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Labradar vs Optical Chronos: Real World Experiences?

After posting above I went outside, put the Labradar on the hood of my truck changed some settings
and shot my father in laws old Chinese .177 pellet rifle to see if the Labradar would pick it up.
It did, three shots in the low 500FPS range. Less than 5 minutes start to finish.
 
After posting above I went outside, put the Labradar on the hood of my truck changed some settings
and shot my father in laws old Chinese .177 pellet rifle to see if the Labradar would pick it up.
It did, three shots in the low 500FPS range. Less than 5 minutes start to finish.
using this maybe?


what amazes me that I can get every piece of shooting equipment I own to work straight from the box, and during my working days I worked on everything from nuke reactors for the Navy to multi state telemetric systems but I was too dumb to get a high end chrono to function. Maybe the one I got was just a lemon, but the CS sure were not very helpful over my month of ownership to get things going.
 
Using no external rigger.
like I said in my earlier post, mine may have just been a lemon straight from the factory, but the factory CS sure did not seem too interested in getting it running for me. Being a tech geek since HS I really wanted that thing to work, but after a month of CS blaming me, Samsung, and Apple for the issues it was just too frustrating and I was missing way too many shots when trying to gather data. That would be even more frustrating now with the component shortages

Mine may have just been a lemon, but I sure won't gamble 600 bucks on getting one that works, in particular when a quick google search shows that I am not the only one to experience the same issues. Takes me less than 5 minutes to set up my optical at the same time I set up my target and I never miss a shot. Bows, 22's CF, pistol, suppressed. or muzzle brakes. It catches them all for 1/5 th the price. Plus with the bluetooth control on my tablet it makes it simple to change strings and to import the data into a spreadsheet

For the odd time when I need a quick velocity check for scope dope I keep a Magnetospeed Sporter in my range bag. Super handy for a quick velocity check which is all I really need once the load has been developed. These days I tend to find a load that works and stick with it. I have no need for a chrono unless I am changing components

I will probably use my chrono more in the next week or so than I have all year. Just acquired a Shot Marker system and I want to compare the Shot Marker ES/SD data against my opticals
 
I don’t understand why a person needs Bluetooth on the Labradar? I haven’t even tried to use it on mine yet. The unit holds all the data and it’s easy to read sitting right next to me on the ground. I’m a little old fashioned and like to write all my data down on paper so I’m not worried about transferring to an app or computer either.

I had an optical chronograph with Bluetooth that quit working. That sucked because I actually needed that function to read speeds on the app since it was 15 feet in front of the muzzle on my large magnums. I couldn’t read the speed on the stupid tiny display from that distance
 
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I don’t understand why a person needs Bluetooth on the Labradar? I haven’t even tried to use it on mine yet. The unit holds all the data and it’s easy to read sitting right next to me on the ground. I’m a little old fashioned and like to write all my data down on paper so I’m not worried about transferring to an app or computer either.
well considering with 30 inch barrels the Labradar needed to be sitting up at the front of the bench I had to physically stand up and lean forward to reach the controls to arm/disarm and change strings. If you left it armed it would suck power out of the battery fast. I know I am not the only one to experience this because I was watching a video of one of the better known posters here last evening and he was lamenting that he had forgotten to rearm his Labradar between strings and had missed the first few shots of a string.

The Labradar is pretty poorly designed from the beginning. The control/ battery section needs to be separated from the transmitter receiver. As it is, it is top heavy and unstable, vibration affect bot the accuracy of the readings and the ability to pick up shots. Separating the controls/power would accomplish two things. On the transmitter/receiver could be low profile and be positioned under the barrel allowing it to be aligned with the barrel for aiming purposes. The controls and power could be attached to a short cable sitting at the back of the bench allowing ease of access to the controls. A recoil operated trigger mechanism and a external microphone should come with the unit. Add in a rechargeable battery pack and a blue tooth that actually works for data transfer purposes and I will take a second look. Like I said I am a long time geek all the way back to when I rode my dinosaur to junior high. I really wanted the unit to work well for me and I was disappointed in what arrived in the box and with the customer service

Myself I love putting my data in to spreadsheets and graphing it looking for flatspots and just for archival purposes. My reloading log these days is the OnTarget program. I can keep visual records of group sizes with an accompanying spreadsheet for load development velocities. I use the Competition Electronics optical chrono with the add on bluetooth which was discontinued. Now they have the DLX model with built in bluetooth. My last one suffered ten years of hard abuse before something broke loose inside so I expect another good 8 years minimum before I need to replace this one. At 139 dollars for the DLX model I can afford to replace it several time for the cost of a Labradar if needed.

