3 or 5 shot groups?

[stinnett1981]

Stinnet, prove the 1s and 2s with 4 , 5 shot groups at 100yds. I like your load dev, it is very close to mine.

http://forum.accurateshooter.com/index.php?topic=3831950.msg36324955#msg36324955

Here is a thread with my load development pics. This load I shoot in FTR. It's more of a tactical rifle with only a 23" barrel but I hold my own in FTR. I shot 4th place at the STL benchrest club at their big July Midwest championship match. I think I shot a 580 with 16X. Pretty proud of that day! Lol.

 

[Lazer]

Very good shooting stinnet but it's closer to a 3 not a 1 or 2. I belive its a .280 whitch is awsome from matchkings and a 308 win!

 

[stinnett1981]

Very good shooting stinnet but it's closer to a 3 not a 1 or 2. I belive its a .280 whitch is awsome from matchkings and a 308 win!

That pic is the only one I took during load development. After I established it I have shot many groups in the 1's and 2's with it. Lazer, do you shoot in competitive matches (F class or tactical)?

 

[Uthink Uknow]

181backup
I sent you a PM.

 

[jimcasey01]

There is a collective wealth of wisdom on this forum. Those who choose to, can learn what was in the past, a lifetime of information, in a very short time frame. After seeing the responses on this thread and others, I am reminded of an old saying. "Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt." To those winning or nearly winning matches, please keep the good information flowing. I for one, am willing to learn from your experience.

 

[Toby Bradshaw]

Here are the first two 3-shot groups with fireformed brass from my new 30BR. I was just making some snug brass to send to the Harrells for a FL die, so I used 34.0gr H4198 and Berger 115FB bullets jammed. There is a 2-click scope adjustment between the two targets. Who thinks that I'm going to have to take another 494 shots to find a load that will shoot? :

(The shot on the target border is from boresighting.)

 

[savagedasher]

That was EASY you now have 495 to screw it up.

 

[Toby Bradshaw]

That was EASY you now have 495 to screw it up.

If it can be screwed up, I will find a way to do it.

 

[artbosco]

3 for load development, 8 to 10 5's for final confirmation.

 

[Rustystud]

I take a different approach in group shooting for long range. For those who only have 100yds to work up loads. I shoot 20 shot groups, yes 20 shot groups. Both chrono and measure groups. I want single digit ES and new barrel groups sub. .4" When a 20 shot group opens up to .6" or .7" it is time to re-barrel. BR guns need to be able to shoot a five shot group sub. .3 moa at 600-1000yds. to be competitive. A F-Class gun needs to shoot sub. .5 moa from 600-1000yds. Twenty shot groups give you a much better idea of both the gun and the loads. This method was shown to me by John Skowron (John7mm08) a high Master shooter who shoots at least 100 rounds per week.
Just my two cents worth.
Nat Lambeth

 

[Dave T]

What butchlambert said:

I use 3 for load development and 5 to confirm what I found on my BR rifles. For my hunting rifles, I use 3 throughout.

With a hunting rifle, I'm more worried about the first shot out of a cold barrel that's been sitting for a while.
Dave T

 

[butchlambert]

What butchlambert said:

I use 3 for load development and 5 to confirm what I found on my BR rifles. For my hunting rifles, I use 3 throughout.

With a hunting rifle, I'm more worried about the first shot out of a cold barrel that's been sitting for a while.
Dave T

Don't you shoot a fouling shot before you put your record shot in his neck?

 

[Patch700]

Who thinks that I'm going to have to take another 494 shots to find a load that will shoot? :

(The shot on the target border is from boresighting.)

.......lol.....crickets. .........

 

[Pulpit]

I only fire one round the day before deer season. If it hits the paper plate, I call it good.

Seriously, much gratitutde to the many who have replied with your experience, wisdom, and ability. I am always trying to learn and you pros have helped me.

Merry Christmas.

 

[Tim Singleton]

Here are the first two 3-shot groups with fireformed brass from my new 30BR. I was just making some snug brass to send to the Harrells for a FL die, so I used 34.0gr H4198 and Berger 115FB bullets jammed. There is a 2-click scope adjustment between the two targets. Who thinks that I'm going to have to take another 494 shots to find a load that will shoot? :

(The shot on the target border is from boresighting.)

. Nice
I believe that'll do

 

[butchlambert]

I only fire one round the day before deer season. If it hits the paper plate, I call it good.

Seriously, much gratitutde to the many who have replied with your experience, wisdom, and ability. I am always trying to learn and you pros have helped me.

Merry Christmas.

You are correct.
Merry Christmas!

 

[dmoran]

I take a different approach in group shooting for long range. For those who only have 100yds to work up loads. I shoot 20 shot groups, yes 20 shot groups. Both chrono and measure groups. I want single digit ES and new barrel groups sub. .4" When a 20 shot group opens up to .6" or .7" it is time to re-barrel. BR guns need to be able to shoot a five shot group sub. .3 moa at 600-1000yds. to be competitive. A F-Class gun needs to shoot sub. .5 moa from 600-1000yds. Twenty shot groups give you a much better idea of both the gun and the loads. This method was shown to me by John Skowron (John7mm08) a high Master shooter who shoots at least 100 rounds per week.
Just my two cents worth.
Nat Lambeth

Nat -

I respect your different approach, but would like to ask you a question to clarify what your stating:

Hypothetical:
Say you have a powder/bullet/primer combo that is showing potential at say 40.0 to 40.8 grains, for or a .8-tenth zone, from some caliber rifle.
Question:
Will you break the the .8-tenth zone down to smaller increments and shoot 20-round groups to find the "heart" of the node zone, or how would you proceed ?

Thanks
Donovan

 

[jim_k]

As a rule of thumb, most 5-shot groups will be about twice as big as most 3-shot groups. Most 10-shot groups will be about twice as big as most 5-shot groups. When I get a load worked up, I like to shoot 10-20 shots at 300 yards (my usual max hunting distance), just to see whassup. If it's <3 inches, that rifle goes to F-class. If it's less than 6 inches, that rifle is a hummer for hunting, and if it's more than that, it's for sale.

 

[M14AMU]

If you can hit a white 5 gal bucket from 50 yards....you're good to go!! :

 

[broncman]

I take a different approach in group shooting for long range. For those who only have 100yds to work up loads. I shoot 20 shot groups, yes 20 shot groups. Both chrono and measure groups. I want single digit ES and new barrel groups sub. .4" When a 20 shot group opens up to .6" or .7" it is time to re-barrel. BR guns need to be able to shoot a five shot group sub. .3 moa at 600-1000yds. to be competitive. A F-Class gun needs to shoot sub. .5 moa from 600-1000yds. Twenty shot groups give you a much better idea of both the gun and the loads. This method was shown to me by John Skowron (John7mm08) a high Master shooter who shoots at least 100 rounds per week.
Just my two cents worth.
Nat Lambeth

Nat -

I respect your different approach, but would like to ask you a question to clarify what your stating:

Hypothetical:
Say you have a powder/bullet/primer combo that is showing potential at say 40.0 to 40.8 grains, for or a .8-tenth zone, from some caliber rifle.
Question:
Will you break the the .8-tenth zone down to smaller increments and shoot 20-round groups to find the "heart" of the node zone, or how would you proceed ?

Thanks
Donovan

Very good point. With my FTR 185 load, I found a .6 wide spot that held half MOA for the five shot groups of .2 grains powder difference over the six tenths spread. I ended in the middle and shot a 20 shot group over flags at 100 and that is now my load. Little buffer on each side.