2 Mile cartridges

[ShaunBrady]

Do any of the serious competitors have a case capacity for the 416 Hellfire? Grains of H20 to the top of the neck if you have it.

Preferred powders?

 

[Sgt. Brumbaugh]

The Hellfire was very popular (more so than the Barret at one time). Lack of quality brass availability was the issue that made a lot of guys sour on it.

If / When Peterson makes brass for it, it will be popular again. Many guys (myself included) don't want to mess with 50 cal primers.

 

[hoz53]

You guys are all too damn serious about your BIG equipment Now...I have been doing a lot of searching on the interweb and gun mags about this ELR thing. From what I have read, I am COMPLEATLY SOLD on the 6.5 Creed. Shooting heavy for cal bullet ...like the 139 or 140 should do great out to two miles...maybe even three!! I am thinking that the 156 Berger would be overkill from what I have read. That fast twist 6.5 semi-custom bbl on the Savage is SUPER accurate waaaay past where you can see.

I know I will need to buy some reloading gear and learn to reload. My dad used to reload and has several pounds of Red Dot and some Fed 209 primers...I think I can make them fit, so I am most of the way there!!!

Now, I have only shot to 300 yards a couple times, but am a crackerjack shot at 100 yards with my 30-06. I also can hold the cross hair real steady on my ruger 10-22 when shooting gophers. I think with the right equipment and a little guidance, I can be real compeditive. Maybe even get a spotting scope with one of them tripods!!

Now, I will need some of those shirts with all the patches on them...like the pro bowlers wear. I see the PSR guys wear them, so they must help. Also a pair of tactical pants and boots.

Any advice for a future champion shooter?? What is the best scope for 3 miles? My scope budget is 500 - 600

(Satire )

2 miles is a chipShot for the ManBun!!! Ive got a scope that came on a walmart 700 i will send you for it. should get jobdone No Problem…….. You should get a job with Big red H company as an ad writer. Sounds like youd fit rite In! lol—-

 

[hoz53]

My first success at a mile was with a 260 in a savage!

We have lobbed 6.5 bullets at two miles but it was extremely difficult spotting and no consistency.
Just chasing your tail.


Once you get past 2500 ish yards things get quite interesting.
Wind and vertical dispersion can get diabolical.

1000 is my longest so far and i have plenty to learn about shooting that distance let alone ELR distances. someday i hope to try though. i will take in as much info as i can including threads like this and mabie someday I to will be able to ring the mile plate…

 

[Trigger Puller]

Do any of the serious competitors have a case capacity for the 416 Hellfire? Grains of H20 to the top of the neck if you have it.

Preferred powders?

ShaunBrady
As far as actual H20 I don’t know offhand
There were two lots of 416 hellfire brass, the brass with the small font was earlier and tended to stress out in the primer pocket area average weight of brass was 360 gr.

The later production brass had a large font in which floated 395 - 400 gr for weight and has worked well. For info with a 36” barrel and the 550 CE lazers
H50 - 162 grains - 2950 fps
RL50 - 162 grains. - 2950 fps
N568 - 157 grains - 2880 fps

40” barrel
N568. - 157 grains - 2960 fps

And if wanting a 32”
N570 - 157 grains - 3000 fps

Hope this helps
JH


Just a side note I have done well in ELR as others have, didn’t think it mattered to note accomplishments as far as value in info.

Tip
CE Lazers are common and good stuff but just watch what the A-Tips have been doing and think about the benefits as well. I use both

 

[ShaunBrady]

Thank you. That's a ton of good information. I'm trying to set up a QL model to figure out how much of the performance goes to case capacity, pressure, and double base powder. That's enough to rough out a model.

If I were to pick the 3 largest impacts to ELR shooting since 2015, I'd go with the LabRadar, Peterson brass for the 375CT, and elevation adders. I'd be a lot more likely to try the Hellfire if Peterson brass was available. The which batch of Australian brass works is serious deja vu to 375CT 10-15 years ago.

