Are we too competitive ?

[Coyotefurharvester]

Very few people would pay to enter any competitive event and be happy with finishing last. Most aren't Ricky Bobby's dad(if you ain't first your last). The majority are in between, have enough common sense to recognize their own limitations. Some have an underdog drive that pushes them past barriers (equipment, physical ability, money limitations), most seem to cheer a good bit more for the underdog. So don't be afraid to be the underdog in the fight. Give it your best shot(no pun intended) , play by the rules. You will feel better.

 

[Uncle Bruce]

I don't long for those days I still live them!

Get ready... I could never understand the prize table, why does the guy who just won a match with obviously good equipment need an action that is nothing he needs. The examples go on and on. If you want to make more people happy give everyone a equal chance at every prize. And yes this is from someone who never got into the top 5.
The entry fees are completely out of site, our local match last Saturday was 7$ to shoot 4 targets. A second relay was 3 dollars more. 10 bucks for 8 targets. No prize table but free coffee and donuts.

 

[Dave M.]

You insult me with the driving thing. I live in fly over country and in years past I've put upwards of 50,000 miles on a combination of cars and motorcycles all over the world including track days with the motorcycles. I drive it like I stole it (regardless of what I'm driving or riding) everywhere I go. Driving is a sport to me whether that be on the track or through a tight set of curvy roads or even in the city when possible. The Alps are probably my favorite place for this kind of activity. If you are freaked out by the driving here in the US then you should never go to Europe. Running down a mountain pass at 9/10 of what you are capable of on a track and knowing that if you get it wrong you are going to go over the edge on a 180 degree turn and not touch down for at least 3000 feet to the bottom really gets the adrenaline flowing. Picture that, then picture getting passed like you are standing still by the local talent and you get a drift of how other people view motor sports. There is an old saying: if it can't kill you, it's not a sport. And I have not been in an accident in over 40 years. That was a fender bender. We won't even talk about running down the Autbahn are 170 mph and having cars come up on you at 30-50 mph faster than your are going. Better get the hell out of the way AND fast.

Yeah, the way many people drive here in the US it seems that the only requirement for a license is the ability to fog a mirror. I pity those who lack the capacity to absorb the inputs associated with operating a motor vehicle and I think they should park it and consider public transportation. My problem with drivers is the opposite of yours. I think most people should have their license pulled. Especially when they are following me through snowy mountain passes and they STILL can't keep it on the road.

Just a different perspective. I've never been a cliff jumper when skiing but I know people who are. The difference between them and me is skill and practice. Perhaps that is the difference between you and those who you denigrate.

If you haven't guessed, you picked an open sore.

Now as far as money in shooting, whew, I shoot off a Rodzilla or I could have been tarred with that SEB brush.

lol. Clearly, you’ve never driven in Metro Detroit. Haha. Most aggressive and worst drivers on the road. We have about 1 freeway road rage shooting per week. Driving here is crazy. The only two places I’ve experienced with more aggressive drivers would be Mexico City and São Paulo Brazil (and I lived in Italy, England, Germany and Japan).
Dave

 

[Mulligan]

A friend had a double trick, double throwdown press...CNC'd by Swedish virgins drinking Perrier by a brook in the moon light or something like that. No need to name it but it's right at $1,200.

With one of my dies in the high zoot press, the case runout was double what my 25 year old loosey goosey Partner press with a 69 cent 'o' ring under the lock ring delivers.

Listen to Al!^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

CW

 

[Mulligan]

I run the 600 yard BR matches at Western Colorado.
The guys running Savage actions with pre-fit barrels and old hart rests will come in ahead of some of the best rifles money can by……. Every time, if they (and they do) spend the resources (time and components) to tune.
We have a small handful of retired Marines who have what looks like yard sale equipment (as compared to the 6K$ rifles topped with majesta scopes) that will put the whup on you if you didn’t bring your A-game

CW

 

[ronsatspokane]

lol. Clearly, you’ve never driven in Metro Detroit. Haha. Most aggressive and worst drivers on the road. We have about 1 freeway road rage shooting per week. Driving here is crazy. The only two places I’ve experienced with more aggressive drivers would be Mexico City and São Paulo Brazil (and I lived in Italy, England, Germany and Japan).
Dave

Rode a motorcycle though Bangalore India, Mysore to the western Ghats and back. Nothing quite like it. Traffic flows like water and redefines the term "agressive". I had to ride on a sidewalk at one point to get through. Italians are my favorite drivers. They stop on a pass, evaluate the road ahead then go tear it up. In the US we really have nothing to complain about. I don't get mad at people but I had a guy just a couple months ago who was holding up a line of traffic. He would slow to 20 in a 45 mph zone then accelerate to 50 then back to 20 just being a prick. I got around him when it became 4 lane road. I turned off and he started following me up the road to my rural house. I stopped, grabbed my camera and started filming him. Foul mouthed son-of-a-bitch who wanted to block traffic. It seems that the angry ones are the ones who want to block traffic. Not only that, they are the ones who can't keep their car in the lane.

