Hornady bullets
- Thread starter Bottom Fodder
- Start date
I don't have a dog in this hunt, but the solution to this is quite easy. I buy a lot of stuff from Hornady and they have a customer service that I rate way above average..
If you really want to know what their procedure is, just call. They'll answer your questions.
1-800-338-3220 during business hours.
I don’t need to call. I know. But some others may need to call.
urbanrifleman
Site $$ Sponsor
Right???
From what I'm reading from some of these comments here, all other matches besides fclass, and / or "benchrest" are not actually matches. Shooting in a highpower or service rifle match is not actually a match. Shooting in a PRS match is not actually a match. You can just shoot those with just any old junk.
I say these comments obviously tongue-in-cheek. But honestly, some of the snobbery is quite overwhelming. I wonder if the service rifle guys ever get tired of being told that they don't really require much of a level of accuracy to compete. I never heard a single high power shooter say that. But I keep hearing other people from other disciplines say that.
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Reread my post with careful attention to the second sentence.Berger still has one that ‘blows up’ periodically in the 7mm line.
The one that can be made to blow up occasionally in my RSAUMS is the 195 EOL. However, it is so incredibly good, that it basically justifies one’s managing the risk.
If you want complete assurance that it will not blow up, simply load it in a .284, where it still shoots inside a SAUM with 180’s. Coming across that combination led to a BC spiral I might have been better off avoiding. It was so much better for me than 180’s in a .284 that it caused the “what else needs to be tried” syndrome and that virus once contracted, stays in your system permanently.
There’s another “heavy” by Berger, the 190 LRHT that seems like it ought to capture F-Class hearts by paper statistics, but it really hasn’t. Berger or Brian once said that Berger shouldn’t spend its time tipping bullets, that we can do that. Indeed where Berger has factory retipped bullets after forming them, F-Class guys have tried them without becoming addicted.
It’s basically just a handful of bullets that Berger is most renown for. Berger makes plenty of side B filler tracks that never made the Top 20. The 105 and 180 Hybrid, both older now, lead in matches and it can’t seem to improve on them, because they are already so good.
But the 195 almost cleared them all out. We know the story. Here’s an angle on that which ought to give the 195 some more credit, last year. It is barely used. Put it in about 5 guns of the top 20 shooters, randomly, and by my caveman reckoning the 195 becomes the odds on favorite (> 50% chance) to win a National LR match. Put in half of the top 20, and the chance is 75%. 90% if Erik is either using it, or not shooting at all.
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Fair point, but all BR and F-Class guys are the first to admit that not holding up a gun whatsoever, let alone steadily, is like being on the motorcycle following the bicycles in the Tour de France.
Guys that hold their guns standing up, run from place to place, or slog through the snow and then stop and shoot their guns standing up, will be the first to admit they could shoot smaller, maximizing even better gear, if they were shooting prone or off a bench, with support, and they won’t contend that the ability to run around and shoot makes them better at the other.
We have to keep in mind that the 10 ring of the high power target is 4 times larger than the 10 ring of the F-Class target. The difference in the area of circles is the radius squared. It’s twice the radius, so it’s four times the surface area to hit, and that means the F target is truly testing gear much more strenuously.
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Target math is a wee bit off
The target that we shoot standing slow fire is the 200 yard SR target. 10 ring is 7"/3.5 MOA...so not quite 4 times bigger. But I admit to being a bit nit-picky in that regard.
A better "apples to apples" comparison would be the MR and LR targets - these are the 600 & 1,000 yard targets shot slow fire prone.
In the case of these targets, the 10 rings is 2 MOA vs 1 MOA for the F-version of said target. The traditional target (MR and LR) is shot by conventional sling shooters while the other by the F-people.
I do agree that the F-target places greater demands on the equipment side of the shooting equation. The smaller scoring ring is part of the game for that shooting method. But sling shooters will always do whatever they can equipment & ammo-wise to shoot smaller groups. Better is better-er.
The old adage that a hard hold is worth a minute...but 1/2 MOA rifle & ammo gives you a greater margin of error.
Anyway, these matches are shot shoulder to shoulder, conventional sling and F-people. 3 x 20 round strings = 60 rnd, 600 agg match. I run these matches in addition to XTC ones (standing, sitting, etc). No one fusses about targets, the rules are the rules. Everyone is too busy trying to break 10's and X's on their respective targets.
Regardless of method, hard holders and match winners are winners for a reason. They have the skill and will to use their gear to full potential. The rest of us just plod along...
One last note - our range record was set last year by a any/any (scope) sling shooter. The previous record was also sling, with irons (Palma gun). Both were clean with no dropped points. The only difference was X-count.
Ooopps, sorry for going off topic. I've shot a stupid amount of hornady bullets. They generally work for my discipline...despite some Q/C problems and bullet blow-ups back in the day.
