big money on ations...

[82boy]

I will also add Fred won a piece of wood for high score in St Louis's 600 yard IBS match Saturday, (3/16/13) shooting a Savage. He also came close in shooting small group.

 

[bozo699]

madderg your findings are exactly the same as what I have found out years ago. I been flamed, and cut apart for stating that a Savage action can and will shoot as good as ANY custom action on the market.

If someone says they dont believe it, or that a Savage has never competed or been competitive in a Sanction match. I submit this a thread written by Jack Neary that came from Benchrest central.
http://benchrest.com/showthread.php?84709-Hurricane-Sandy-Pays-Visit-to-79th-Annual-Shelby-County-Fall-Finale-Match!&highlight=hurican+sandy

Fred Moreo (Owner of Sharp Shooters supply) shot a gun that he built, and shot in a NBRSA match he finished 3rd place in Light Gun 200 yards, 3rd place in heavy gun 100 yard, shot small group with a .169 at 100 yard, and finished overall in 5th place. http://issuu.com/precisionrifleman/docs/547637_mag1of1/17

Here is a picture of Fred taken at the match with the Savage rifle.

82Boy,
I don't think anyone would disagree that a Savage can't be competitive in some disciplines but lets face facts, to consistently win in 1000 yard br, don't know about other disciplines but 1000 yard br the faster you get them down there the better off you are, I soot with a guy that pretty consistently he will put 10 down range in under 19 seconds you won't do that with a Savage action, and the best trigger on the market for a Savage Fred makes and it isn't nearly as good as a Jewell, I have competed with a Savage and did okay but it is no match for a Viper with a drop port on a day in and day out competing.
Wayne.

 

[GSPV]

Just a question: how much time and money did Fred put into his Savage action?

You can make most any action shoot danged well. The question is how much time and money it takes to get it there.

 

[NateHaler]

Re: big money on actions...

Fred Moreo (Owner of Sharp Shooters supply) shot a gun that he built

I'm glad Fred finally got his rifle from Sharp Shooters Supply. I heard that they were happy to take his money, and then quoted him 4 weeks turnaround, and then starting treating him really poorly after 6 months went by and still nothing from SSS except excuses. Imagine what they do if you're just a customer, instead of the owner. :

 

[82boy]

I soot with a guy that pretty consistently he will put 10 down range in under 19 seconds you won't do that with a Savage action, [/quote]

I would like to debate that.
I have 3 Savage that SSS has T&Ted the actions, out of them 3 I can say all of them are way smooter than my 2 Bats, and my Panda's. With a dual port Savage, I can run a group just as fast as I can with my Panda or a Bat. I shot a IBS 600 yard match Saturday with a SSS built Savage Axis rifle, with a Accu-trigger set ot 4oz. I was sitting beside Jerry Klopel (On Heck of a fast shooter.) with his Bat, and it was a drag race to see who could get the 5 rounds off faster between the two of us. There was a couple of times I got my rounds off before he did. I know that Fred can run and gun with all of his Savage built as well, with many shooters saying, Dang that was fast.

 

[82boy]

Just a question: how much time and money did Fred put into his Savage action?

You can make most any action shoot danged well. The question is how much time and money it takes to get it there.

No more time that he puts into any other customers action. The gun doesn't belong to Fred, the guy that owns it has $1800 into it. The stock is a Tom Meridith br built by Kelbly, SSS inleted it, and pillar bedded it. The barrel is a Krieger 1 in 14 twist chambered by SSS. The action is a Target action, with a SSS evolution trigger, the action recieved a T&T job from SSS, just as anyother rifle built. The scope is a 45 Power Leupold mounted in Talley rings. The gun weighs in a hair over 10 lbs, and has plenty of room before it gets to the 10.5 area.

 

[bozo699]

Well there you have it folks,...buy a Savage they will run faster and shoot straighter then a Bat or other high dollar actions, I have no idea what were thinking when we dish out $1000 plus when for $450 we could be winning and take the rest for components, Nosler partitions probably or Speer Grand slams for long range stuff and original Barns X for sr br, Thank God for the computer it's all documented so I don't have to take notes
Wayne.

 

[smoking-brass]

I own to savage target actions....nice actions....but the triggers cannot be set below 8 oz. If you try the trigger will go off when closing the bolt ever so gently. I shot F/O with both rifles and they shoot very well. I went with the savage actions because I could not afford a custom action right now. BUT it gets me in the game... and a lot of guys are surprised how they perform.
Fred's actions are any thing but STOCK savage actions. I replaced my accu-triggers with rifle basic 2 triggers...the accu-triggers would not perform like they said...not practical for f-class or benchrest . My opinion's are only based on my 2 rifles.

