COVID-19 Map worldwide, with statistics
- Thread starter DIBBS
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I keep wondering why antibody testing has any significance at all given that the WHO (apparently the gold standard health organization run by certified 3rd World medical system rejects) says there is absolutely no evidence such testing has any benefit!!!
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cn...s/who-immunity-antibodies-covid-19/index.html
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Brians356
Gold $$ Contributor
That CNN headline said (back on 25 April) "WHO says no evidence shows that having coronavirus prevents a second infection." Fair enough. However, there was also no evidence showing that having coronavirus does not prevent a second infection.
What the headline should have said (but wouldn't have been panic-inducing enough for CNN) was "Post-infection Immunity Still Uncertain".
But to the real point of your statement "there is absolutely no evidence such testing has any benefit": The main goal of antibody testing is to determine what percentage of the population have been exposed to the virus.
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And what is the purpose of that goal if in the end it’s meaningless?? Seems pretty easy to determine if antibodies confer future immunity.
ronsatspokane
Gold $$ Contributor
This should be a rhetorical question since nearly everyone knows the answer. However some are addicted to the dystopian narrative being painted by the MSM and have no clue as to the root of the question let alone the answer. It happened when some governors became intoxicated by the power in their hands and when some realized (essentially the same intoxicated group) that economic destruction was a path to political victory for their party. Both of those happened before the curve was ever flattened and now that it has been, the narrative has become one in which no life is to precious when all lives can become dependent on government and a political aristocracy. Welcome to the former Soviet Union, the China of Mao and the Venezuela of Chavez. Things are going to get ugly. They already are.
https://www.civilbeat.org/2020/04/chad-blair-how-long-can-our-civil-liberties-be-suspended/
https://www.voanews.com/covid-19-pandemic/european-governments-face-gray-revolt
https://www.seattletimes.com/nation...ho-threatens-to-undermine-coronavirus-orders/
https://reason.com/2020/05/14/wisco...the-rule-of-law-and-the-separation-of-powers/
Here in Eastern WA, we are ignoring the Governor of Seattle. He doesn't even know where Eastern WA is.
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I've been working from home since this thing kicked off, and mainly binge watch Fox News. Throw in Outdoor Channel for some nice hunting/shooting shows.
While we don't want unknown carriers infecting others, and elderly/people with underlying conditions are at a much higher risk, overall, young and middle age folks seem to be at very low risk of major symptoms and/or death.
Everything in life is a risk and a reward. And we weigh those every time we do something.
If every single life must be saved for everything in the world that could kill us, lets stop driving automobiles. Stop having trucks, trains, airplanes move commodities and people. Shut down all factories and industrialization.
We can go back to the stone age (and a huge number of people will die of starvation as we do that).
Or we can use common sense.
Most of us in a work setting of any kind (including shoulder to shoulder in a meat packing plant/manufacturing, etc) will live, even if exposed. The Sioux Falls SD pork plant is 60 miles from me. Hundreds of employees were infected. I know 2 died, don't know if there were more. One was retirement age and the TV pic showed very heavy/obese. Two strikes for him, and the virus took his life. Plant not fully operational yet (may be closed, I'm not sure) SD Governor said weeks ago the Feds will decide when it opens. Geeze, that will take forever.
81% of the Minnesota deaths were in nursing homes. I think it was 60%+ in NY.
Lets use common sense, let the CDC, big gov't tell us the risks and mitigation techniques (not mandatory procedures), but let us get on with a life worth living.
While we don't want unknown carriers infecting others, and elderly/people with underlying conditions are at a much higher risk, overall, young and middle age folks seem to be at very low risk of major symptoms and/or death.
Everything in life is a risk and a reward. And we weigh those every time we do something.
If every single life must be saved for everything in the world that could kill us, lets stop driving automobiles. Stop having trucks, trains, airplanes move commodities and people. Shut down all factories and industrialization.
We can go back to the stone age (and a huge number of people will die of starvation as we do that).
Or we can use common sense.
Most of us in a work setting of any kind (including shoulder to shoulder in a meat packing plant/manufacturing, etc) will live, even if exposed. The Sioux Falls SD pork plant is 60 miles from me. Hundreds of employees were infected. I know 2 died, don't know if there were more. One was retirement age and the TV pic showed very heavy/obese. Two strikes for him, and the virus took his life. Plant not fully operational yet (may be closed, I'm not sure) SD Governor said weeks ago the Feds will decide when it opens. Geeze, that will take forever.
81% of the Minnesota deaths were in nursing homes. I think it was 60%+ in NY.
Lets use common sense, let the CDC, big gov't tell us the risks and mitigation techniques (not mandatory procedures), but let us get on with a life worth living.
