Freedom Benchrest members support???

[Rat Rifle]

Here is my nickel's worth and an example. "Anderson Creek" here in Pa. "HAD"
a small and older benchrest crowd. I made my bones as a pistolero as a younger
man but I grew older. I turned more to the rifle side of things where I could sit on
my ass and relax......Short story, long version......Jeff Gates invites me down to give
it a try. At the time, they were shooting UBR with factory/hunter, comp class, and
unlimited. I had to shoot unlimited because my Ridgway VBR rifle was over the 13.5
lb. limit most were shooting.......Well the powers that be at the club decided to still
stay with the UBR type match but combine all rifle classes but factory into one group.
Sound familiar ?? I'll get back to that......After the first year, competitors doubled. More
guy's that could'nt make weight were showing up. Guy's that shot light gun could now
drag out the heavy gun to get the dust off of it. Another relay was added with the
growth. Life is good......Now for, "I'll get back to that" ?? Before Jim Cline pushed for
the Tack Driver concept, Anderson Creek was doing it but using UBR targets. It was
mainly a score match but group was thrown in as a side match. More competitors
came on board and a younger bunch not nearing retirement......We had a youngster
by the name of Jeremiah Keefe (LOL) set up a Tack Driver match at Anderson Creek
with Jim Clines blessing. It was the first off shoot of the group/score concept. It maxed
out the registrations. The main Tack Driver is maxing out it's registration. More clubs
are adding this format and again maxing out registrations......What's the key factor here ??
Simple rules that can be printed on one page. Who would of thought by throwing out
rule books of varying organizations would be the largest promoter of benchrest !!!
Maybe the Tack Driver should create it's own hall of fame, I mean why not ?? Personally,
I would say it would drive growth even more.......For the main event I would go awarded,

Shoot complete match.......0ne point
Make top ten..........................Five points
Win it.........................................Ten points and and automatic TD-HOF placement.


As always......Thinking out loud !!

See what happens when We all get along

 

[Jtizzo1950]

I do like Jim every time I've met him or spoke to him. He gave me nothing to dislike. But I do have to disagree with the direction of the sport. We have more formats than I can count single target agg two target agg three target agg five shots in heavy ten shots in heavy.Nobody's doing the same thing. Some nationals don't follow the rules.Others do. Some use e targets. Some allow twenty two pound in light gun. Some don't. We have rear sandbags that are sandpaper, covered with a piece of fabric. Calling that a sandbag. It's gotten out of control and I don't think it's the right direction, but everyone is welcome to their opinion. There really is no need for a sanctioning body if we're not going to all assimilate and shoot the same game, we could save a lot of effort and just run club matches.

I agree with Alex, sandpaper isn’t a sandbag. The sport is going in all directions and none of the directors are following the rules. It’s coming to what ever you can come up with that will get you high scores.

 

[JFrank]

This is what I found doing a quick search.

Google Search

 

[R L U]

This is what I found doing a quick search.

Google Search

Nice to see someone ask a ? And then answer it with a little effort. Most statements I’ve read here are misleading comments or statements from other people’s opinion of false facts.

 

[shoot4fun]

I agree with Alex, sandpaper isn’t a sandbag. The sport is going in all directions and none of the directors are following the rules. It’s coming to what ever you can come up with that will get you high scores.

I've shot both many different bench rest games and through many organizations over the years. No one, be it NBRSA, IBS or Freedom has ever come to my bench and done a check to make sure I'm within the rules. Nor have I ever seen that happen to any other shooter on the line. The only thing ever done has been that guns are weighed to make sure they are within the limits of the class.
I believe if you were to see someone blatantly violating the rules it is up to you to decide if you want to snitch or not. Don't wait until the match is over and do it because they finished ahead of you in results.
I know of one IBS MD that was seen on multiple times having his bolt in the rifle before the command was given. I wasn't there but heard it from several who were. It wasn't just in the action it was win the action and being cycled. Clearly a violation of IBS rules, not to mention safety. Not the first time I had seen or heard of this type thing under that MD and I no longer will shoot there. Tell me now just how IBS rules are better?

 

[Fuj]

Rear sand bag arrived from Protektor......DR Flat top. Short bunny ears
spaced 2" apart and covered with the slick silver material. Double thick
integral base riser with non skid bottom. Heavy sand filled. Don't drop
it on your foot.......Anybody have a problem with it ??

