How To Get On Paper at 1,000 Yards - Help Please

[rkittine]

I have a Borden BRM Bench Rest Rifle with a Kreiger 1:8 Twist 28.5" Barrel, that I only have shot at 100 yards and want to convert over to shooting 1,000 Yards.

I have a box of Factory Lapua GB489 123 Scenar 6.5x47 Lapua ammo with a claimed Muzzel Velocity of 2,790 and a G1 BC of .527. In checking other Lapua Factory ammo I have, their velocities seem to be spot on as measured by my LabRadar.

According to my JBM Ballistic Calculator, I need just over 32 MOA to get out to 1,000, but it depends on the current sight in distance, which I will not have a clue as I am removing the Dove Tail Bases, replacing with a Borden 20 MOA rail and adding Extra High Burris Signature Zee rings with -10 under +10 inserts in the front ring and either 0/0 in the back or +10 over -10 which I think is best. In either case I will get either 30 or 40 MOA of elevation in the end.

So now how to I get on paper a 1,000 yards away? Unfortunately I can not Walk It out as where I shoot I have 600 and 1,000 yards as the only options.

In years gone by I would sight in a rifle at 100 yards and find that at some closer distance if would also be on target center. I.E. sighted in on the bullet rise at say 25 yards and dead center on the bullet decent at 100.

So my question is, is there a close distance that can be calculated, that if I am on target center, that I will probably be on paper when it comes back down at 1,000 yards?

Otherwise, unless I was shooting over 1,000 yards of dirt and could see puffs, I have no clue how to do this. Is their a bore sighter made for this kind of thing?

Sorry for my lack of experience and knowledge, but input would be appreciated. I asked a similar question recently but did not understand the answer, must just be bense.

Thanks, Bob

 

[Mozella]

This sort of thing is simple, but you have to know where you are, where you're going, and how to get there.
First establish where you are, which is to say sight the rifle in at some known distance. One hundred yards will be fine. There are too many variables to easily calculate this from scratch but finding a 100 yard zero is easy. You might start by removing the bolt, putting the rifle on a good rest and rear bag so that when you look down the bore, you see the target. Then just adjust your scope so that when you look through the scope, the cross hairs are centered on the target; adjust as necessary. Triple check 'cause it's easy to bump things around, but once you have the bore and scope lined up you'll be on paper at 100 yards. Try to do this in little or no wind if possible. A few test shots to set the zero right on the bull's eye and you now know the first data point. This is easy and should take only a few shots to establish an accurate zero.

Forget about how high the bullet flies and where the bullet crosses the zero sight line other than making sure that it crosses at 100 yards. You can gather this data later on if you decide to go hunting. For target shooting at known distances it is of only secondary interest.

Now, gather the best ballistic data you can for the ammo performance (BC, velocity, etc.), temp, altitude, and so on.

Put that data into any decent ballistics calculator along with the fact that you're zeroed at 100yards.

Finally, tell your ballistics calculator that you want to shoot at 1000 yards, or any other range, and it should tell you how many clicks, MOA, inches or (whatever measurement you like to use) you'll have to dial into your scope starting from your 100 yard zero. This will theoretically have you zeroed at 1000 yards, but in reality be happy with being pretty close.

If you've done it correctly and if you don't have any wind, you should be pretty close to center. Naturally any errors in your ballistics data or the addition of any wind may make your first hit less than perfect, but you should at least be close enough so that you aren't completely lost.

The key is a good starting point, which means getting a good 100 yard zero. If you try to start out at 1000 yards by adjusting your scope based on pure calculations, hope to be either very very lucky or plan on shooting up a lot of ammo.

 

[Rob01]

Zero at 100 and dial your data on for 1000. Easy. I do it all the time. You said a shorter distance so 100 is a good one to go off of.

 

[Riesel]

Be very sure your scope is square and level with your rifle. Any kind of cant will show up immensely at 1000 yards. Same when shooting, make sure you are not canting the rifle. The advice ^^^^is good sound advise but it ain't as easy as falling off a log

 

[rkittine]

Thanks guys, I also realized that I am putting a scope BACK on this rifle that is already sighted at 100 yards and the only difference is High Rings as compared to Extra High for the barrel clearance. So I would think I would be somewhere on the berm by just putting in 32 total MOA on the new set up.

