Possible Change to Optics Sale AREA -- Members ONLY?

[Whisky Tahoe Foxtrot]

While it is easy to blame the careless for getting scammed, bad actors/thieves/scammers affect us all by impacting the quality of this forum. I really appreciate the lengths that BOSS goes to to keep this forum running like a well oiled machine.

I owe a great deal of gratitude to the members here for helping me refresh my skills and knowledge after a long career induced hiatus. I've been a buyer and seller on the classifieds and can attest to how well they are run which is a credit to BOSS and everyone who is a contributor.

I think escrow is an excellent idea when feedback and history isn't as adequate as it should be. I know I was a new member earlier this year and expected being a newbie was always a strike against me.

Same with some level of qualification whether it is financial or contributory. Both have been used on other sites. One site actually counts posts that have no substance as a negative though I can't imagine how much effort that would take to keep track.

Finally weeding out stock photos or reused photos will further enhance our forum. Custom photos, time stamped photos (with news paper or other media with date) makes sense though it seems some of the posts in the classifieds are from people who can type but can't post a photo. It's likely that some technology poses a barrier for these people.

Direct communication seems to be one of the best protection methods, not sure why it isn't the go to for any expensive purchase not using 3rd parties like FFLs. Maybe some of us don't like talking...

Given all the different opinions just in this one thread and the levels of ability with our classified posting community, is it very unlikely BOSS can please everyone. I support what ever decision is made as well as those who will disagree. I just would like all of us to continue to make this forum unwelcome to those who want scam and steal from our fellow members.

 

[pirate ammo]

One site actually counts posts that have no substance as a negative

Now that would put a big time hurt on me.

 

[riflewoman]

Even with “Members Only”, I’d still require prior selling or buying history FROM THIS SITE as well.

 

[Ol’ Ed]

Wow at lot of good suggestions to solve a problem that was caused by someone (seemingly) not paying attention to what he was doing or(seemingly)not wanting to be responsible for his own actions. Though I admit I never read that in the thread. I don’t believe accurate shooter has a responsibility to protect us from ourselves beyond the steps already given. Sounds too much like the government to me but that just my opinion and you know what that’s worth.

At the risk of being labeled a potential swindler, I’ve gotta say I agree with Olspark. Everybody has to take the personal responsibility to protect themselves. No matter what protections we put in place, dedicated con artists will find a way around it. And it doesn’t matter what is enacted (# of posts, transaction history, etc.), if the price of an item gets over a couple hundred dollars, I’m calling. Anything less than that I’ll take the chance, knowing that if I get screwed I have no one else to blame but myself. Asbestos underwater engaged!

 

[Murray Brook]

I don't believe that charging for the classifieds will solve the problem. Swindlers will always find a way to get those that don't look after themselves. This would be like those who believe that if there were no guns then all problems would be solved. I don't think so.

 

[pirate ammo]

And some still believe in the tooth fairy.

 

[antelopedundee]

While it is easy to blame the careless for getting scammed, bad actors/thieves/scammers affect us all by impacting the quality of this forum. I really appreciate the lengths that BOSS goes to to keep this forum running like a well oiled machine.

I owe a great deal of gratitude to the members here for helping me refresh my skills and knowledge after a long career induced hiatus. I've been a buyer and seller on the classifieds and can attest to how well they are run which is a credit to BOSS and everyone who is a contributor.

I think escrow is an excellent idea when feedback and history isn't as adequate as it should be. I know I was a new member earlier this year and expected being a newbie was always a strike against me.

Same with some level of qualification whether it is financial or contributory. Both have been used on other sites. One site actually counts posts that have no substance as a negative though I can't imagine how much effort that would take to keep track.

Finally weeding out stock photos or reused photos will further enhance our forum. Custom photos, time stamped photos (with news paper or other media with date) makes sense though it seems some of the posts in the classifieds are from people who can type but can't post a photo. It's likely that some technology poses a barrier for these people.

Direct communication seems to be one of the best protection methods, not sure why it isn't the go to for any expensive purchase not using 3rd parties like FFLs. Maybe some of us don't like talking...

Given all the different opinions just in this one thread and the levels of ability with our classified posting community, is it very unlikely BOSS can please everyone. I support what ever decision is made as well as those who will disagree. I just would like all of us to continue to make this forum unwelcome to those who want scam and steal from our fellow members.

