22 hornet way over pressure

[brokeasajoke]

Here is the charge variation chart that dellet was referring to.

View attachment 1293740


And here is a list of powders run to the 43511 psi SAAMI max of the .22 K-Hornet / maximum 104% charge density, with burn rates between 0.8 and 0.9 (QL default is 0.8550). At max SAAMI, the charge density that the OP is using is a tiny bit higher, and makes more velocity, than the W296/H110 that I use, but otherwise they're not that far apart.

View attachment 1293741

The OP's rifle and lot of LilGun have not been calibrated with QuickLoad, so these numbers should not be assumed to be accurate in his rifle. The two things that would provide some insight there would be chrono numbers, and/or running a different headstamp of brass.

Here are some chrono numbers and are concerning to me. I did switch to an srp with these. Those above 3250 were sticky.

Edit: I loaded a 10gr and tried it 2820fps

12.5gr.
3131
3187
3273

12.7gr
3173
3203
3286

12.9gr
3224
3168
3206
I'm thinking the 10gr neighborhood is where I need to be for pressure and velocity.

 

[brokeasajoke]

One on left was 10gr. Primer leaks were from previous spp. Didn't run through tumbler.

 

[lawman29]

What powder?

 

[brokeasajoke]

What powder?

Sorry, still runnin lil'gun,

 

[dellet]

You might give this calculator a try. It’s reasonably accurate. It calculates pressures needed to reach velocity. Not as accurate as dialing in quick load, but it’s another tool.

there is a spreadsheet to down load.

Calculating Barrel Pressure and Projectile Velocity in Gun Systems | Close Focus Research - Ballistic Testing Services

closefocusresearch.com

she’s looking a little bit hot still.

 

[brokeasajoke]

I should probably also not that 12.5 is the starting load for this bullet per email from sierra at a 1.80 oal.

 

[Jager]

Aye, you remain way too hot, Josh.

Sierra load data for your exact bullet tops out at 2950 fps (with H110, A#9, or A1680). The manual I have does not list LilGun at all for that bullet.

Berger, for their 40gr bullet, tops out at 2850 fps (using W296)

Assuming the bullet length, COAL, and case capacity remain the same as you noted up thread, QuickLoad shows this print for your 12.9/LilGun load, which averages right at 3200 fps...



My guess is you'll find better results with that new can of H-110 you picked up. But even that's not going to get you anywhere near 3200 fps with a 40gr. bullet.

If that's what you're trying to achieve you need to be looking at a .222 Rem, .223 Rem, or something like that.

 

[brokeasajoke]

Aye, you remain way too hot, Josh.

Sierra load data for your exact bullet tops out at 2950 fps (with H110, A#9, or A1680). The manual I have does not list LilGun at all for that bullet.

Berger, for their 40gr bullet, tops out at 2850 fps (using W296)

Assuming the bullet length, COAL, and case capacity remain the same as you noted up thread, QuickLoad shows this print for your 12.9/LilGun load, which averages right at 3200 fps...

View attachment 1294783

My guess is you'll find better results with that new can of H-110 you picked up. But even that's not going to get you anywhere near 3200 fps with a 40gr. bullet.

If that's what you're trying to achieve you need to be looking at a .222 Rem, .223 Rem, or something like that.

No no no no I am not after speed, thats what the 204R is for. I'm just looking for a good pinker on squirrels, black walnuts, crows or what ever I find inside of 125yds to max 150. Sort of a reloadable "22mag ish " is what got me in this.
Edit: I have 3 223rem. Wonder if sierra tech pulled that off of hodgdons web site when they emailed it to me. They also sent me all the 6th edition info which dosent list lilgun either.

 

[brokeasajoke]

If I get some good frangible hornet bullets trailboss has even crossed my mind. Factory s&b ammo is just over 2200 but some of that energy is used in fireforming.

 

[moorepower]

There is a big difference in case capacity in Hornet cases. Remington has the largest and S&B has the smallest. WW and RWS are in between, but I can't remember the order. If memory serves me it is 1- 1.5 grains less with S&B. Search the Saubier forum for the data. I use Remington Hornet brass, but have all 4.

 

[Homerange]

No no no no I am not after speed, thats what the 204R is for. I'm just looking for a good pinker on squirrels, black walnuts, crows or what ever I find inside of 125yds to max 150. Sort of a reloadable "22mag ish " is what got me in this.

22 Mag overview:

.22 Winchester Magnum Rimfire - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Even in the mid 2000's the Hornet will well outperform the 22 Mag.
Interested in how 10gr loads will come together for you.
Played with the Hornet many years back IIRC with ADI 2205 but never had much luck with getting it really accurate.