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Retired shooter
Gold $$ Contributor
Could be what you want ,( or think you want) however you will use and develop a load with what you can get in your hands. Would love to get some 6mm 109 bergers, not enough supply not available, would like to find and try 6mm . 110 sierras (although I hear they are finicky). When 6 mm 110 A tips become available again I will stock up. They will be in my hand waiting to load, while I am looking, and wishing for something in the other hand..
This thread all boils down to Ford versus Chevy 6 of one half a dozen of the other.
Bottom line generally either one will get you there.
To all a great day.!
What pisses me off today is that I want to watch a movie so I understand it, if possible. In the past you could borrow a disk but now you can't watch something without giving the RAT BASTARD a click.
I watched that Obama crap, Leave the World Behind, it gave trash a bad name. I had to give them a click! WTF!
I shot in heavy rain twice, I could see the bullets blow up. That's the only times it ever happened.
DR1586
Gold $$ Contributor
I’m not so sure. But I bet @carlbernosky will have some insight. My money says he loaded them and just shot cleans. If I’m not mistaken, he shot v-max bullets at the short lines in his Hagar.
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Believe this can be surmised this way
Sling shooters are fine shooting Hornady's. National Championships have been won and individual matches at nationals along with National Records have been set shooting Hornady's. It doesn't really matter which box red, yellow, green, black they've all won.
Benchrest and F-Class for right or wrong have a pre conceived notion towards them (Hornady) and tend to migrate towards Berger.
Concerning the comment those that don't shoot Berger are getting beat by those that do. That is one of the stupidest comment I have ever heard. I also heard that once at my club once and had to scoff as when a guy said that I later out shot a friend (also a HM) shooting Bergers in a mid range match and I was shooting Nosler seconds.
Sling shooters are fine shooting Hornady's. National Championships have been won and individual matches at nationals along with National Records have been set shooting Hornady's. It doesn't really matter which box red, yellow, green, black they've all won.
Benchrest and F-Class for right or wrong have a pre conceived notion towards them (Hornady) and tend to migrate towards Berger.
Concerning the comment those that don't shoot Berger are getting beat by those that do. That is one of the stupidest comment I have ever heard. I also heard that once at my club once and had to scoff as when a guy said that I later out shot a friend (also a HM) shooting Bergers in a mid range match and I was shooting Nosler seconds.
You point being?
I’ll take those 176s off your hands.
jackieschmidt
Gold $$ Contributor
This should not turn into a discussion as to which shooting Discipline requires the greatest amount of skill and preparedness on the equipment end.
Short Range Group and Score requires a different level of precision in bullet than many other Disciplines. I do not make my own 6mm and 30 cal bullets because I like to. I make them because I believe they give me a better chance at winning.
However, as accurate as they are at 100/200/300 yards, they are not designed to shoot in Disciplines that require a bullet to perform at much longer ranges.
Nor is any mass produced bullet, including Berger, Hornady, Nosler, Speer, Sierra etc going to be competitive in a Discipline such as Short Range Benchrest where we sacrifice all aspects of internal and external ballistics for that magic “Sub .200 agging capability”.
These “match” bullets produced my the mass production companies are designed to shoot in Disciplines that are NOT beyond the manufacturing capability of their bullet.
Short Range Group and Score requires a different level of precision in bullet than many other Disciplines. I do not make my own 6mm and 30 cal bullets because I like to. I make them because I believe they give me a better chance at winning.
However, as accurate as they are at 100/200/300 yards, they are not designed to shoot in Disciplines that require a bullet to perform at much longer ranges.
Nor is any mass produced bullet, including Berger, Hornady, Nosler, Speer, Sierra etc going to be competitive in a Discipline such as Short Range Benchrest where we sacrifice all aspects of internal and external ballistics for that magic “Sub .200 agging capability”.
These “match” bullets produced my the mass production companies are designed to shoot in Disciplines that are NOT beyond the manufacturing capability of their bullet.
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I got hold of .308 eldm. Weighed a box. 1.2gns different between heaviest and lightest.
Hornady podcast indicated that the min to max variation in a lot could equal a little bit of vertical at 1000 yards, this translated to maybe 4" or 5" at 1000. By modern f class standards that's a country mile. I guess the implication is sort & batch and you will be OK?
This is what I'm going to do this season as I can actually get hold of Hornady projectiles so kudos to them.
Hornady podcast indicated that the min to max variation in a lot could equal a little bit of vertical at 1000 yards, this translated to maybe 4" or 5" at 1000. By modern f class standards that's a country mile. I guess the implication is sort & batch and you will be OK?
This is what I'm going to do this season as I can actually get hold of Hornady projectiles so kudos to them.
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