Wolves

[284winner]

You can blame your State's Constitution for that, not the Feds.

Well the DNR fought this case for over a year. In the end they lost and the cute little Gray Wolf is back on the protected list. Can't reply to the states Constitution and all it's particulars but we did have a wolf season. It was a draw as our bear and elk seasons are. The tree huggers ALMOST got our bear season shut down but sportsman edged out that win. 75% of the wolf licenses were purchased by anti hunters as it was when we did have the season open. The good part is, unlimited tags were sold until the number of wolves killed hit the dnrs target number. I blame who issued the protection order without researching the management plan the DNR had in place due to the wolf problems we had here. I do believe the feds initially lifted the protection of the wolves in 2013 allowing a hunt. Then it came to a vote where sportsman lost by numbers and they were listed as protected again. I believe it simply should be a Michigan DNR management decision and not a vote. If the DNR see a reason to manage based on facts of damage by wolves or any wildlife species, they should manage appropriately. Just as they do our bears and elk.

 

[JRS]

Well the DNR fought this case for over a year. In the end they lost and the cute little Gray Wolf is back on the protected list. Can't reply to the states Constitution and all it's particulars but we did have a wolf season. It was a draw as our bear and elk seasons are. The tree huggers ALMOST got our bear season shut down but sportsman edged out that win. 75% of the wolf licenses were purchased by anti hunters as it was when we did have the season open. The good part is, unlimited tags were sold until the number of wolves killed hit the dnrs target number. I blame who issued the protection order without researching the management plan the DNR had in place due to the wolf problems we had here.

The wolf was delisted by the Feds, and your State Constitution protects them. With each passing year, fewer and fewer people are purchasing hunting licenses, and hunting. It's happening all over the country.

 

[284winner]

The wolf was delisted by the Feds, and your State Constitution protects them. With each passing year, fewer and fewer people are purchasing hunting licenses, and hunting. It's happening all over the country.

I agree that hunting is in the decline nation wide. Happening for a variety of reasons. I do not believe the states Constitution has caused wolf protection. If you mean because this issue comes to a vote here in our state, then yes you are correct. Yes the feds have tried to delist the wolves on several occasions only successful one time. Voting and several losses have ended the wolf management in this state. Either way, this is a bad decision and is creating problems in many isolated areas in the U.P.

 

[JRS]

I agree that hunting is in the decline nation wide. Happening for a variety of reasons. I do not believe the states Constitution has caused wolf protection. If you mean because this issue comes to a vote here in our state, then yes you are correct. Yes the feds have tried to delist the wolves on several occasions only successful one time. Voting and several losses have ended the wolf management in this state. Either way, this is a bad decision and is creating problems in many isolated areas in the U.P.

Read your State's Constitution. You'll see why the State has legally removed the hunting season for them. I know quite a few bowhunters in your state, and realize how hard they have worked to have the ruling overturned in the courts.

Read the "Title-object clause" in the State's Constitution.

 

[dkhunt14]

I guess I might have a "dog" in this hunt. ( pun intended )
Here in NC it is much the same, 3 regions run the state - Research triangle, Charlotte and the funky little libtard city of Asheville to represent the vastly conservative Western region. Population centers you see. Some years ago, these enlightened representatives on our Commision reintroduced Red Wolves to our state. In the far West mountains and in the swamps of the Alligator Wildlife refuge in the east.
So many wolves disappeared in the Western region the project was abandoned, the wolves were trapped and moved down east.
Fast forward a few years and now coyote hunting is illegal in several counties in the east because of mistaken identity kills. Coyotes and Red Wolves interbreed wiping out genetic traces of pure Red Wolf, which is the last nail in the coffin for this species I believe. Of course we end up with a bigger, nastier coyote.
I hope our deer heard is adapting as well and like most of Western US guys, our game commision is made up of business men appointed via politics - whether they hunt or not.
View attachment 1036960 Not much difference is there?

Sometimes I feel the state game commissions have money in the equation. Imagine in states like Pa where there are lots of cars and plenty of deer. Imagine what a car insurance company would pay legislators and game commissions to see there are low numbers of deer. Save them millions on collision repairs. Matt

 

[284winner]

Sometimes I feel the state game commissions have money in the equation. Imagine in states like Pa where there are lots of cars and plenty of deer. Imagine what a car insurance company would pay legislators and game commissions to see there are low numbers of deer. Save them millions on collision repairs. Matt

Can't really see this being the case with wolves. They reduce the deer herd resulting in less hunters wanting to hunt the UP. DNR is trying to sell more licenses not less. It's definitely an issue in politics outside the DNR.

 

[284winner]

Read your State's Constitution. You'll see why the State has legally removed the hunting season for them. I know quite a few bowhunters in your state, and realize how hard they have worked to have the ruling overturned in the courts.

Read the "Title-object clause" in the State's Constitution.

I did read it. Over and over. Do not see this as necessarily the issue. Thats not saying it isn't, only that I did not find any language that makes this point in my research.

 

[JRS]

I did read it. Over and over. Do not see this as necessarily the issue. Thats not saying it isn't, only that I did not find any language that makes this point in my research.

Court of Appeals ruling: "PA 281 as drafted, violates the Title-Object Clause of the Michigan Constitution, and the act is constitutionally infirm". Michigan isn't the only state with this problem. On a brighter note, Michigan has more bowhunters than any other state, and is second only to Texas in numbers harvested. PA is right on the heels of Michigan

 

[Flouncer]

Rebel - LMAO First early morning pre-coffee glance and I saw "Caltrans" instead of C latrans. Signed, your public servant with the DOT.

