New here and already have questions!

[Ishootoldcrap]

Ok.. I did a quick search and I was not able to find anything along these lines. Please forgive me if I did not see it.

I have a couple old .38 S&W. Not .38 special. First off lets start with this... I know Black powder, pyrodex and other the like are corrosive... Got that out of the way. I found some Fiocchi in the guns store and they are loaded with smokeless. They worked but seemed very weak.. I know that this round is no powerhouse..

So here is where the questions come in. I have a Lee 3 die set. I loaded 5 rounds with Unique a 3.2 grains with a 158 grn LRN. I shot them at a wire spool and watched the lead bounce off the board. I looked and saw that there was un-burnt powder. I did it again and added a little bit more of a crimp. That cured the un-burnt powder but still weak. Then I loaded 5 rounds with Pyrodex. Filled the case minus about 1/8" from the top. I weighed the load and it was 11 grains. Seated the bullet and put a mild crimp. OMG what a difference! The power seemed like it had tripled. The bullet went thru the board! Why is it that the smokeless powder is so weak but the Pyrodex is so powerful? I understand that there is more powder but.... I am having trouble getting it thru my head why the Pyrodex doesn't blow up the gun but if I ad more smokeless powder KABOOM!!

 

[Mikemci]

So you stuffed enough black powder into a case, that you expected it to blow up, but it didn't.
I don't think I can help you, other than to pray for you. Good luck.

 

[K22]

When you stray from published reloading data make sure you have good medical insurance.

 

[timeout]

You are going to hurt, maime, or kill yourself. Step away from the loading bench and do not return until you have located a qualified mentor. I'm serious.

 

[AJC]

The burn rate is very different and the peak pressure is lower on the BP load. You can use slower burn rate smokeless to the same effect to a point. Accurate #5 is the slowest in my book at 3.5 grains and 715 fps.

 

[Ishootoldcrap]

Ok.... I see that I obviously touched some nerves.... When these were loaded with black powder that is the way it was done. The powder needs to be compressed. Think of a black powder rifle/pistol. Thank you AJC for at least giving a decent response. I did look at published reloading and other multiple spots and ALL recommended that the original balloon case cartridges had 15 grains of black powder. Thank you for your concern but maybe before you comment nasty or negitive comments maybe you should do your'e own research.

 

[wagonman]

Ok.... I see that I obviously touched some nerves.... When these were loaded with black powder that is the way it was done. The powder needs to be compressed. Think of a black powder rifle/pistol. Thank you AJC for at least giving a decent response. I did look at published reloading and other multiple spots and ALL recommended that the original balloon case cartridges had 15 grains of black powder. Thank you for your concern but maybe before you comment nasty or negitive comments maybe you should do your'e own research.

your research is correct 15 gr fffg 145 lead in balloon head cases but I couldnot find data for pyrodex as a replacement for black powder in old #26 hodgdon manual I have. s&w revolvers are stronger than older tip up 38sw guns still are very week compared to smokeless frame guns ushered in with the 38 special. use CAUTION!

 

[Ishootoldcrap]

When I reloaded the cartridges, I used the Fiocchi which is basically a .38 spacial case cut down to the proper length. With those cases I could only fit 10 grains of powder in them. So they are 5 grains less then the original cartridges. I have 3 old Hopkins and Allen in .38 S&W . 1 is a top break. All are in decent shape. I know as soon as I put Hopkins and Allen down people are going to shoot them down. They really are nice little guns. I enjoy plinking with them. Just want to pick other peoples minds and see what others have done. I really don't like how the smokeless powder sounds and feels. My top break is a safety police model. If anyone has any other information on these pistols please let me know. I know that the #6 is pretty old and has (what I think) is a pretty low serial number.

 

[wagonman]

When I reloaded the cartridges, I used the Fiocchi which is basically a .38 spacial case cut down to the proper length. With those cases I could only fit 10 grains of powder in them. So they are 5 grains less then the original cartridges. I have 3 old Hopkins and Allen in .38 S&W . 1 is a top break. All are in decent shape. I know as soon as I put Hopkins and Allen down people are going to shoot them down. They really are nice little guns. I enjoy plinking with them. Just want to pick other peoples minds and see what others have done. I really don't like how the smokeless powder sounds and feels. My top break is a safety police model. If anyone has any other information on these pistols please let me know. I know that the #6 is pretty old and has (what I think) is a pretty low serial number.

bringing these old timers back to life, shooting and reloading safe loads, what's not to like enjoy the adventure.

 

[JRanum]

Well first of all, that's a black powder cartridge so if you use black powder or Pyrodex, you cant fit too much powder in the case to hurt anything, especially since the newer cases are that much thicker and have less volume.

Second, Factory ammo is loaded on the light side because the factory has to look out for every old rattletrap that somebody inherits from Grandpa and wants to shoot again for old time's sake.

I'd tell you to find some old loading manuals to find some data but there was a stretch in the 30s and 40s where they really ramped up some of those old cartridges to levels that would be sure to damage something. Stay with the powderpuff smokeless loads and enjoy.

 

[pirate ammo]

With black powder you want no air space at all, that space will build your pressure over the max. Your
pyrodex is really stable, but if you shift to straight black powder get the right gear, a spark from
static electricity can get you planted in the ground, that is if they find all the parts. Get the Lyman
black powder handbook and loading manual it has information you need. My load for 45-70 is to
load case with 1 1/2 F to crunch point under a 405GR cats bullet, very good on the smoke effect.