Hopefully by the time the ProChrono dies the Labradar II will be out and designed by a shooter and tested in the field by shooters. Like I said I love the concept but the execution sucks in my opinion

The OP asked for opinions and mine is that the LR is overpriced and over rated, I realize others opinions may vary and I respect that. I can only judge by my experience which was not good
 
well considering with 30 inch barrels the Labradar needed to be sitting up at the front of the bench...
That is not a true statement at all. Never needs to be farther than arms reach. I know a guy who shoots 34” barrels with the radar positioned exactly the same as how I do it right in front of the receiver. No issues at all

Now you got me wondering if you didn’t have it set up or aimed correctly.
 
That is not a true statement at all. Never needs to be farther than arms reach. I know a guy who shoots 34” barrels with the radar positioned exactly the same as how I do it right in front of the receiver. No issues at all

Now you got me wondering if you didn’t have it set up or aimed correctly.
From the Labradar website. This is also what the CS told me to do when I complained of it missing shots. Edit - my muzzle actually extends about three inches in front of the benches at my range in my normal setup and the CS guy at Labradar said that could be the reason the LR was missing shots. I moved my shooting stool and rests back to the very end of the bench to comply with the instructions.

 
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From the Labradar website. This is also what the CS told me to do when I complained of it missing shots

Yeah I know what the site and manual say, but when you talk to people who have used the radar extensively, just set it up how they do.

I was shooting with Tom Mousel one day and he is the one who gave me all the tips on properly setting up and using the radar. I haven’t had any issues from the very first shot using toms advice

Here is one of Tom’s rifles with a 34” barrel plus muzzle brake. Probably 36-37” total barrel length to end of the brake. This is how i set up my radar regardless if the barrel has a muzzle break or not. The difference between me and Tom is that I shoot from the prone position and have mine on a low profile tripod next to the rifle on the ground.


73A24590-151D-4FF9-8905-14FE81ADD82C.jpeg
 
The Bluetooth function on the LR means at least two things to many folks.

You don't need to touch that button on the unit while in the sling or in position on the bench.

You can read a much bigger screen on the iPad without any effort.

A third thing is, that many of us are not uncomfortable with the technology and can use the interface to analyze the data while still in the field. If we are also comfortable loading at the range, then we use that connection for on the spot analysis of the results in real-time and can either continue testing with more samples, or stop based on an early look. Either way, the Bluetooth is a convenience or a time saver, or both.

Really sorry to hear about Jim's trouble with the unit, but I'm guessing he doesn't loose sleep over it.
I have bought several units, most as gifts to friends. I have had to send one back for troubleshooting and they flipped it for me and rushed it back, so my own experience with their CS was the opposite of Jim's.

I lost a shot here and there at first till I learned where the best placement was to let the shock hit the trigger. It didn't last cause I added the external trigger and it has since never missed a single shot. It has the opposite effect when testing in that it can false trigger on gun manipulation noise like dropping the bolt on a gas gun, but with the Bluetooth connection you just delete that false shot and keep moving.

On handguns, I have not missed a single shot using the internal trigger, and that has covered lots of tests and thousands of shots, both outdoor and indoor.

No idea why I missed some early shots with much more powerful rifles at the beginning, cause I have not missed any since with either the external or internal triggers. That may have been the learning curve, or it may have something with that unit that was sent back after it failed hard.
 
The only time I have missed a shot so far was because I forgot to arm it on one string when first using it. But that was not any fault of the radar. All my own fault.

I will have to play around with the Bluetooth a bit now to see if I like it.
 
You were probably distracted with the beauty of your shooting lane..... that is an awesome spot.
Have had deer walk out on the range area right in the middle of shooting. A couple of them were really nice mature bucks too. They’ve gotten used to the shooting
 
Yeah I know what the site and manual say, but when you talk to people who have used the radar extensively, just set it up how they do.

I was shooting with Tom Mousel one day and he is the one who gave me all the tips on properly setting up and using the radar. I haven’t had any issues from the very first shot using toms advice

Here is one of Tom’s rifles with a 34” barrel plus muzzle brake. Probably 36-37” total barrel length to end of the brake. This is how i set up my radar regardless if the barrel has a muzzle break or not. The difference between me and Tom is that I shoot from the prone position and have mine on a low profile tripod next to the rifle on the ground.


View attachment 1277986
now that setup I like. The way the unit is mounted and clamped to the bench would make it a lot less sensitive to vibration and hard to knock over.

