the chambers at 0.4714
Now examine your virgin brass, 1X brass, versus 4X brass and see how they look at that line.
While we are at it, grab the diameters at the shoulders too.

 

[DLT]

A measurement of the case diameter at the 200 line is in order.
View attachment 1467000

See the difference where the print shows the cartridges at 0.4703 versus the chambers at 0.4714
Now examine your virgin brass, 1X brass, versus 4X brass and see how they look at that line.
While we are at it, grab the diameters at the shoulders too.

I will get those tomorrow, my good calipers is at work, I have 50 new pieces left but no once fired. Why do you think it has shown up on the 4th firing ?

 

[RegionRat]

Take those values with a micrometer, not a caliper. The diameters are more sensitive and you need more certainty when you measure these.

It takes some time for cases to fully expand. It is usually the situation that we have clickers or extraction problems after a few cycles if the brass, chamber, and dies are not coordinated. The brass and pressure of the load is what determines how many cycles it takes.

Have a study of the way your cycled brass checks out before and after sizing, and compared to virgin.
We don't know the diameters of your chamber, or your dies for sure, but we can certainly study the brass for now.

 

[DLT]

Take those values with a micrometer, not a caliper. The diameters are more sensitive and you need more certainty when you measure these.

It takes some time for cases to fully expand. It is usually the situation that we have clickers or extraction problems after a few cycles if the brass, chamber, and dies are not coordinated. The brass and pressure of the load is what determines how many cycles it takes.

Have a study of the way your cycled brass checks out before and after sizing, and compared to virgin.
We don't know the diameters of your chamber, or your dies for sure, but we can certainly study the brass for now.

Will do, I have a set or 3 at work also, I have new brass, sized with 3 firings, and fired which was the fourth cycle. I don’t mind trying another flavor of die but the rifle shoots extremely well for a factory gun.

 

[DLT]

A measurement of the case diameter at the 200 line is in order.
View attachment 1467000

See the difference where the print shows the cartridges at 0.4703 versus the chambers at 0.4714
Now examine your virgin brass, 1X brass, versus 4X brass and see how they look at that line.
While we are at it, grab the diameters at the shoulders too.

Here is my measurements, new, sized after 3 firings in the middle, and 4th firing on the bottom. One more thing, I am using the redding competition shelll holders to get my .001 shoulder bump if I went down one more shell holder would that size further down the body because it would allow the case to go deeper into the die but would give me .003 shoulder bump

 

[pdog06]

You could also mark the fired case with a sharpie around the .200 line and also around the neck and shoulder. Then push it into the chamber without the bolt till it stops, which should be the point of contact that is giving you the hard bolt lift/extraction. It will leave a mark in the sharpie’d area where that point is.
More than likely it will be at the .200 line but I would do both.
I have been told that a RCBS die tends to be a little tighter than a Redding? I had trouble believing that, but ran into your exact issue with some brass at the .200 line. So I ran a RCBS 6.5cm body die over my 6br brass(longer cartridge die so it would only hit the bottom 1/2” of the brass and not the neck/shoulder), and it did in fact size the .200 line smaller than my Redding 6br die.
I’m thinking a small base die would be the answer, but the shell holder should also allow the brass to go further into the die. Worth a shot

 

[BlueWater]

On my 4th firing of my brass ... Have not noticed any such problems on the previous 3 firings.

Another thing to consider might be the cleaning regimen around the lugs (bolt and receiver surfaces).

On a Savage 12, I'd been using BoreTech's Eliminator and CU+2 products. But I had been neglecting complete cleaning of the bolt lugs and the engagement area on the receiver. Over time, it resulted in a sticky gunge causing troublesome bolt lift. More-diligent cleaning of that area along with use of a proper bore guide for the rod eliminated the issue. (Strange, but my same original regimen when used on 25yrs of other rifles never caused a problem, but on this Savage 12 it did. An altered regimen, though, turns out cleaner and with better results.)

 

[jepp2]

Take those values with a micrometer, not a caliper.

Agree! Best taken with a blade micrometer reading to 0.0001" A few ten thousandths can make the difference.

 

[DLT]

Agree! Best taken with a blade micrometer reading to 0.0001" A few ten thousandths can make the difference.

I don’t have access to a blade mic.

 

[DLT]

You could also mark the fired case with a sharpie around the .200 line and also around the neck and shoulder. Then push it into the chamber without the bolt till it stops, which should be the point of contact that is giving you the hard bolt lift/extraction. It will leave a mark in the sharpie’d area where that point is.
More than likely it will be at the .200 line but I would do both.
I have been told that a RCBS die tends to be a little tighter than a Redding? I had trouble believing that, but ran into your exact issue with some brass at the .200 line. So I ran a RCBS 6.5cm body die over my 6br brass(longer cartridge die so it would only hit the bottom 1/2” of the brass and not the neck/shoulder), and it did in fact size the .200 line smaller than my Redding 6br die.
I’m thinking a small base die would be the answer, but the shell holder should also allow the brass to go further into the die. Worth a shot

I did do that last night. I ran a sharpie ring around the shoulder just at the body shoulder junction and a thick mark all over the .200 line. When I pushed it in snug with my finger and got the bolt to close and pulled case back out the sharpie at the shoulder was making contact but not at the .200 line see pix. Might need to mark up whole case to see where exactly it is contacting

 

[DHuffman]

Is it a factory bolt handle or replacement? I've noticed most aftermarket handles are thinner not giving as much extraction.
From your measurements a die that sizes more at the .200 line would help.

 

[DLT]

Is it a factory bolt handle or replacement? I've noticed most aftermarket handles are thinner not giving as much extraction.
From your measurements a die that sizes more at the .200 line would help.

It’s the factory handle

 

[fkimble@charter.net]

Lot of rings around that case body? The very end of the neck has a shiney ring. Do they need trimming?

Frank

 

[DHuffman]

It’s the factory handle

There are a few aftermarket handles thicker in the rear, unfortunately it's been too long and I can't remember which.
It does make a difference though.

 

[DLT]

Lot of rings around that case body? The very end of the neck has a shiney ring. Do they need trimming?

Frank

I have checked length with a bore scope. That was my first initial thought was I had let them grow too long but they still are not butting up to the leade although very close. The rings are from the chamber and seen from the first firing but no issues with extraction until now. My chamber is clean it’s not scarred up or gummed up with carbon or solvents or oils

 

[DLT]

There are a few aftermarket handles thicker in the rear, unfortunately it's been too long and I can't remember which.
It does make a difference though.

I’d like to know which ones. This one leaves a lot on the table

 

[DLT]

If it is indeed a “clicker” why does sizes brass chamber so easy ? If a die doesn’t size down to the .200 line I would think they should be snug to chamber. Another question if I may, if new brass measures .469 wouldn’t it take just 1 firing to expand to where it is now at .471 or is it because the brass is much thicker towards the base it takes a few firings to expand ?

 

[6MMsteve]

I did do that last night. I ran a sharpie ring around the shoulder just at the body shoulder junction and a thick mark all over the .200 line. When I pushed it in snug with my finger and got the bolt to close and pulled case back out the sharpie at the shoulder was making contact but not at the .200 line see pix. Might need to mark up whole case to see where exactly it is contacting View attachment 1467034

why is the case so rough lookin, maybe a small chamber polish job, I'm not a gunsmith but that chamber is rough looking

 

[DLT]

why is the case so rough lookin, maybe a small chamber polish job, I'm not a gunsmith but that chamber is rough looking

Those lines are more visual than anything. Yes the chamber caused it but you can’t feel them at all on the case. Wouldn’t hurt to polish it some though