Brians356
Gold $$ Contributor
According to Minnesota's published data, the median age of Covid-19 decedents is 83 years. 80% of all deaths in MN had been in long-term care facilities. Combining those LTCF deaths and decedents who had co-morbidities, the total is 99.2%. That's not a typo.
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Brians356
Gold $$ Contributor
Apocalypse Averted:
From PJmedia.com (15 May, 2020)
In The Atlantic, Amanda Mull’s dispatch anticipating Georgia’s apocalyptic future (29 April 2020) was entitled simply, “Georgia’s Experiment in Human Sacrifice: The state is about to find out how many people need to lose their lives to shore up the economy.” According to her reporting, though Georgians chafed under lockdown, there was no serious insurrectionary sentiment among the people when Kemp announced his intention to relax restrictions on service industries. “Georgians are now the largely unwilling canaries in an invisible coal mine,” she wrote, “sent to find out just how many individuals need to lose their job or their life for a state to work through a plague.”
“Public health experts fear coronavirus will burn through Georgia like nothing has since William Tecumseh Sherman,” read a florid analogy from the Washington Post’s Dana Milbank. His tongue-in-cheek piece, “Georgia leads the race to become America’s No. 1 Death Destination,” toyed with the notion that Peach State residents were dying to work out at their local gyms including “CrossImmunity” and “Superspreader” boot camp. Cosmetologists could perform a “deep lung-tissue massage.” Restaurant-goers could enjoy “wet-market-to-table restaurants to experience a growing sampling of zoonotic dishes.” This columnist clearly enjoyed the time he spent crafting witty prose around the prospect of plague.
Those who did not strike either an authoritative or flippant tone struck a more somber note. “Mark this day,” Ron Fournier wrote on April 20. “Because two and three weeks from now, the Georgia death toll is blood on his hands. And as Georgians move around the country, they’ll spread more death and economic destruction.”
Florida’s DeSantis was, according to state Rep. Debbie Mucarsel-Powell, “reckless, premature, and irresponsible” to allow municipalities to reopen their coasts in mid-April. When stores began reopening, the Miami Herald (12 April 2020) editorial board accused the governor of serving up his state’s citizens as a sacrifice in return for some imagined “political favor” from the president. As recently as this week, the Washington Post’s Ben Terris and Josh Dawsey described DeSantis as the prototypical “Florida Man”—a “devil-may-care and slightly oafish, beloved but not admired” cliché of a human being.
How did all that human sacrifice work out? Caseloads have declined in Florida and Georgia since the lockdowns were eased by Republican governors who were denounced for ignoring “the science.” And so have deaths (http://91-divoc.com/, new deaths moving 7-day average) with Georgia's peak shown on 20 April (the same day Ron Fournier said we should "Mark this day"!)
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From PJmedia.com (15 May, 2020)
In The Atlantic, Amanda Mull’s dispatch anticipating Georgia’s apocalyptic future (29 April 2020) was entitled simply, “Georgia’s Experiment in Human Sacrifice: The state is about to find out how many people need to lose their lives to shore up the economy.” According to her reporting, though Georgians chafed under lockdown, there was no serious insurrectionary sentiment among the people when Kemp announced his intention to relax restrictions on service industries. “Georgians are now the largely unwilling canaries in an invisible coal mine,” she wrote, “sent to find out just how many individuals need to lose their job or their life for a state to work through a plague.”
“Public health experts fear coronavirus will burn through Georgia like nothing has since William Tecumseh Sherman,” read a florid analogy from the Washington Post’s Dana Milbank. His tongue-in-cheek piece, “Georgia leads the race to become America’s No. 1 Death Destination,” toyed with the notion that Peach State residents were dying to work out at their local gyms including “CrossImmunity” and “Superspreader” boot camp. Cosmetologists could perform a “deep lung-tissue massage.” Restaurant-goers could enjoy “wet-market-to-table restaurants to experience a growing sampling of zoonotic dishes.” This columnist clearly enjoyed the time he spent crafting witty prose around the prospect of plague.
Those who did not strike either an authoritative or flippant tone struck a more somber note. “Mark this day,” Ron Fournier wrote on April 20. “Because two and three weeks from now, the Georgia death toll is blood on his hands. And as Georgians move around the country, they’ll spread more death and economic destruction.”
Florida’s DeSantis was, according to state Rep. Debbie Mucarsel-Powell, “reckless, premature, and irresponsible” to allow municipalities to reopen their coasts in mid-April. When stores began reopening, the Miami Herald (12 April 2020) editorial board accused the governor of serving up his state’s citizens as a sacrifice in return for some imagined “political favor” from the president. As recently as this week, the Washington Post’s Ben Terris and Josh Dawsey described DeSantis as the prototypical “Florida Man”—a “devil-may-care and slightly oafish, beloved but not admired” cliché of a human being.