I've been using a lot of the ATips. They work extremely well and are easy. Brumbrough fired me up to revisit sorting and prepping the Hybrids so I've bought a fresh set of tools to try that again this year. The tools available now look like they'll make it a lot easier than the last time I tried it. It was effective for reducing BC spread, but tedious and made my hands sore. I transitioned from IDPA to ELR to get away from match silliness and the dry fire that kept my hands constantly sore. In a year, I was right back where I started. Lower round count but same ammo bill. Much nicer scenery for practice and matches though.

I think the Lazers are the tool to extract the last bit of velocity and BC uniformity. Using them that way requires extremely competent hand loading, a fresh barrel, ranges beyond 3K and bores 375 and up. Missing any of that, they're not worth the reduction in spotting. It's not surprising to me the ATips have done so well in light gun.

 

[northwoods]

I'm new to the accurate shooters forum. This whole thread has been absolutely fascinating to me. I want to get into long range accuracy. Have been reloading for over 40 yrs and have learned more in the last couple of months than I did in that time. Same with all the effects on the projectile at long distances. I can't believe how deep this rabbit hole is!

 

[SKWERLZ]

I have not noticed any of the RUM cases for sale lately, do you have a steady source?
Also, in general the phrase "short and fat..." tends to apply to accuracy cartridges.
IMHO, due to its' adoption by the military the 300 NM should be offered by more companies. The NMI is already in wide usage in ELR.

Adg makes good 300 RUM and 338 edge cases

 

[SKWERLZ]

I'm new to the accurate shooters forum. This whole thread has been absolutely fascinating to me. I want to get into long range accuracy. Have been reloading for over 40 yrs and have learned more in the last couple of months than I did in that time. Same with all the effects on the projectile at long distances. I can't believe how deep this rabbit hole is!

It’s a nice rabbit hole.

 

[Sgt. Brumbaugh]

If I were to ever get back into the heavy gun side of ELR, I would prefer the HF (with good brass) over the Barret. I hate the 50 cal primer requirement of the Barret. If I remember right the HF is significantly smaller in case capacity and pretty much matches the Barret in performance.

That said, if I were to get back into the heavy rifles I would probably go with a .458 caliber to shoot the 700 gr. CE Lazer with its .550+ G7.

 

[Mike TackleBerry]

If I were to ever get back into the heavy gun side of ELR, I would prefer the HF (with good brass) over the Barret. I hate the 50 cal primer requirement of the Barret. If I remember right the HF is significantly smaller in case capacity and pretty much matches the Barret in performance.

That said, if I were to get back into the heavy rifles I would probably go with a .458 caliber to shoot the 700 gr. CE Lazer with its .550+ G7.

458 Vestal? I think if I did a 416 or 458 I'd upgrade my 10X to a 20X action.

 

[Sgt. Brumbaugh]

I would have to do a bit of a dive into the current 458 caliber options before deciding on which one to use. I would not necessarily pick the hot rod of the group.

 

[Desert Fox]

I wanted to step up to 416 caliber 3 years ago and wanted to build a rifle chambered for 416 Hellfire. After two years of wait for brass availability, I decided on 416 VELR instead. The round was created by Robert Vestal by simply necking up the 408 Cheytac case to 416 without any other modification. I developed two loads for it using 500 grain CE Lazer and 500 grain Hornady A-Tip. My goal was to pushed the 500 grain at around 2900 fps +. I settled on two loads using Shooters World 50 BMG powder for 500 CE and Retumbo for 500 A-Tip. I still have to shoot these loads at a mile and later at 2 miles to see which bullet performed better on my rifle.

 

[Mike TackleBerry]

I wanted to step up to 416 caliber 3 years ago and wanted to build a rifle chambered for 416 Hellfire. After two years of wait for brass availability, I decided on 416 VELR instead. The round was created by Robert Vestal by simply necking up the 408 Cheytac case to 416 without any other modification. I developed two loads for it using 500 grain CE Lazer and 500 grain Hornady A-Tip. My goal was to pushed the 500 grain at around 2900 fps +. I settled on two loads using Shooters World 50 BMG powder for 500 CE and Retumbo for 500 A-Tip. I still have to shoot these loads at a mile and later at 2 miles to see which bullet performed better on my rifle.

If Peterson comes through and develops 416 Hellfire brass i'm definitely going to consider building one. They're working on 416 Barrett brass right now with Paul and he's working with Derek Peterson to get 416 Hellfire brass made.