This may be duplicitous, but over on bullionstacker.com newbies are expected to ship the goods first.

 

[dbduff]

Folks,
We have seen cases of bad sellers in the classifieds, particularly in the Optics area. A few actual scammers, but other sellers who are exploiting the system in various ways.

Unfortunately members crazed to score a bargain are not heeding what I have said over and over and over again.

NEVER buy an expensive scope without talking to the seller live, by voice, on the telephone. And INSIST on custom photos (that cannot be grabbed off another site). Ask seller to take a photo with a bow on the scope, or masking tape with specific words.

Apparently people are still not getting the message. So let me try this -- if you shell out hundreds or even thousands of dollars for an optic without talking to the seller live, by Voice (not TEXT or Private message), you're a g-damned FOOL!

In any case, I am thinking of restricting Optics selling rights to Silver and Gold members only. Non-members could still read and purchase, but not sell. This is not a guarantee of security, but it will help a lot.

I hate to go this route, but I can't seem to get members to follow my instructions and protect themselves. Maybe these graphics will help hammer this home:

View attachment 1123617


View attachment 1123618

View attachment 1123619

 

[dbduff]

Forum Boss-no good deed goes unpunished. Most of the responsible supporters/users of this forum like and applaud your actions to make this as successful as it is. Please continue to do as you deem necessary for it to function in a responsible and user friendly fashion. Until there is a majority of similar complaints, understand we think you're doing a great job!

 

[Dave Way]

I have sold several high end optics and rifles on this site. When a buyer says I’ll take it, I ask how payment will be made and I include my phone number in case they want to talk in person.

Very rarely do I get a call and I have never been asked to take custom photos. I’m assuming it’s because I have a high number of positive feedbacks on my trader history and possibly because of my Gold status.

Personally I like to talk to a seller in person because you can get a better feel for the type of individual you are about to send money to.

While I agree that trader history can alleviate many concerns, I would not put
ANY stock in the fact that they may be a Gold member. That’s a low price to pay to pull off a several thousand dollar scam.

Dave.

 

[Ol’ Ed]

I have sold several high end optics and rifles on this site. When a buyer says I’ll take it, I ask how payment will be made and I include my phone number in case they want to talk in person.

Very rarely do I get a call and I have never been asked to take custom photos. I’m assuming it’s because I have a high number of positive feedbacks on my trader history and possibly because of my Gold status.

Personally I like to talk to a seller in person because you can get a better feel for the type of individual you are about to send money to.

While I agree that trader history can alleviate many concerns, I would not put
ANY stock in the fact that they may be a Gold member. That’s a low price to pay to pull off a several thousand dollar scam.

Dave.

Exactly what Dave said.

 

[antelopedundee]

When selling ask for the type of payment that best protects you which for over $1000 would be CASH wrapped in aluminum foil and sent registered mail in case the usps is x-raying packages.

 

[TAJ45]

As mentioned a few posts back, send goods first. This is NOT asking for any more trust than sending $$ first. That playing field is absolutely level.
THEN the trading history will be what tips the scales.
I think this has been mentioned some time back. Maybe even me? But it was regarded as "beyond the pale".

 

[Ol’ Ed]

As mentioned a few posts back, send goods first. This is NOT asking for any more trust than sending $$ first. That playing field is absolutely level.
THEN the trading history will be what tips the scales.
I think this has been mentioned some time back. Maybe even me? But it was regarded as "beyond the pale".

....and then the cheaters and thieves will be outfitted with nice scopes.

 

[antelopedundee]

....and then the cheaters and thieves will be outfitted with nice scopes.

Well now you wouldn't want them to be a huntin with junk now wouldja?

 

[TAJ45]

....and then the cheaters and thieves will be outfitted with nice scopes.

Does this reply make any logical sense to anyone?

 

[JimT]

Does this reply make any logical sense to anyone?

If you think real hard you will understand.

 

[TAJ45]

Orrr, maybe you could give it another shot -

 

[antelopedundee]

Does this reply make any logical sense to anyone?

Some try to gyp you out of a scope and some try to gyp you out of money!

 

[joshb]

How’s about: The guy with the least Trader history sends first.