 

[284winner]

Court of Appeals ruling: "PA 281 as drafted, violates the Title-Object Clause of the Michigan Constitution, and the act is constitutionally infirm". Michigan isn't the only state with this problem. On a brighter note, Michigan has more bowhunters than any other state, and is second only to Texas in numbers harvested. PA is right on the heels of Michigan

Yes Texas, Michigan and Pennsylvania in that order. Seems to be the case year after year. Too bad Michigan has terrible deer management. I mean yes we have big numbers but all sub quality bucks. The system needs work. Like one buck only. Less days to gun hunt. We could have a good big buck state if the DNR wasn't so concerned about selling tags and revenue.

 

[L.Sherm]

Like i said in my earlier post follow the money, enviro's go to federal court get there attorney fees paid win or lose. Agency's get grant money for 5-10 year study's so they turn this stuff into a cash cow.

 

[TheOtherZilla]

I like that.SHOOT,SHOVEL,AND SHUT UP.

Here in Wyoming we can just shoot.. Unless they are in the trophy zone up by Jellystone..

 

[Clucknmoan]

Can't really see this being the case with wolves. They reduce the deer herd resulting in less hunters wanting to hunt the UP. DNR is trying to sell more licenses not less. It's definitely an issue in politics outside the DNR.

Many believe that exactly what happened in Idaho. Idaho F&G saw a future opportunity to sell a rare tag for a preditor.

The problem is they were dumb enough to trust the environmentalists would allow the management of them once they reached target population. When the impact study was done in the early to mid 90's, they found that the entire state if Idaho could support just over 100 wolves, that was the original target goal. The problem was that they had added extra criteria to the agreement that was difficult to prove before delisting could happen, such as interbreeding among packs for example. Every time F&G tried to delist, they would go shopping for a liberal judge and tie it up in court. When they were finally delisted, there was somewhere around 1500 wolves in the state, already spilling over into the surrounding states. It was too late.

The cow muzzleloader tag the IdahoCTD mentions above was actually cut to 25 tags this year, unlimited to 25 tags in about 15 years. Our general elk tag in this unit (like many others) is also capped now. It went from an unlimited over the counter to about 1300 rifle tags. They sell out in about 10 minutes every year....literally.

I've lived on the winter range on the same property my entire life, close to ground zero of the introduction. Definately one of the most effected areas. I've seen with my own eyes over 42 years not only the population decrease of our big game herds, but also the behavior change of them and other preditors. It's more and more common for lions to come in an kill domestic animals, dogs are a favorite. A few years ago 3 lions were killed within 100 yards of the school. We have anywhere from 25 to 100 elk in our field every day of the winter now, and so does everyone else that lives away from town. They do not leave. They never used to winter this low. I would guess it has something to do with the fact that it's very common to go outside at night and hear wolves.

It really gets me worked up when I hear someone from California or even from a city in Idaho spew a bunch of crap and tell me what happening...literally in my own back yard.

Want to get really pissed? Look up hydatid cyst and you will find a ton of articles like this one.

http://www.skinnymoose.com/bbb/2010...-have-thousands-of-hydatid-disease-tapeworms/

Rant over.

 

[284winner]

Yes Texas, Michigan and Pennsylvania in that order. Seems to be the case year after year. Too bad Michigan has terrible deer management. I mean yes we have big numbers but all sub quality bucks. The system needs work. Like one buck only. Less days to gun hunt. We could have a good big buck state if the DNR wasn't so concerned about selling tags and revenue.

Wish it was the case with wolf tags.

 

[JRS]

Wish it was the case with wolf tags.

Wish it was the case with wolf tags.

The sale of fishing licenses has also taken a big hit. Here in PA, if the legislature doesn't approve an increase in cost for fishing licenses, the PFBC Board may reduce spending by $2 million, which would involve closing two warm water hatcheries and one trout hatchery. Having to take that step would further reduce the number of licenses sold due to the significant number of fish that would no longer be stocked in creeks and lakes.

 

[Archer]

Here in Wyoming, this translates to "little coyote" and "Big coyote"...

 

[284winner]

The sale of fishing licenses has also taken a big hit. Here in PA, if the legislature doesn't approve an increase in cost for fishing licenses, the PFBC Board may reduce spending by $2 million, which would involve closing two warm water hatcheries and one trout hatchery. Having to take that step would further reduce the number of licenses sold due to the significant number of fish that would no longer be stocked in creeks and lakes.

Here in Michigan with the zebra mussels and gobys in the great lakes and tributaries, the smallmouth/ walleye fishery has taken off. Killing the salmon/ trout big lake bite a bit but fishing has increased while hunting is taking quite a hit. Kids are getting involved but adults seem to be dropping off. Combination of big license increases and quality buck decreases has caused alot of it.

 

[284winner]

Here in Wyoming, this translates to "little coyote" and "Big coyote"...

Here too with the locals in the wolf populated areas. S.S.S.

 

[Lone Hunter]

Here in Wyoming, this translates to "little coyote" and "Big coyote"...

Same here.. That's just a "Trophy" coyote.l

 

[rebel]

Here in Wyoming, this translates to "little coyote" and "Big coyote"...

Apparently in Western NC as well. That's why they aren't here any more