Like I keep saying , I love the concept but the design needs a complete overhaul. It could easily be made to be a lot more user friendly in it's controls, less finicky to use and more robust in the power supply. The way it is right now I just don't see it as worth the money even if it performed flawlessly. I can get the same data with less frustration and hassle for 1/4 the cost

As far as the CS goes, they may have improved but when I called they seemed to want to place the blame on Apple and Samsung as far as the Bluetooth issues and on me as far as the inability to pick up shots. I got the feeling they would rather eat glass than admit the unit had problems or was not user friendly.
 
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Have had deer walk out on the range area right in the middle of shooting. A couple of them were really nice mature bucks too. They’ve gotten used to the shooting
seen lots of deer and wild turkeys, armadillos, and had a gator walk in front of my targets and once had to go cold range to shoo a hawk off the target stand who refused to move until I was within 20 yards of it.
 
Have had deer walk out on the range area right in the middle of shooting. A couple of them were really nice mature bucks too. They’ve gotten used to the shooting
seen lots of deer and wild turkeys, armadillos, and had a gator walk in front of my targets and once had to go cold range to shoo a hawk off the target stand who refused to move until I was within 20 yards of it.
Somehow they always seem to know when we have a tag and open season... and when we don't...
 
Jim, many optical units have been tested against a "military" radar standard. Sometimes the results are published, the vast majority are not. The book by Bryan Litz had some side-by-side tests and many of us have posted about these things years past. The link above was hardly the fist look at the subject.


This is true, their Bluetooth connection is easy to break, but then you just have to disarm the radar and reconnect. Running the LR with a Bluetooth tablet while seated in position or while in the sling, still beats reaching over and hitting the arm button on the unit and the iPad screen is easy to place where it is more convenient.

I have several optical chronos including the Oehler , and the Magnetospeed at home, and at work I did electro-optics, radar, and fire control systems for a living. I have tracked things you can't imagine with budgets that were obscene, but that was nation state sized budgets and here we are talking about individual folks. I would still tell beginners to go with the LabRadar in a heartbeat. Once I had my hands on the LabRadar, the other units have never gone to the range. I even take the LR to the indoor pistol range and have never done that with an optical because it isn't allowed.

I'm never going to say that folks who like their current version should change, just that the best advice to give folks starting out is to skip the budget steps and go to the best standard rather than step through the progression.

All chronos have pros and cons, but this trade study is lopsided in favor of the LR with the only exception being the price for folks on a budget. (A different debate would be to ask, how will someone that cannot afford a LR be able to participate in a sport like F-Class? Is the difference between the LR and the CED or Prochrono going to be measurable after one or two seasons where a club match is 60 shots for record?)

That said, I certainly understand that younger folks might need to save up or want to start out with something cheaper. If that gets them into the game then it is better than staying home. If however, they attend some club matches and observe the Master and HighMaster class at work, work meaning practice or load development, they can come to their own conclusions in short order. This forum is great, but getting to a club with a regular schedule for their game of interest will get the to their goals much faster with less waste.

It will potentially be an un-popular thing to say here, but competitive shooting for accuracy score is far from a minimum wage sport.

When young folks in the club ask about jumping into midrange, long range, PRS, or high performance games, and the discussion turns to tools like LabRadar or ShotMarker or the A&DFx120i etc., they will get a better start with a good mentor and a budget that has those things built in, than one where they bump around with inferior budget equipment only to end up with what is known to work for the vast majority of participants.

These sports are not about the money you can spend, you still cannot buy your way in to High Master. You have work to do if you expect to climb the ranks or show up on podiums. But, getting good advice sometimes includes not buying the less expensive tools and in the longer run they will spend less to get to their goals. YMMV

This is absolutely correct. In benchrest, both long range and short range where we compete for both group and score, you must have high quality equipment and loading tools. You also MUST learn to be obsessively consistent in shooting technique, extremely precise in loading ammo, and tireless and systematic when tuning. Both buying the equipment and shooting the discipline is not a minimum wage hobby........
 
seen lots of deer and wild turkeys, armadillos, and had a gator walk in front of my targets and once had to go cold range to shoo a hawk off the target stand who refused to move until I was within 20 yards of it.
Yeah I’ve had to stop shooting as a whitetail doe and fawn walked 10 feet behind my target board once. Sure wish the animals were like that during hunting season but like @RegionRat said, it seems like they know when we have a tag in our pocket. Lol!
 
I will also add that Bluetooth connectivity issues are sometimes due to problems with an app and not necessarily a persons phone/tablet or the equipment they are trying to connect to. So perhaps Labradar needs work on their app as well.

Like I said earlier, I haven’t tried the LR Bluetooth and app yet, but I’m shooting tomorrow so I will try it out. Hopefully it works ok.
 

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