 

[ronsatspokane]

I feel your pain......LOL I shot the Bald Eagle for years, and one day
I decided to see what the joy sticks were all about. I went and picked
up a "Shade Tree" and had that "Ah Ha" moment. looking down the
line, all you seen were Seb, and I mean most. Seen an ad for Lenzi
and was told 12 months if not longer. The T-Rex could be had in six
months, and Rod had it to my door in less then two. I still use the
Shade Tree and especially for the grandson. Did I really need it ?? No.
Being retired, I like to buy myself something nice, once a year. So that's
how I justify it. It's only money !!

My wife would be grateful if I bought myself something nice only once a year. Try to get her to buy herself nice things but she rarely does.

I had a SEB mini and went to the Rodzilla. I like it. I guess the SEB bigfoot I failed to mention would get me tarred with that brush. I definitely get the too much money in the game thing. The 6 BRA I shoot sometimes in mid range helped with that. I bought it used off this site. It came with 3 barrels, 400 rounds of fire formed and neck turned Lapua brass and 500 106 EPS bullets. It's a Haverkamp action in an X Ring stock. Got it at a price less than 2k. The deal of the century. Coupled with the fact that it only takes 31 grains of Varget to drive the Berger 109's I'm using now and it is a cost effective solution. Just have to keep an eye out for good deals. If I see a deal on a 6.5-7 PRC in a Borden action with a decent stock I'll probably grab it for long range. Don't expect people to get bored with them for a while though and I have something to shoot in the meantime.

 

[hogpatrol]

My 2¢, The quest for better helps everyone and yesterday's top shelf equipment is now common place and at a lot lower cost. An example is scopes To paraphrase President Reagan, Competition lifts all shooters.

 

[Sandstorm]

To paraphrase President Reagan, Competition lifts all shooters.

I like this...Amen to that my brothers.
My aim is just to be little bit better, a little bit better than before.

 

[Will Henry]

Quite a few years ago (about fifty years, now that I that think about it) I used to attend informal turkey shoots which were held in rural locations all over central British Columbia. These were generally a "one shot for center" sort of a thing with the range being from 100 to 300 yards and shots taken from a rest (picnic table) or off-hand. I had various rifles I used for this and usually tried to match the rifle to what was likely to show up at a given venue. I had a very good shooting Ruger No. 1 which won me a lot. I usually had the LV rifle tucked in the trunk, just in case. Other rifles which treated me well included a 700 Varmint in 308 and (believe it or not, a Marlin 1895 in 45/70 which I bought in 1973.
One time, I attended a match which was being held in a remote logging community. Given the remote location, I wasn't expecting a lot in the way of hardware so I only took my Brno 30/06 hunting rifle. It was a solid 3/4 moa rifle, so I figured to do ok. I arrived at the range/gravel pit and signed in, already mentally making space for all the turkeys I was going to be hauling home. The first guy to shoot pulled out a 6mm Rem . rifle which had a Shilen DGA action mounted in a Brown Precision stock. This turned out to be pretty standard equipment in the camp and I was in for a pretty long day. Luckily, they held a couple of off hand matches and luck was with me so I did take home a couple of birds.
One of my memorable successes at one of these matches took place at a venue where they were actually shooting five shots for group. I had a pretty good LV rifle in 308 (40x, hart barrel, glued into a Lee Six SPG stock. I got run off the road by a tourist in a motorhome and didn't there until just before the last match. I pulled out the 308 and parked five in .188". I picked up my turkey, shook hands all around, and headed back home. These shoots were as much fun to me as anything else I have shot. I didn't even mind when I was outclassed (it happened), it was still fun. WH

 

[Shooter13]

You can think of me however you like but I like toys, as has been stated here I'll buy something if I think it will help me shoot better, I want to win! I've worked my butt off during my lifetime to get to this point that being semi retired I can take advantage of that work ethic. I have a seb rest, I have more rear bags than I need but there are different rear bags for different stock, If I sell you something it is not because it is bad or doesn't work properly it is because I need something else. I love the competition and the competitors, many different diverse backgrounds but a lot of common ground!

 

[Lefty2506]

I've never shot BR or F-class. In fact it's been a few years since I fired a weapon in any kind of competition, and a LOT of years since I fired a weapon regularly in competition. I like an accurate rifle, and tiny groups just as much as the next guy, but my favorite thing to do used to be to show up to a match with basic, stock equipment, mind my own business, respectfully let all the guys with the expensive gear give me all kinds of "helpful suggestions" and then turn around and mop the floor with them. The last match I shot in was an informal bowling pin match at a local indoor range that some buddies talked me into going to. I showed up with my EDC (M&P 45 shield), the 2 mags that came with it and a ziplock bag with 100 rnds of 200gr lead RN reloads in it. It drew a few snickers from some of the other participants. My buddies kept their mouths shut, and I had an absolute BLAST (no pun intended). At one point, I came off the line and the old guy who owns our range was audibly laughing at my recent opponent and his fancy Shadow Systems setup. He was asking him if he needed to move a little closer to the pins so he didn't miss so much. It was all in good fun, but it was really good fun

Don't get me wrong. I've started getting into whacking Prairie Dogs. I have a new tripod and ball head arriving tomorrow, and I'm saving my pennies up to replace my (Cabela's) Savage Model 12FV 223 with a custom rifle...