Vinnie

 

[LHSmith]

The proofs in the pudding..... Bring them 1's and 2's shooting Savages to sanctioned short range matches (group or score) and prove your convictions.
Short of more than one example where Savage has done well...it is nothing but conjecture until more step-up to the plate. Yes, travel is expensive, but if you trust enough in your Savage to be competitive, there is only one way to prove your point.
BTW, I know little about Savages, but isn't that SSS action trued and what is the final cost of that action after all the bells and whistles have been added to "accurize" it?.....in other words "what's the point of using a Savage if it is going to end up costing the same money....and with less re-sale value?

 

[kelbro]

SSS time and true runs around $150 if I remember correctly. After Fred worked them, I can lift my bolts with the top of my index finger. Quick, light, and smooth. Savage triggers can't get light enough for BR.

Could I spend triple for another action? Yes. Would it triple my X's? Nope.

Can I screw a sporter 243 barrel onto a BAT and slip it into a composite stock to go shoot coyotes, come home and swap it back to an F/TR contender for a match the next morning?

I like my Savages for what they are and don't pretend that they are any more or less.

 

[Alex Wheeler]

I have 3 Savage that SSS has T&Ted the actions, out of them 3 I can say all of them are way smooter than my 2 Bats, and my Panda's. With a dual port Savage, I can run a group just as fast as I can with my Panda or a Bat.

I own one savage. A lot of guys I shoot with have them, some T&Y by sss. None of them even come close to a bat or panda. How are you determining smoothness?

 

[LHSmith]

Bat is a great action, but did you ever get any burned residue from the extracted case in the lug area? If you did I bet the bolt seized...and my Savage is a dual port also.

No....what kind of powder are you using to cause that much residue?

 

[82boy]

I have 3 Savage that SSS has T&Ted the actions, out of them 3 I can say all of them are way smooter than my 2 Bats, and my Panda's. With a dual port Savage, I can run a group just as fast as I can with my Panda or a Bat.

I own one savage. A lot of guys I shoot with have them, some T&Y by sss. None of them even come close to a bat or panda. How are you determining smoothness?

Close your eyes, or blind fold your self, and have someone put both rifles side by side in random order. Open the bolt, and see wich one is better. I have done, it as well as others shooting at various ranges, and just to see what other people say.

 

[82boy]

The proofs in the pudding..... Bring them 1's and 2's shooting Savages to sanctioned short range matches (group or score) and prove your convictions... BTW, I know little about Savages, but isn't that SSS action trued and what is the final cost of that action after all the bells and whistles have been added to "accurize" it?.....in other words "what's the point of using a Savage if it is going to end up costing the same money....and with less re-sale value?

Now you have answered the question why you dont see more Savage competeing in competiton. A Savage target action T&T with all the bells and whistles is going to run close to $900, a couple of hundred dollars more and you can get a custom action that will have a higher resale.

 

[LHSmith]

I have always suspected that the finest custom actions were a horrible ripoff. I need to send this thread to all my BR buddies so they can start saving a lot of money as well! Not much wait time either!............... 8)

And like most ripoffs, it becomes more evident by their poor re-sale value :

 

[digrazir]

In the long run building a custom rifle starting a custom build with a custom action will cost you less money. The true cost of ownership is the amount of money you put in it compared to the value of it when you finish. The best part is being able to enjoy your custom action as opposed to apologizing for a Savage action. Ray

 

[LHSmith]

Anybody know the lock time of a Savage vs some of the customs?

If a savage is true...boltface, lugs, tighter bolt, then what makes it different from a custom action? Besides looks, lock time, and ease of bolt lift after being fired...and price?

I have no idea what the lock time is on a savage..

Best info I can find is : Accutrigger =1.6 milliseconds/ Stolle, Hall (customs) ~1.7 m/s / Rem. 700 = 2.5 m/s
However, lock time is pretty much a non-issue when you are testing off a bench ( unless it's comparing a Savage 11 vs. a Lyman Deerstalker)
A more important aspect than lock time would be "action timing"....and there are very few gunsmiths who have the ability to get an action timed to it's true potential... Jim Borden is one of the best. It is unlikely to find a factory action whose "timing" won't benefit from some tweaking.

 

[T 700]

You can put lipstick on a pig, But you still have a pig!!!

NO way ever will a savage be as good as a Bat or other custom.

Why buy it, Then work on it, what's the point ???

You will have as much in it as a custom ??? ??? Then when you go to sell it you will loose BIG!! All that $$$ down the drain.

T 700

 

[BoydAllen]

On the Rifle Basix SavII trigger, do you have your trigger pivot positioned for lightest pull weight? Those triggers have three possible positions for the pivot. With it in the position for lightest pull, there is more leverage to disengage the sear, but you have a little more trigger travel in doing so. Back when I installed mine, and wrote the first article (Precision Shooting) about it, I was able to set it at an honest 4oz. and close the bolt any way I wanted to. (BTW those DVD, now probably downloadable video, installation instructions were my idea. )

 

[Killshot]

Funny stuff.
Some of you sound like the Porsche owners on the performance car forums.....