Three shot group question

[PracticalTactical]

If a one shot group is not ruined by a second shot, and the two shot group is not ruined by a third, and the three shot group is not ruined by a fourth, and the four shot group is not ruined by a fifth, then you might just have found a good load.

 

[Gary C]

I never stated that three shot groups are not of value in load development .
I use them to save components too.
It is just the " I shot a .175 three shot group" guys that make me scratch my head.
I would say that the load looed promising and I will need to follow up with three five shot groups to
see if it truly is.

 

[jelenko]

Exactly. There are different uses for shooting groups. We need to identify what use we referring to when making judgements/expressing opinion on how many shots should be in a group.

 

[JEFFPPC]

True, but here’s how my twisted mind works - at 5 in at 500 yds I figure that pretty good place to be, but if only 2 rounds are sent downrange i’m left wondering/assuming if the rest stay in or go further out.

So it’s the old sad first then happy ending..

SPJ don't forget the part about it must repeat, if it does then you can shoot a group of 3.... 5.... whatever to see if it meets you needs . I like to confirm with 4 shot groups that are round, must be round then I feel I will be competitive. My total goal when tuning....get to where I am competitive . To me round is important.

 

[BartsBullets]

Can anything be learned from these 200 yard 3 shot groups? Shot with 6PPC intended use is short range Benchrest.

Groups with X through them were with IMR 8208. The gun didn’t care for it. Groups 1C 1D, 2A and 2B are shot with V133.

3A was shot the following day.

 

[Ccrider]

Looks like the load came together at 29.8. 29.4 and 29.6 pushed by wind?

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

View attachment 1348865
Can anything be learned from these 200 yard 3 shot groups? Shot with 6PPC intended use is short range Benchrest.

Groups with X through them were with IMR 8208. The gun didn’t care for it. Groups 1C 1D, 2A and 2B are shot with V133.

3A was shot the following day.

If you're not pressured out, I'd bet on 30.1 or 30.2 Group shapes! Wind won't do up and to the right from a rh twist bbl but tune certainly will.None are bad for 200 yards though. Good shooting!

 

[expiper]

three shots tell how the gun is shooting ---5 shots tell how the shooter is shooting---Roger

 

[BartsBullets]

Looks like the load came together at 29.8. 29.4 and 29.6 pushed by wind?

Nope not pushed by wind

 

[BartsBullets]

three shots tell how the gun is shooting ---5 shots tell how the shooter is shooting---Roger

That’s true but what is the target showing you?

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

That’s true but what is the target showing you?

Can't argue with 29.8 at all...s

Hard to argue with 29.8 but the first group at 29.8 shows a little up and right, followed by straight verticle at 30.0. That's why I was thinking .2-.3 hotter..but the 2nd group is sweet at 29.8. Can't knock it at all!

 

[BartsBullets]

If you're not pressured out, I'd bet on 30.1 or 30.2 Group shapes! Wind won't do up and to the right from a rh twist bbl but tune certainly will.None are bad for 200 yards though. Good shooting!

Maybe it would get smaller, but my bet is it would start to open back up. At 30.0 grains it was starting to open up. If I could get up to 30.6 or more I think it would start coming back in.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Maybe it would get smaller, but my bet is it would start to open back up. At 30.0 grains it was starting to open up. If I could get up to 30.6 or more I think it would start coming back in.

You're probably right.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Maybe it would get smaller, but my bet is it would start to open back up. At 30.0 grains it was starting to open up. If I could get up to 30.6 or more I think it would start coming back in.

Post some tuner group pics! I'm sure you've correlated tuner marks with powder charges. I'm trying to make that point in another thread. You can probably do it better.

 

[Bc'z]

View attachment 1348865
Can anything be learned from these 200 yard 3 shot groups? Shot with 6PPC intended use is short range Benchrest.

Groups with X through them were with IMR 8208. The gun didn’t care for it. Groups 1C 1D, 2A and 2B are shot with V133.

3A was shot the following day.

I learned that my 200yd groups suck next to your's!! Lol
Do you have a target of 29.7-29.9?

 

[JFrank]

I learned that my 200yd groups suck next to your's!! Lol
Do you have a target of 29.7-29.9?

Mine too -Bart I would call 29.8 about the top simply because it’s already shifting left but at least it’s small where 30 is breaking out. I’m usually wrong but that’s my vote.
Jim

 

[BartsBullets]

Mine too -Bart I would call 29.8 about the top simply because it’s already shifting left but at least it’s small where 30 is breaking out. I’m usually wrong but that’s my vote.
Jim

Definitely 29.8 was the best load. But the load will change throughout the day.

 

[JEFFPPC]

Definitely 29.8 was the best load. But the load will change throughout the day.

I look at the 29.8 as "round". I like round groups and even better when small and repeatable. Thanks for sharing with us, it's appreciated.

 

[BartsBullets]

So here is my take on target and what it’s telling me. I’m not focused on a single group but the overall picture it’s showing me.

1. The barrel has wide load window. Four different loads over 6 tenths of powder. Groups measured 1C 355, 1D 324, 2A 232, 2B 265, 3A 155. If you have Ballistic-X you can check my measurements. The outside to outside on the 10 ring is an inch.

2. The wide load window tells me I have a good seating depth.

3. Very little change in point of Impact over the entire load window. That’s one of the hallmarks of a really good barrel. 1D is a little higher but that was caused by conditions.

4. All of the above tell me my tuner is in a good spot.

5. At this point I can tune throughout the day either with powder or by adjusting the tuner. If I were to preload I’d go with 29.7 (middle of the load window) and adjust the tuner as needed.

Bart

 

[BartsBullets]

Post some tuner group pics! I'm sure you've correlated tuner marks with powder charges. I'm trying to make that point in another thread. You can probably do it better.

Roger that! When I get a chance I’ll try and put something together.