Data – Rifle

Whenever practicable, avoid loading to maximum possible velocity. Safety Data Sheets include all information relating to product composition, safety, handling and storage.

www.adiworldclass.com.au

 

[brokeasajoke]

22 Mag overview:

.22 Winchester Magnum Rimfire - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Even in the mid 2000's the Hornet will well outperform the 22 Mag.
Interested in how 10gr loads will come together for you.
Played with the Hornet many years back IIRC with ADI 2205 but never had much luck with getting it really accurate.

Data – Rifle

Whenever practicable, avoid loading to maximum possible velocity. Safety Data Sheets include all information relating to product composition, safety, handling and storage.

www.adiworldclass.com.au

I'm not even posting the target from these. Awful just Awful. Erratic velocity up this high anyway. If it will do 1" I'm happy.

 

[SmokinJoe]

You need to get away from the LG. You will get much more consistent results with H-110/Win296 or AA1680. You can't get enough 1680 in the case to get into pressure problems but it shoots pretty well. I use Alliant 300MP and get a little over 3200 with 40gr without pressure problems in my K-Hornets but your regular Hornet is a little different animal. If you have or can get some 1680 that will get you where you want to get to and I don't think you will have anymore weird problems.

 

[brokeasajoke]

You need to get away from the LG. You will get much more consistent results with H-110/Win296 or AA1680. You can't get enough 1680 in the case to get into pressure problems but it shoots pretty well. I use Alliant 300MP and get a little over 3200 with 40gr without pressure problems in my K-Hornets but your regular Hornet is a little different animal. If you have or can get some 1680 that will get you where you want to get to and I don't think you will have anymore weird problems.

Mine is a k hornet as well.

 

[SmokinJoe]

A case full to the base of the 40gr bullet with 1680 in the K-Hornet should give you 2900+ with low pressure and good accuracy. Have you got access to AA1680? In my experience this approach would be the so called "no-brainer" for your situation, just a load, shoot and enjoy sort of thing.
Went back and read your initial post. What do your S&B cases weigh unprimed? Also, it seems like 40 V-Max seats with more bullet in the neck than my other 40gr bullets but are only applicable to single loading. I have some of those Sierras and they are short, however I would still seat them down about half way into the neck and not worry as much about OAL or being near the rifling. I have some S&B factory ammo with a few once fired and will deprime and weigh a few and compare notes with yours.
Weighed some different brands of Hornet brass, lightest to heaviest FYI:
1) Hornady/Remington (sold as Rem by Midway but has Horn headstamp = 45 grs
2) Remington = 46 +/-
3) W-W = 49 - 50
4) Hornady = 50 - 51
5) PPU = 54 - 55
6) S&B = 55 - 56
7) RWS = 56 - 56.5
So you are definitely using some of the smallest capacity Hornet brass. Hope this helps

 

[brokeasajoke]

A case full to the base of the 40gr bullet with 1680 in the K-Hornet should give you 2900+ with low pressure and good accuracy. Have you got access to AA1680? In my experience this approach would be the so called "no-brainer" for your situation, just a load, shoot and enjoy sort of thing.
Went back and read your initial post. What do your S&B cases weigh unprimed? Also, it seems like 40 V-Max seats with more bullet in the neck than my other bullets but are only applicable to single loading. I have some of those Sierras and they are short, however I would still seat them down about half way into the neck and not worry as much about OAL or being near the rifling. I have some S&B factory ammo with a few once fired and will deprime and weigh a few and compare notes with yours. Talk later

54.0
53.8
53.7
53.5
54.2
Unprimed

 

[SmokinJoe]

Just edited my last post with brass weights. They do vary with different lots. Do you have any 1680?

 

[brokeasajoke]

Just edited my last post with brass weights. They do vary with different lots. Do you have any 1680?

No that's what I would like to find but in today's market, it is what it is. I got this rifle from a forum member who had load data with 45gr rem and 1680. He claimed .5" 100yd capability with this rifle.

 

[JLT]

No that's what I would like to find but in today's market, it is what it is. I got this rifle from a forum member who had load data with 45gr rem and 1680. He claimed .5" 100yd capability with this rifle.

AA1680 is in stock at Powder Valley. I echo the recommendations for this powder in the K-Hornet. I went through the very same trials and tribulations with L'il Gun and have switched to 1680 and MP-300. I'm happy with the velocities, the results on target and brass life.

Accurate 1680 Smokeless Gun Powder

www.powdervalleyinc.com

 

[brokeasajoke]

Tried some h110 today. Spp 11gr h110 at 1.80 col. 5 on right is single group of the h110. 3 left top was a previous lilgun group and 3 left on red was factory win 35gr that I was fire forming. No velocity on any today because it was to dark.