I have levels for the scope and action.

Bob

 

[Keith Glasscock]

A 20 MOA base will likely get you near the bottom of the scope travel. Re-zero at 100 then dial up whatever your ballistics call for.

I would suggest not starting with the offset inserts. I've not needed them yet with 20 MOA bases.

All assuming you are not using a frozen scope.

To answer the actual question presented:

If the scope is 2.5" above the bore, and the velocity and BC are exactly correct, dead nuts on at 20 feet would put you on paper at 1000 for elevation, but you would need to correct windage for wind, corriolis, and spin drift.

 

[memilanuk]

If the scope is 2.5" above the bore, and the velocity and BC are exactly correct, dead nuts on at 20 feet would put you on paper at 1000 for elevation, but you would need to correct windage for wind, corriolis, and spin drift.

For a new shooter trying to get on paper, I think we can omit those last two - unless it is a very small (as in 'sheet') of paper...

 

[savagedasher]

Put a target at 100 yards sight your gun to shoot dead on . Then put a aim point 30" below your 100 yar bullet impact . Lock your gun so it don't move . Adjust the scope UP to where the cross hairs on on the target below.
If the gun hasn't moved it should shoot 30" high at 100 . That should put on paper.
My dasher is 24 1/4 "
If your scope. Won't move to 30" you could have not. Enough movement . 30 " should be a safe number but that depend on the bullet speed .
Many of time I shoot at 100 and aim 26" below the bullet impact.
That is the way I check my barrels for indexing . Larry

 

[Rob01]

Guys it's not that complicated. He has JBM telling him what he needs to dial. Get a 100 yard zero and dial it up. He will be very close if not right on as JBM for me has been very accurate when I put in good data. As with any ballistic program it's garbage in, garbage out so you have to put in good numbers. I have used JBM for many years for my match data and have never been off more than .2 mils or about 7" at 1000 yards.

I am actually doing it tomorrow with a new 6mm Creedmoor I haven't shot past 100. I zeroed at 100, have my JBM ballistic data and will go out as I have done many times and dial it on and will be there. I did it a few weeks back with a new 147 ELD load for my Creedmoor. Dialed up and banging 10" steel at 1020 yards.

Now if he doesn't have enough elevation in the scope to dial to 1000 then that's another issue completely.

 

[Ned Ludd]

The OP said he doesn't have access to a 100 yd range to sight in close, only 600 yd and 1000 yd currently. If there's no berm or dirtpile at around 100-200 yd, I can imagine it might not go over well to bounce bullets off the ground at the shorter distance just to get a zero.

If it were me, I'd simply borescope it at 100 yd as mentioned above, which can be done almost anywhere. Based on the borescope 100 yd zero estimate, I'd then get it on paper at 600 to get a "real" turret value for a known distance (as opposed to the borescope "estimate"). At 600 yd, you should readily be able to see the dirt splashes on the berm to help you dial it in. At 1000 yd, maybe not. But once it's dialed in at 600 yd, your JBM output should make it relatively simple to dial for 1000 yd.

 

[savagedasher]

I can't name the number of time I have helped others get on not only at 100 but 600 and 1000 When shooting all you have to do is chase your bullet . Dead on at at 100 you will need your aim to be 15" below at 600 and 30"" below at 1000 . That will very with bullet speed .
If your going to the range why not check your scope movement before.
Lol . . Larry

 

[Rob01]

He never said he doesn't have access to a 100 yard range. Just that he was looking for a close range. I think he is somewhat confused on how to dial on his data and hit out at 600 and 1000.

OP do you have access to a 100 yard range? Just trying to clarify as your posts are a little confusing.

 

[Rob01]

Also unless his scope adjusts in inches he should be thinking in moa or mils. He said that his JBM number for 1000 is about 32 moa. At 100 that is 33.5". If he had a 100 yard zero he would just need to dial on 32 moa. Simple. He could do whatever same with a quick bore sight but it won't be as close.

