I've seen numbers from 16,000 to 19,000 fps.
Barrel tuners. Good or a waste of time?
- Thread starter geordiesniper
- Start date
And I believe the speed of sound in water is over twice that so.........
My point is, NEITHER OF US knows what we're talking about!
LOL
Does any engineering data on line list speed of sound in solids and liquids?
Are they credible?
One site lists about 4800 fps in water.
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jimmymac
Jim McGregor
Thanks for sharing this. Can you explain the procedure you used? I’m not correlating the above numbers to the target. I’m also unsure why zero is better than the other two below it. Looking to get educated without getting caught up in the speed of sound through steel scenario.
Terry
Gold $$ Contributor
The tuner is numbed 0-30. Not knowing where the sweet spot is I fired two shots at 0, then -2 and +2 marks. Then again at 5, and 10. I was running low on ammo so some just got two shots.
I can't say why the 0 area was better, but I'll take it. I don't pretend to know much about this, just reporting what happened.
I can't say why the 0 area was better, but I'll take it. I don't pretend to know much about this, just reporting what happened.
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Ok Mike you tell Me
In the target below I am looking for the optimum place to set the tuner. As you can see there are plenty of nice groups. This is with a 6BR shooting 3 shot groups with 105 gr Hammers at 100 yards! Row 4 is the final test to see which quadrant I will use.
The final Tuner settings at 4A,4B and 4C all look good. I can't tell which is the correct one. So I run the same three tuner settings, except this time I shot the groups with three different loads into each (30.0, 30.3, 30.6 of varget). If you shoot a 6BR you know that's a humongous change in load and velocity. So groups 4D and 5A are vertical, but 4e is a nice 3 shot .185. Groups 5b and 5c are to see if it will repeat. It does! So now I will tweak the tuner as necessary during match time. This is what I took to the 600 yard Nationals.
Looking at my notes, this year I've had 23 first place finishes, 18 second place finishes, set Two World records and won 600 Yard Shooter of The Year! Not trying to have a pissing contest but there is an optimum spot or quadrant.
Bart
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I have no idea what you were doing Bart. Tuners are not that complicated to use. I can show a 10 year old all they need to know in a matter of minutes.
Yes, there are certainly optimal settings. That's the point of tuners.
I do not wish to argue with you. As I said, use it the way that you feel works best for you.
Yes, there are certainly optimal settings. That's the point of tuners.
I do not wish to argue with you. As I said, use it the way that you feel works best for you.
Yes you can teach a 10 year old in ten minutes your method.
Mike
It's a great group. But I'm looking for a setting where the bullets impact at the same spot on the target over a large tune window. It's my take on positive compensation. Once you find that spot it's much, much easier to keep the rifle in tune.
Bart
Wha'BAMMM!
well said
so.... while that pertickler hole is "just a good little clump" all by itself it's the STRINGS of good little clumps yer looking for.... and how they're hangin'.....
and where
mikeeg02
Michael Glantz
I guess when I look at 3-A,B,C I see them all in the same spot aside from maybe one bullet in group B. The same could almost be said for group 4 A,B,C, though it presents a little more windage.
Just curious how you were reading the target. Thanks for the reply!
Edit: I am always intrigued to see how other "read" a string of targets.
Just curious how you were reading the target. Thanks for the reply!
Edit: I am always intrigued to see how other "read" a string of targets.
Bart,
So was 3a,b,c & d different powder loads?
They are forming at 7oclock to 6.30 and look bloody good to me.
What am I missing? Are you wanting them to form higher?
Just trying to learn
Michael
Interesting objective.
What do you think AL? Can you see the advantage to having a barrel that shoots in the same spot over an extremely large load window? Mike says I'm making it too complicated! I know it works out to 600. Next year we will see how it does at 1000. What I have is an edge.
Bart
Bart if I tol' ya' what I think you'd get all embarrassed and stuff ......
I am deeply honored to be in the same room with folks like yourself (and yes, like Mike.... I ain't playing favorites) out here on the freakin' bleeding edge.
And, what you're saying is basically what Jim Borden taught in a class I attended back in 2000,
And, weirdly enough, I shot my LG at 600 NBRSA today with a Borden prototype tuner!
(talk about Olde Schoole!!)
Honestly, I've never considered the segmented "quadrant" approach but I shoot at large pieces of paper (construction blueprints) with horizontal ruled lines, hashes and aiming circles. Long strings of groups, sometimes takes 3-4 days to fill a paper, PRECISELY because it allows me to see how groups form in relation to each other......
And also to see the (deer tracks??)
dunno, I can't really say WHAT I'm looking at
But I can SEE IT!
LOL
And BTW as per "having an edge???"
Dude.....
I fish, (better)
I hunt, (better)
I run a construction business.....
I don't fish to drink.
I don't hunt "to enjoy God's Creation" and
I don't run a construction company "because I need a job"
In my mind, without an EDGE, if I'm just out there panting along with the pack
I might just as well set on the porch and rock
til the chair stops
BTW when Jim taught it it was about TUNING, called "sine wave tuning"
Not tuners
Different strokes
same song.
AL,
I’ll show you tomorrow what I’m doing and how I arrive at what I’m doing. It’s not Jim’s sine wave method. You can’t do what I’m doing without a tuner.
In fairness Mike Ezell’s tuner is a great piece of work. The problem is Mike doesn’t realize there’s another Level to using a tuner.
I’m going to explain this one time on the board. After that I’m Never going to mention or discuss it on this board again!
Hope everyone has a good night!
Bart
OK, so I'ma' give YOU something to chew on..... I've got several prototype tuning systems I'm working with where there's a lobe, a weight, a cam-shaped plate sandwiched between the two locking rings. The lobe can be oriented wherever you want it.
This thing will walk shots into any box of the quadrant.
Ain't saying I GOT anything..... just dinking around with ideas cuz barrels are crooked, and it kinda' coincides with your "quadrants" expression.
Thank you for taking the time, looking forward to tomorrow.
I feel that to set or check a tuner setting
You should Measure the difference from the point of aim . I see no
3 as a lower left tune
5 as trending upright
But not in the correct spot
But close
In between the two the bullet displacement Their was a horizontal Movement that was missed
You should Measure the difference from the point of aim . I see no
3 as a lower left tune
5 as trending upright
But not in the correct spot
But close
In between the two the bullet displacement Their was a horizontal Movement that was missed
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