 

[Evan]

Rear sand bag arrived from Protektor......DR Flat top. Short bunny ears
spaced 2" apart and covered with the slick silver material. Double thick
integral base riser with non skid bottom. Heavy sand filled. Don't drop
it on your foot.......Anybody have a problem with it ??

“Sandbags” of today are closer to a mechanical rest than the squeeze bag my grandpa carried in the field to shoot with.

 

[Ahhnother8]

Here is my nickel's worth and an example. "Anderson Creek" here in Pa. "HAD"
a small and older benchrest crowd. I made my bones as a pistolero as a younger
man but I grew older. I turned more to the rifle side of things where I could sit on
my ass and relax......Short story, long version......Jeff Gates invites me down to give
it a try. At the time, they were shooting UBR with factory/hunter, comp class, and
unlimited. I had to shoot unlimited because my Ridgway VBR rifle was over the 13.5
lb. limit most were shooting.......Well the powers that be at the club decided to still
stay with the UBR type match but combine all rifle classes but factory into one group.
Sound familiar ?? I'll get back to that......After the first year, competitors doubled. More
guy's that could'nt make weight were showing up. Guy's that shot light gun could now
drag out the heavy gun to get the dust off of it. Another relay was added with the
growth. Life is good......Now for, "I'll get back to that" ?? Before Jim Cline pushed for
the Tack Driver concept, Anderson Creek was doing it but using UBR targets. It was
mainly a score match but group was thrown in as a side match. More competitors
came on board and a younger bunch not nearing retirement......We had a youngster
by the name of Jeremiah Keefe (LOL) set up a Tack Driver match at Anderson Creek
with Jim Clines blessing. It was the first off shoot of the group/score concept. It maxed
out the registrations. The main Tack Driver is maxing out it's registration. More clubs
are adding this format and again maxing out registrations......What's the key factor here ??
Simple rules that can be printed on one page. Who would of thought by throwing out
rule books of varying organizations would be the largest promoter of benchrest !!!
Maybe the Tack Driver should create it's own hall of fame, I mean why not ?? Personally,
I would say it would drive growth even more.......For the main event I would go awarded,

Shoot complete match.......0ne point
Make top ten..........................Five points
Win it.........................................Ten points and and automatic TD-HOF placement.


As always......Thinking out loud !!

EXACTLY!!!

Our local SR benchrest match director did much the same. "Bring what ya' got and lets have some fun." Match attendance has gone up and the most popular course of fire is a group/score combo on the UBR targets at 200 yards. Eliminates the stupid bullet diameter advantage. Varmint rifles, 22# F-Class rifles, oddball rifles are all welcome. And who wins the matches? The same 6PPC & 30BR shooters who won the matches before it became an "outlaw" match.

I came from many years of Palma shooting. There were rules on minimum trigger weight, maximum rifle weight, etc. Most of those rules have been abandoned and you know who wins the matches under the new rules? The same shooters who won the matches before the lessor rules package.

For the most part, it seems that most current LR & SR benchrest shooters are happy with the trajectory of the sport and are happy with the participation and recruitment levels. There is far more concern about what the guy on the other bench might or might not be doing. The benchrest crowd is certainly 'different' in that respect.

 

[mikegaiz]

I have been a member and shooting in 1000 Yd Matches for two years. along with friends. I have yet to see any support in tallying or posting any individual early results, It seems like only two clubs show any updates and no life time totals, which have not been updated in two years. Isn't that one of the main reason for belonging to an organization? What dose Freedom Benchrest provide for members???

I was asking a very simple question About an organization tracking total points for an individual life totals, There is such a page on the site, but it has not been updated for all members for two years.
Yes it is all about shooting and having fun, that is not my issue.....

 

[mikegaiz]

---

I'm trying to understand the motivation behind this thread. I ask this because there are some comments that are completely false, or stupendously ignorant. I find it comical when I hear comments concerning the beginning of Freedom BR from people that weren't associated with us, and they announce the "facts" as if they were the court stenographer. Freedom BR was founded by some of the most experienced and informed board members, committee members and accounting officers of another organization. We decided that Long Range BR would never reach a best and highest future in an organization that had opposing visions, ethics and methods of operation among the e-board. Nothing More, Nothing Less.

So, let's get back to the first comment on this thread. If someone is upset about the results not being updated fast enough for them. The results and updates have improved, but maybe you can volunteer to help?

If someone is upset with the Rules and Match formats of Freedom BR approved competitions. Then write up a proposed change, submit it to any of our 26 match directors and they can submit it for a vote by the end of the year. No gathering 25 signatures, no committee approval, no oversite or possible rejection from the e-board. Just an up or down vote, without the input of the short range disciplines and possible influences of board members that have personal agendas. Does any other BR organization offer that?