 

[Kiwishooter]

If you go to a tournament thinking you have to beat everyone or are so thin skinned that you equate anyone finishing above you to your having been  beaten, you're done before you fire the first shot.

Be competitive with yourself and shoot the best you can. At the end of the day, they'll let you know where you finished.

Good shootin' -Al

I never look at the score sheet. I seldom look at my targets. I just saw what I did through my scope and know if it is good or bad. I never know how things turn out until the very end. I am there to do the best I possibly can and be as competitive as I can be. Every once in a while it actually works out.

When I started shooting Benchrest in the late 90's I thought the next bit of equipment I bought would make a difference or "shrink" my groups, I've still got some of that gear that didn't work.

After all these years I know that AlNyhus and Jimmymac have given some better than excellent advice.

There is absolutely no way you can control the results of someone else, the only person you should be concentrating on is YOU after all that is the only person that is shooting that you have any control over.
Al is so right the only person you should compete against is yourself and the results at the end will let you know how you did compared to everyone else.

I don't go to a match to win I go to compete against myself and I'm trying to shoot perfect groups (0.000) every time I go to the line, I've never done it yet, but I keep tryin

The most successful Benchrest shooter, Tony Boyer, could win a match and still think he had made mistakes so went home and practiced, I got the impression that he was competing against himself every time he went to the line.

 

[Downhill]

Competing against "yourself" can also become an issue. For a time I was consumed with NRA Service Rifle. Got some Leg Points, then was totally focused on going Distinguished. It got to the point where it was work, hard work. Relentless practice and making every match within 400 miles. I was (and am I guess) close and realized it was no longer enjoyable. Walked away and took up BR and found some pleasure in the shooting sports again. I'll probably never take a championship but it is enjoyable.

 

[rwj]

If any recreational activity ceases to bring a sense of enjoyment, I cease that activity.

 

[JFrank]

Watch out for the old guy with one old gun and a piece of crap front rest. He’s

Write that down.

 

[gkgeiger]

I’ll be 81 in a couple months. I highly recommend RFBR, usually great people shooting. I shot my first match in over 2 yrs yesterday and had a great time. I just filled out the paperwork to become a member at a local club. I’m sorry I didn’t do this when I first arrived at my new home.

 

[R&B]

Not meant to be a rant, but are we getting too competitive ?
Do we all need tuners ? An SEB joystick rest . A set up that is one degree off of rail
gun ? I don't know about the rest of you , but I came to shoot .
It seems to be more money, more gear, more prep, less passion every year.
I see posts on weighing primers, brass , sorting / pointing bullets.
I would not be surprised to see a microscope to sort powder grains by length.
At my club (F class) we decided to let some of our older marksman with back problems
shoot off of a bench. Due to a perceived advantage, everyone now has a back problem and needs a bench.
Is the prize table that good? Is the honor that high?
I have always enjoyed my club , I don't care if the most hard core competitors take advantage
of squading or questionable scoring . Shooting a relay has always been the high point of my week.
Win or loose, I couldn't care less. The most satisfied I have ever been with a relay was shooting an 85
out of 200 with an open sight palma rifle ( laugh all you want until you try it) .
End of (not rant) : Smell the powder burn, feel the wind, send the round, enjoy the gift of friendship
a 200 / 20X is great, its not everything

Never let unrealistic expectations get in the way of your enjoyment of any sport you participate in. Competition is really not so much about beating others but the ability to extract the best from yourself. This is a life lesson that goes a long long way. Expecting others to think and view the world the same way as you do is unrealistic and lends itself to stagnation. Figure out how to get better at something given the tools you have. Getting better at something over time is the sustainable magic in my distorted opinion . The win at all cost attitude is about something else and there is nothing wrong with that mindset. Many people are wired this way and it is the fuel they need to in order to participate.

Always remember the concept of diminishing returns as it is one of natures great filters for making progress.

R&B

 

[rwj]

Watch out for the old guy with one old gun and a piece of crap front rest.

Write that down.

I also like “beware the man with one gun.”

 

[Randfal]

I'm with the original poster on this. I've left a couple "shooting disciplines" just because of the fashion show they turned into. Since I too have aged, I thought about getting into F-Class and holy cow! I'm definitely not "cool" enough to shoot there. The forums and social media pages I lurked in to get a feel for the event ended up turning me off to even being associated with the group. There are great guys in there too, so I don't mean it about everyone, but I can remember some of the influencers when they were a little younger and quite the hot heads before they were "famous". If you know, you know what I mean, lol. I miss the "shoot what ya got" fun I used to have years ago.