 

[Albany Mountain]

You can pull the bolt out and center a target within the bore at a distance of at least 100 yards. While leaving the rifle in this position, center the crosshairs on the same target while the target remains centered in the bore.

Then determine the amount of drop for 1000 yards for the bullet at the velocity being shot at. Then put that much drop in elevation on the scope.

I have done this at 600 yards and have hit the black on the first shot.

 

[savagedasher]

Also unless his scope adjusts in inches he should be thinking in moa or mils. He said that his JBM number for 1000 is about 32 moa. At 100 that is 33.5". If he had a 100 yard zero he would just need to dial on 32 moa. Simple. He could do whatever same with a quick bore sight but it won't be as close.

Like I said 30" should get it on paper.
But Mia can very so much with scope hight .
Larry

 

[dstoenner]

I didn't see anywhere about using a scope level attached to the scope. At 1000 yards that is imperative. Because looking at the crosshair for "level" won't cut it at 1000 yards.

Getting a shot on at 1000 yards once is one thing, but be able to repeat it might be another if you don't also make sure that 32 MOA goes up a vertical plumb line. You need to do a tall target test. Also that will tell you whether your scope is really MOA or 1/4 or...? and whether the cosshairs and the internal adjustments are on the same axis. And once you have run that tall target test dial it back down to your zero and see if it goes back to zero.

I just don't see how you can set up your rifle to be correct without doing all of this at 100 yards.

Then I agree that getting on paper at 1000 and repeatably is not difficult. Now comes the wind reading skills. That is what is killing me for score but practice, pracice, practice is helping

David

 

[rkittine]

Although I have been shooting since the late 60s, I am certainly new at all this. It took a considerable time and a lot of help from Joe Salt to get my new rifle on paper at 1,000 yards last week, but then it was a rifle that was never shot and a scope that was never sited. Thanks to Joe it is now on the money at 1,000. This is a different gun and with the Current 0 MOA Dove Tail Bases and Medium Rings is sighted in for 100 yards. So with the exception of the new ring height (extra high for clearance) the new set up should be easy to set at 30 MOA and give me a starting point.

Bob

 

[savagedasher]

Although I have been shooting since the late 60s, I am certainly new at all this. It took a considerable time and a lot of help from Joe Salt to get my new rifle on paper at 1,000 yards last week, but then it was a rifle that was never shot and a scope that was never sited. Thanks to Joe it is now on the money at 1,000. This is a different gun and with the Current 0 MOA Dove Tail Bases and Medium Rings is sighted in for 100 yards. So with the exception of the new ring height (extra high for clearance) the new set up should be easy to set at 30 MOA and give me a starting point.

Bob

Bob
I can get a gun on paper with no more then 6 shots if I have a 100 yard range . But the gun must be on at a hundred . I have seen many shooters use a box of shells to get on at 100 . You Just have to chase the bullet . Forget the moa or clicks .
For a change from 100 to 1000 with the average gun is 30" on target . Inches never change with scope hight . Just chase the bullet
If the gun is shooting 6"low and 8" rights align the cross hairs where you aimed make the gun where it can't move . With the aim point at where you aimed and the gun locked where it can't move now move the cross hairs to the bullet hole . Now you have a hundred Check and if it it dead on . Then Put a aim point 30" below the The bullet hole with the gun secure aiming at the bullet hole move the cross hairs to where they are at the target point 30" below then you should be on paper at 1000 . Just chase the bullet forget about the scope marks . Larry

 

[rkittine]

Thanks, I know what to do if I see the hit, it is seeing the hit that is the problem.

Bob

 

[Ned Ludd]

He never said he doesn't have access to a 100 yard range. Just that he was looking for a close range. I think he is somewhat confused on how to dial on his data and hit out at 600 and 1000.

OP do you have access to a 100 yard range? Just trying to clarify as your posts are a little confusing.

"So now how to I get on paper a 1,000 yards away? Unfortunately I can not Walk It out as where I shoot I have 600 and 1,000 yards as the only options."

From the OP, I took this statement to mean no 100 yd berm, which might complicate the process of sighting in for someone unfamiliar with the use of their scope. If he has access to a 100 or 200 yd target point, I totally agree with you and there's no need to even be discussing how to get him on paper.