Annealed some brass, suffered a lot of collapsed necks during resizing

[RegionRat]

I’m beginning to suspect there are many here who have never used a Lee Collet Die.

This design of the collet, when running properly, puts no forces on the case body that would cause a collapse of the shoulder, so I wouldn’t draw any connections to annealing or not annealing with this die.

When the die isn’t stuck closed, all it does is a radial squeeze on the neck and likely has zero to do with annealing nor would this type of die give any feedback of annealing at all.

ETA: OP, I worry when you report that this was done to more than one case in a session without the discovery of the issue. When a LCD is running properly, the case body goes nearly all the way into the die body and the collet is activated by hard contact with the shell holder.
If you get high force with a body still extending outside the die body, you should have stopped and un-stuck the die.

 

[JFrank]

Please share how you resolved the problem…

The necks got a tad soft so when the expander gripped the rough carbon the case collapsed, I brushed the necks and stopped annealing. I may or may not resume Annealing -just not sure yet, that was about three years ago.

 

[chop house]

If the LCD is collapsing your necks, you need to spread the collets.

yup, i have had to do this.... trial and error iirc..

 

[tominboise]

Photo of the collapsed necks:

 

[NorCalMikie]

Yep. Brass too soft. Been there, done that. Don't anneal and see how that works.

 

[tominboise]

Yep. Brass too soft. Been there, done that. Don't anneal and see how that works.

Yeah, I figured that. I have been using the LCD for 20+ years, including this particular set, on this brass, but I haven't annealed a great deal of brass in all that time. I think I may go back to not annealing.

 

[Dub]

properly annealing is the answer

 

[jpx2rk]

I suggest you clean your collet die, and lube it in-between the fingers or pedals that size the neck. There may be some burrs in-between the pedals, etc, which cause the pedals to stick in the closed position, and cause the damage to the cases shown.

 

[tominboise]

I suggest you clean your collet die, and lube it in-between the fingers or pedals that size the neck. There may be some burrs in-between the pedals, etc, which cause the pedals to stick in the closed position, and cause the damage to the cases shown.

I will check it out and lube it some.

 

[243winxb]

candle flame to anneal brass.

Made a sponge donut about 3/8" thick & 1 3/4" round. Wet sponge with water. Keep case neck/shoulder low in the flame.

Heat case while rotating 180 . When you hear water boiling, anneal is done.

243 win brass, about 30 seconds or till water sizzles. Any less time and brass in just stress relieved. Temperature + Time = Annealed.

- Flame temperatures

No need to place anneaaled brass into water to cool. Do wipe off soot with rag & fine steel wool.

I have played with the candle annealing . The test batch didnt come apart. But if using a bushing die, i dont need to anneal.

 

[243winxb]

This guy needs my wet donut. Below 400f Degrees, its just stress relieving the brass.

 

[JMayo]

I think it's set too low and he pressed the neck down into the case.

I did it with a mandrel, thinking it was tough to get into the neck when actually i had bottomed out the darn thing.

Now that mandrel is in a drawer of "not gonna use chit.

 

[Metal God]

This was my first attempt with the collet die . No worries after awhile I was able to get better but still might not be good enough ????

LMAO , I love showing those pics . I did not have the die adjusted correctly and the collet was clamping down on the neck before the neck was fully inserted . FWIW these were not annealed cases . Try adjusting the die a bit and see if that helps , Maybe even a little lube on the die inner parts so they don't hang up and start to clamp down to early . I'm no expert on the collet die ( obviously lol ) but if that's what the OP is using it should not be the annealing that caused the issue . Also I agree 9sec seems a bit long for what I do but would likely result in a fully annealed ( dead soft ) neck and shoulder . Not necessarily a bad thing if that's what you were going for .

 

[RegionRat]

@Metal God I agree that the OP probably has multiple issues with both his die set up and possibly his annealing based on his photos, but the important thing is not to give up too easy while also have the wisdom to know your limitations.

 

[jpx2rk]

This was my first attempt with the collet die . No worries after awhile I was able to get better but still might not be good enough ????

LMAO , I love showing those pics . I did not have the die adjusted correctly and the collet was clamping down on the neck before the neck was fully inserted . FWIW these were not annealed cases . Try adjusting the die a bit and see if that helps , Maybe even a little lube on the die inner parts so they don't hang up and start to clamp down to early . I'm no expert on the collet die ( obviously lol ) but if that's what the OP is using it should not be the annealing that caused the issue . Also I agree 9sec seems a bit long for what I do but would likely result in a fully annealed ( dead soft ) neck and shoulder . Not necessarily a bad thing if that's what you were going for .

I had to choke back a huge laugh when I saw these pics. I've made a few of those myself, wasn't funny when I did it, but it is now. All part of the learning process. My first "duh's" were with 223 brass, so I kept going for a couple more, and those looked just like the first "duh". Stopped and started researching these "collet dies" and there is more to them than what meets the eye. Made one "duh" with 204R brass, and stopped right then to clean the die again, lube it again, and started being very careful with those "collet" dies going forward. I clean and lube 'em BEFORE I insert one into the press now.

 

[338 dude]

Photo of the collapsed necks:

View attachment 1303466

The brass in your picture looks over annealed , But a collapsed die seems to be a common problem as well