How did all that human sacrifice work out? Caseloads have declined in Florida and Georgia since the lockdowns were eased by Republican governors who were denounced for ignoring “the science.” And so have deaths (http://91-divoc.com/, new deaths moving 7-day average) with Georgia's peak shown on 20 April (the same day Ron Fournier said we should "Mark this day"!)
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Brians356
Gold $$ Contributor
The University of Minnesota School of Public Health has posted Martha Coventry’s backgrounder on the Minnesota Model in “Modeling COVID-19 for Minnesota.” Coventry relates the projections on which Governor Walz premised his March 25 shutdown order:
“One projection showed that cases would peak around April 26 in Minnesota if there were no mitigating steps to slow the virus. The death toll in this scenario could reach 74,000. The other scenario showed a time frame with significant and staged mitigations in place that pushed the peak to about June 29 and projected deaths in the 50,000–55,000 range.” Quotable quote (research assistant Marina Kinkeide): “Yes, numbers may look grim, but they are what we’re getting. You can’t argue with what you see.”
Minnesota deaths to date? 683. So much for models, and those who cling to them. And 98.8 percent of all deaths attributed to COVID-19 occurred among residents of long-term care facilities or others with serious underlying conditions (sometimes several of them).
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“One projection showed that cases would peak around April 26 in Minnesota if there were no mitigating steps to slow the virus. The death toll in this scenario could reach 74,000. The other scenario showed a time frame with significant and staged mitigations in place that pushed the peak to about June 29 and projected deaths in the 50,000–55,000 range.” Quotable quote (research assistant Marina Kinkeide): “Yes, numbers may look grim, but they are what we’re getting. You can’t argue with what you see.”
Minnesota deaths to date? 683. So much for models, and those who cling to them. And 98.8 percent of all deaths attributed to COVID-19 occurred among residents of long-term care facilities or others with serious underlying conditions (sometimes several of them).
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There are two main points to everything being done, economic shutdown, social isolating, testing, etc.
1 The disease is being spread by those who are infected, contagious but asymptomatic or presymptomatic. The "super spreaders" are the 20 to 29 year olds who typically are asymptomatic and fearless so they are predisposed to gather in large groups and party, ignoring social distancing guidelines and refusing to wear masks. Compounding the situation is that apparently, refusing to wear a mask has also become a political ideology.
2 So far only about 3 percent of the population has been infected, as confirmed by active infection based tests. This number will surely rise as post infection tests confirm asymptomatic but recovered cases, but whatever the current actual case count is, the other 90+ percent of the populations is still vulnerable until widespread inoculation becomes available. If we overtax the hospitals by carelessly spreading the disease, a lot more of us will die rather than recover from an infection, and in so doing possibly take a few hospital workers with us.
Whereas it takes but a few seconds to make an N95 mask, it takes years to make a Nurse or Doctor.
This website allows the user to look at various aspects of the pandemic. Tabs at the top allow filters and present information in clear context.https://coronavirusgraphs.com/?c=cd&y=linear&t=bar_cumulative&f=0&ct=&co=2
No matter how you look at it, we're still seeing 20,000 to 25,000 new cases every day for the last 7 weeks. There has been no significant decline in the spread to warrant loosening of restrictions, and worse, the forecast model is showing a significant upward trend. The mathematical models that were much maligned in weeks past have been much more right than wrong. There's no reason to doubt them out of hand now.
We're in this for the long haul, and as Hans Solo said in Star Wars, "don't get cocky, kid", if we're overconfident in opening up the economy now, we'll risk getting slaughtered later.
For now, all we can do is to be smart, wash hands frequently, wear a mask, and stay away from large groups.
1 The disease is being spread by those who are infected, contagious but asymptomatic or presymptomatic. The "super spreaders" are the 20 to 29 year olds who typically are asymptomatic and fearless so they are predisposed to gather in large groups and party, ignoring social distancing guidelines and refusing to wear masks. Compounding the situation is that apparently, refusing to wear a mask has also become a political ideology.
2 So far only about 3 percent of the population has been infected, as confirmed by active infection based tests. This number will surely rise as post infection tests confirm asymptomatic but recovered cases, but whatever the current actual case count is, the other 90+ percent of the populations is still vulnerable until widespread inoculation becomes available. If we overtax the hospitals by carelessly spreading the disease, a lot more of us will die rather than recover from an infection, and in so doing possibly take a few hospital workers with us.
Whereas it takes but a few seconds to make an N95 mask, it takes years to make a Nurse or Doctor.