So, I guess someone can complain, or maybe they can be part of what they might see as a solution.

Guys, we just came back from a great match at the Red White and Blue Range in Polar Georgia, It was a lot of fun and this is what we wish for everyone.

Thanks and please call with any questions.

316-259-2581
Jim

I started this messed up thread, Asking about life time points numbers being updated, I have contacted ever contact on the Web site multiple times and have had no response, so I tried this. I don't think that is asking too much from the origination.

 

[Canuckienns]

Rear sand bag arrived from Protektor......DR Flat top. Short bunny ears
spaced 2" apart and covered with the slick silver material. Double thick
integral base riser with non skid bottom. Heavy sand filled. Don't drop
it on your foot.......Anybody have a problem with it ??

Lots of retired Miilford style bags retired or for sale down at Manatee where anything goes.

 

[shoot4fun]

I started this messed up thread, Asking about life time points numbers being updated, I have contacted ever contact on the Web site multiple times and have had no response, so I tried this. I don't think that is asking too much from the origination.

If you want it maybe you should take on the job officially. Contact Jim Bauer and tell him you will take the job. It takes an army of volunteers to do all the work. I did the full year points for a local club match and I just can't imagine the time it would take to keep them for all the clubs that have become Freedom sanctioned since it started. Also, some MDs fail to see an urgency to send those point totals to the statistician as well. That is like herding cats!
As small an org as GBA was they couldn't keep up with theirs either.

 

[Rat Rifle]

Rear sand bag arrived from Protektor......DR Flat top. Short bunny ears
spaced 2" apart and covered with the slick silver material. Double thick
integral base riser with non skid bottom. Heavy sand filled. Don't drop
it on your foot.......Anybody have a problem with it ??

Looks like a sandbag to Me Fuj

 

[Evan]

If you want it maybe you should take on the job officially. Contact Jim Bauer and tell him you will take the job. It takes an army of volunteers to do all the work. I did the full year points for a local club match and I just can't imagine the time it would take to keep them for all the clubs that have become Freedom sanctioned since it started. Also, some MDs fail to see an urgency to send those point totals to the statistician as well. That is like herding cats!
As small an org as GBA was they couldn't keep up with theirs either.

This is where standardizing the scoresheets and match protocol become critical. We really need to work on automating the data ingestion so that this isn’t a manual job for a volunteer to pour over a pile of disparate pdf scoresheets and assemble the results. I have been fiddling with some Python scripts to score and output CSV files that would be easier to work with on a large scale, but with two small children now, I don’t have the time I did years ago when I first stepped up to statistician for CRC.

 

[shoot4fun]

This is where standardizing the scoresheets and match protocol become critical. We really need to work on automating the data ingestion so that this isn’t a manual job for a volunteer to pour over a pile of disparate pdf scoresheets and assemble the results. I have been fiddling with some Python scripts to score and output CSV files that would be easier to work with on a large scale, but with two small children now, I don’t have the time I did years ago when I first stepped up to statistician for CRC.

And we have a new volunteer!

 

[Evan]

And we have a new volunteer!

I’m available to help anyone anytime, but I don’t have enough time to take the lead position. MDs and statisticians across the country have my number and if you don’t and would like to call me, send a PM.

 

[Longrangelefty]

I’m available to help anyone anytime, but I don’t have enough time to take the lead position. MDs and statisticians across the country have my number and if you don’t and would like to call me, send a PM.

This is the most pro shooting comment on the entire post. Recommending solutions, volunteering to help and giving feedback, whether positive or constructive (without an agenda) is how to grow the sport. I’d like to thank you personally, Evan!

Blake

 

[mikegaiz]

If you want it maybe you should take on the job officially. Contact Jim Bauer and tell him you will take the job. It takes an army of volunteers to do all the work. I did the full year points for a local club match and I just can't imagine the time it would take to keep them for all the clubs that have become Freedom sanctioned since it started. Also, some MDs fail to see an urgency to send those point totals to the statistician as well. That is like herding cats!
As small an org as GBA was they couldn't keep up with theirs either.

I do web sites for three clubs, that is enough, How about you?

 

[Fuj]

Looks like a sandbag to Me Fuj

My grandson said it looked like a toaster.......LOL

 

[Rat Rifle]

I do web sites for three clubs, that is enough, How about you

mikegiaz is a “WORKER” for the organizations He participates in !