Q for gunsmith re Replacing Damaged Action

[xr650rRider]

Am I the only one wondering why the barrel was unscrewed?

Don't have the answer but 90% that want to run a suppressor want a short barrel. How short can you handle with action in place?

 

[CCM]

Not knowing the circumstances of what actually happened, everything is speculation. If the threads are actually galled and not damaged from a base screw then that probably happened on assembly. Not much you can do but tell the customer about it and offer solutions.

 

[Judd]

I've also seen where someone installed too long of a screw to hold the rail or front scope ring on. The screw chews up the threads on the barrel tennon and if not noticed and repaired before unscrewing the barrel galling is bound to happen with a steel or stainless action.

Hello, my name is Judd and I got that tshirt. Fortunately, I stopped before the action was screwed up but I did have to cut the barrel shorter than I wanted. Very good lesson.

 

[shortgrass]

It has been quit a few years ago, but I had an A Bolt come into the shop that "Bubba" had drilled into the chamber, trying to drill out a twisted off base screw. It was the screw closest to the ejection port on the front base. The 'shank' was long enough I could set the barrel back and re-chamber (300WSM). Before attempting to remove the barrel I ran some Kroil into the thread from the chamber end and through the front base screw hole. It sat that way for a couple of days. Upon removal, the thread fit was with tools all the way, I couldn't turn it by hand. Other than the tight fitting thread, it came of without incident, threads were undamaged (CM barrel and blued receiver. I went about my work, cut-off what had to be removed, set the shoulder back, 'picked-up' the existing threads, and threaded to fit as intended. Final threading pass removed a very small amount from the 'factory' portion of the threads. Deepened the chamber to proper headspace and re-assembled. Gave those threads a light coat of "Rig" gun grease before threading barrel and receiver together. I wasn't impressed then with the A Bolt design and I'm not impressed today with the X Bolt. 20tpi is a bit fine a thread for a barrel/receiver connection, IMO, but some big name receiver manufactures use it. 16-18tpi seems just about right to me. And I am of the mind that barrel/receiver threads should, or need to be, an "assisted fit" to each other. They don't need to be sloppy, but they don't need to be that tight, either. I think all of the A Bolt/X Bolts I have seen have 'pencil' barrels, which would not take a 5/8-24 for a brake or 'can'.

 

[NZ_Fclass]

I had this subject raised by a gunsmith recently - he won't re -barrel Brownings - it takes too long and customers are not prepared to pay.

 

[shortgrass]

I probably wouldn't do one, just because of the interference fit thread. Too much of a chance of things going 'wrong'. I had heard before I made that repair years ago, that many wouldn't do barrel work on the A Bolt.

 

[xr650rRider]

This reference has early A-bolts as 15/16"-20 threads and late models as 1"-32
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barrel_threads

 

[akajun]

So what’s the procedure for removing the barrel on an A bolt that may or may not be galled? My experience with galled parts is that applying heat makes it worse ? Cut the tenon off, bore it out and pick out the threads then chase the receiver threads?
FYI this is why I always put a dab of anti seize on all my barrels

 

[DaveTooley]

Not all smiths are well versed in barrel work. It may be just a tiny fraction of their work. That leads to surprises. I know I never work on a barreled action with the scope base on for any kind of work on the action or barrel. I'd say 50% of the time the base wasn't installed properly to start with. When I install a base I always put the front screw in and just get it to touch something. Then see if the base moves.

 

[Will Henry]

So what’s the procedure for removing the barrel on an A bolt that may or may not be galled? My experience with galled parts is that applying heat makes it worse ? Cut the tenon off, bore it out and pick out the threads then chase the receiver threads?
FYI this is why I always put a dab of anti seize on all my barrels

I have very nearly gotten caught by this on an A bolt. The action broke loose just fine then started to stick. I stopped, put the barreled action muzzle down in the bench vise, and plugged the chamber with a piece of rag. I put about an ounce of 75-90 gear oil in the receiver ring. I heated it with a heat gun until it was too hot to hold, then went for a coffee. When I got back, I dumped out the excess oil (messy!) Then put the thing back in the barrel vise. I was using an out side wrench (which, I felt, may have added to the problem, initially) and I took care not to tighten that wrench onto the receiver too much. I just started wiggling the receiver back and forth with the wrench, until it finally spun right off.
Subsequently, I always put as much oil into the scope mount hole as I could, inside the receiver ring, and warmed it up a bit. I think I mentioned, I do not believe in making the threads an interference fit, on any vee thread. I believe the thread should just go on by hand, with clearance at the top and the root. WH

 

[jackieschmidt]

With all of this talk of interference thread fits in Stainless Steel Actions, my first thought is how the heck does Browning get the things together.

We have all had that “uh o” moment when we are fitting a new barrel and it suddenly, about 2/3 the way on, has a “catch“. You are thinking, “Oh Sh-t.“, hoping it will come off.

 

[ncageneral]

I took a Browning A Bolt to a semi local PRS rifle building firm near me and talked with them. He told me about the problems associated with Brownings and said he wouldnt do it. I asked him if he would recommend someone and he sent me to a gentleman. An older gentleman who has years of experience. I talked to him in the phone and we set up an appointment for me to bring my rifle by. We were talking when I dropped my rifle off, I told him of my visit to the PRS builders , he sort of laughed. When he finished my rifle I went to pick it up, and again we got to talking, he says " I dont know why those boys didnt want to mess with the Brownings". The way he talked Brownings are no more trouble than anything else and they take a re barrel very well with very good results. If I had work to be done today, I would make the drive to Utica MS. The one he did for me shoots very well.