This website allows the user to look at various aspects of the pandemic. Tabs at the top allow filters and present information in clear context.https://coronavirusgraphs.com/?c=cd&y=linear&t=bar_cumulative&f=0&ct=&co=2
No matter how you look at it, we're still seeing 20,000 to 25,000 new cases every day for the last 7 weeks. There has been no significant decline in the spread to warrant loosening of restrictions, and worse, the forecast model is showing a significant upward trend. The mathematical models that were much maligned in weeks past have been much more right than wrong. There's no reason to doubt them out of hand now.
We're in this for the long haul, and as Hans Solo said in Star Wars, "don't get cocky, kid", if we're overconfident in opening up the economy now, we'll risk getting slaughtered later.
For now, all we can do is to be smart, wash hands frequently, wear a mask, and stay away from large groups.
ronsatspokane
Gold $$ Contributor
Actually it appears that the number of infected is significantly greater than what has been reported. The Santa Clara County study show perhaps 80 times higher. If that holds in other areas then the models are once again off by many orders of magnitude. Time to open up and limit access to nursing homes rather than ship Covid patients to nursing homes as they did in New York.
As testing availability increases, infection numbers will increase simply because we are catching more of the people who had it with mild symptoms. Hospitalizations and deaths are the metrics to watch. That said, they are likely over reporting deaths by as much as 20%.
Also, they should provide a report of ALL hospitalizations and deaths that occur each day by disease. If they did that, vs just hyping COVID, we'd all have a different perspective. The lockdown left may never come out........
Also, they should provide a report of ALL hospitalizations and deaths that occur each day by disease. If they did that, vs just hyping COVID, we'd all have a different perspective. The lockdown left may never come out........
Brians356
Gold $$ Contributor
If Covid-19 was not killing anyone, no sane person would think a lockdown necessary, and few people would even know what the term "Covid-19" refers to. With that in mind, show me one model's prediction WRT deaths under strict social distancing ("lockdown") conditions, that was much more right than wrong.
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jds holler
Gold $$ Contributor
At no other time in our national history would this event have caused anything close to this "economic shut-down".
It probably would have been known as "The City Flu" or some other name that described it as a disease that most of us didn't have to worry much about, and life would have proceeded as usual.
City and small towns, counties and states which barely had a presence of the virus would have laughed at the idea of shutting down their businesses and local economies because of it.
The tragedy of people dying from it would have been sobering and real, but that has always been the reality of "real life".
The reasons that things have gotten to this point disgust me, and I believe would have repulsed our better ancestors who fought, and died by droves to provide the "Free America" that we are throwing away because of craven fear, and supposed safety. jd
It probably would have been known as "The City Flu" or some other name that described it as a disease that most of us didn't have to worry much about, and life would have proceeded as usual.
City and small towns, counties and states which barely had a presence of the virus would have laughed at the idea of shutting down their businesses and local economies because of it.
The tragedy of people dying from it would have been sobering and real, but that has always been the reality of "real life".
The reasons that things have gotten to this point disgust me, and I believe would have repulsed our better ancestors who fought, and died by droves to provide the "Free America" that we are throwing away because of craven fear, and supposed safety. jd
Brians356
Gold $$ Contributor
Deaths are what count. The common cold viruses are also coronaviruses. Nearly every one of the billions of humans on Earth are infected with a common cold virus, on average 2 or 3 times per year (children even more frequently). Yet deaths are so rare that there's no reason to spend time and $$ trying to "cure" or create vaccines against those coronaviruses.
Covid-19, like most flu viruses, does kill a lot of people. But Covid-19 is still not much deadlier than a typical "bad" flu season. If Covid-19 deaths are declining while states reopen, why wring your hands about what so-called models "predict"?
In fact, deaths from Covid-19 are declining significantly nationwide, and especially since around 19 April when many states started easing their lock-downs, and since around 7 May many more states have eased their lock-downs. In fact, as of two days ago only 15 states remain under statewide lock-downs. And 8 states are now 100% open, no restrictions at all.
On this graph I have annotated 19 April as the date states started reopening:
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The highest yearly death count for seasonal flu in the past decade in the U.S. is estimated to be 61,000. By the end of May COVID-19 will have killed around 100,000 Americans in two months.
ronsatspokane
Gold $$ Contributor
Malaria season is here. Much bigger problem in the US than people think. Dengue fever is on it's way as well. Perhaps the entire population of the world should be locked down until all these disease's that plague mankind are gone.
Brians356
Gold $$ Contributor
Rounding up from Worldometer's 91,000? Fair enough. I said "not much deadlier". Also fair enough?
"We lost 80,000 people last year to the flu." Robert Redfield, CDCP Director (Sep 2018) (https://www.statnews.com/2018/09/26/cdc-us-flu-deaths-winter/)
For perspective, suppose we subtract the 28,000 deaths just in the grossly (criminally?) mismanaged state of New York. What are we left with in the vast remainder of the US?
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