 

[V35]

I took a Browning A Bolt to a semi local PRS rifle building firm near me and talked with them. He told me about the problems associated with Brownings and said he wouldnt do it. I asked him if he would recommend someone and he sent me to a gentleman. An older gentleman who has years of experience. I talked to him in the phone and we set up an appointment for me to bring my rifle by. We were talking when I dropped my rifle off, I told him of my visit to the PRS builders , he sort of laughed. When he finished my rifle I went to pick it up, and again we got to talking, he says " I dont know why those boys didnt want to mess with the Brownings". The way he talked Brownings are no more trouble than anything else and they take a re barrel very well with very good results. If I had work to be done today, I would make the drive to Utica MS. The one he did for me shoots very well.

I think a lot of issues people have with problem solving on things like this is that they are in a hurry, and dont stop and take the time to think about devising a plan “B” before they paint themselves in a corner that can get out of.

 

[243Lapua]

Never, will I ever work on a Browning, first time I removed the barreled action from the stock, the trigger housing broke, trigger housing is made out off some sort of weak metal. I learned quick to stay away from Browning Rifles. Browning even has a replacement part for the trigger, I guess they know it's weak. They look nice, but quality is not top notch. The only Browning I like to work are the vintage Belgium made rifles. Anything new production I stay away.

 

[shortgrass]

I think a lot of issues people have with problem solving on things like this is that they are in a hurry, and dont stop and take the time to think about devising a plan “B” before they paint themselves in a corner that can get out of.

Ya', my plan B is, I'm already in my late 60s, a gunsmith school grad with over 30yrs of 'bench' experience. I already work with many other 'problems' most don't want. I have more than I can do in a timely manner now, why bother with what could be a real problem that won't pay any extra, and possibly delay other decent paying work, just to please someone with hardon for A Bolts/X Bolts that most likely will not be a repeat client/customer?

 

[V35]

Ya', my plan B is, I'm already in my late 60s, a gunsmith school grad with over 30yrs of 'bench' experience. I already work with many other 'problems' most don't want. I have more than I can do in a timely manner now, why bother with what could be a real problem that won't pay any extra, and possibly delay other decent paying work, just to please someone with hardon for A Bolts/X Bolts that most likely will not be a repeat client/customer?

My comment wasn’t directed at Brownings exclusively, but could apply. There are many things a person does that may have hurdle to cross in the process. Being able to come up with a solution is the point.

And yes, I totally get what you are saying about not doing certain jobs, I do the same daily.

 

[AlNyhus]

With all of this talk of interference thread fits in Stainless Steel Actions, my first thought is how the heck does Browning get the things together.

We have all had that “uh o” moment when we are fitting a new barrel and it suddenly, about 2/3 the way on, has a “catch“. You are thinking, “Oh Sh-t.“, hoping it will come off.

Jackie, Stan Ware had a little niche' market rebarreling the A-Bolts. Some had the threads beat up from the factory but most weren't. A bigger issue was tweaking the actions when removing the barrels conventionally. The factory barrel would be cut off about 1" ahead of the receiver, the reciever would go into a 5 gallon bucket of diesel fuel for a day or so and then he'd bore the old stub out. Most of the time, the threaded stub would just screw out by hand as the wall thickness was reduced during the boring process.

Geez....I must have cut off a dozen Browning barrels for him on his horizontal band saw. "Do something to make my life easier instead of harder, Nyhus. Cut these (blank-blank) A-Bolt barrels off for me. If you scratch the action, I'll charge your azz after I fix your screw up."

 

[jackieschmidt]

Jackie, Stan Ware had a little niche' market rebarreling the A-Bolts. Some had the threads beat up from the factory but most weren't. A bigger issue was tweaking the actions when removing the barrels conventionally. The factory barrel would be cut off about 1" ahead of the receiver, the reciever would go into a 5 gallon bucket of diesel fuel for a day or so and then he'd bore the old stub out. Most of the time, the the threaded stub would just screw out by hand as the wall thickness was reduced during the boring process.

Geez....I must have cut off a dozen Browning barrels for him on his horizontal band saw. "Do something to make my life easier instead of harder, Nyhus. Cut these (blank-blank) A-Bolt barrels off for me. If you scratch the action, I'll charge your azz after I fix your screw up."

Al, do you think one with really messed up threads could be brought back to life the way I did that Bat.?

 

[akajun]

Al, do you think one with really messed up threads could be brought back to life the way I did that Bat.?

Jackie Im nowhere near the machinist you are but i dont see why not. We pretty much do the same thing with remington 700s when we true them with oversized threads. I like the idea of soaking the cut off barrel in diesel and boring it out in reverse. I used that trick on a hydraulic cylinder cap that was seized and the barrel was damaged. only the first few threads were damaged and a simple chase with a thread tool cleaned them up

 

[AlNyhus]

Al, do you think one with really messed up threads could be brought back to life the way I did that Bat.?

Very possibly.

Changing the pitch on that BAT the way you did was pretty clever.