22rf "trainers' ...what do they really train?

[garandman]

Focus

I think thats a legit point. Focus is hard and requires practice and is the same for rf and cf.

But I can do that better at home with my center fire gun without the worries of recoil And I can actually watch to see if my reticle moves as I squeezed the trigger... and I can do that without Any cost at all

 

[1shot]

Lloyd,

One shot for each numbered bull.. touch the dot and it is a X.. best edge scoring..

Ten Shot is only the dot! If you do not get the dot.... it is a miss and no points.. If the bullet goes through the center of the bull and the plug sees no light anywhere around it.. it is a 10, take the dot out.. it is a 6 and if you touch the dot.. it is a 4

That would be an awesome training drill. Play some music thru your headphones that you hate as a distraction.
Thanks,
Lloyd

 

[garandman]

. If 22 trainers (or smallbore rifles as they were known before PRS graced us with its presence) were useless then there wouldn’t have been so damn many of them built over the years. Think about it.....

Think about the literally zillions of products that have been sold over the years that don't do what they're advertised to do.

Quantity hardly proves quality and effectiveness.

 

[1shot]

Dry fire is way better than nothing at all, but at least for me I tend to get lazy with the follow through because subconsciously, I know that there isn’t any recoil or any of the other tactile feelings that are associated with it.
I hope this helps,

Lloyd

 

[DR1586]

Think about the zillions of products that have been soul over the years that don't do what they're advertised to do.

Quantity hardly proves quality and effectiveness.

Ah yes, but these do. There are far too many good shooters that have cross trained in smallbore and had major success in other centerfire sports to say that they do not provide benefit. It provides more to certain disciplines, but it does provide benefit. You ask that we prove it does, but how do you prove it doesn’t. Show me an example of someone who legitimately trained with a rimfire and didn’t progress in their other shooting (assuming the disciplines are similar in position and course of fire).

 

[garandman]

Keep in mind… after you spend $4000 on a rim fire trainer .... is it really cheaper than shooting a center fire?

I can hand load a crap load of my center fire rifle ammo for that kind of money.

 

[garandman]

Dry fire is way better than nothing at all, but at least for me I tend to get lazy with the follow through because subconsciously, I know that there isn’t any recoil or any of the other tactile feelings that are associated with it.
I hope this helps,

Lloyd

Actually that very laziness is the very thing we're trying to train out of us. And train in focus and mental discipline.

So I would submit dry fire the most effective form of training.

As noted above, Marine Corps shooting team does 4 hours of dry fire practice a day.

They seem to find it effective.

 

[garandman]

Ah yes, but these do. There are far too many good shooters that have cross trained in smallbore and had major success in other centerfire sports to say that they do not provide benefit. It provides more to certain disciplines, but it does provide benefit. You ask that we prove it does, but how do you prove it doesn’t. Show me an example of someone who legitimately trained with a rimfire and didn’t progress in their other shooting (assuming the disciplines are similar in position and course of fire).

Correlation does not prove causality.

 

[DR1586]

Correlation does not prove causality.[/QUOTE

The practice time proves it to me. Think what you want, do what you want, I couldn’t care less. You ought to sell that 22 of yours immediately given it’s useless and put that money into your centerfire gun or ammo for it.

 

[garandman]

My $4000 plus dollar Vudoo rig is a frequent match winning gun that I really enjoy shooting. I'll be Supplementing it with a Vudoo bench rest F class gun and converting it to a long range rim fire steel plate gun.

No, I'm not gonna sell it just because I don't believe it has any major benefit for training for my center fire guns.

 

[asyoung]

All rifle shooting competition falls into one of two categories: those that hold their rifle and those that don't.
Shooting that involves standing, sitting, kneeling, or prone vs shooting that involves some sort of mechanical rest and a sandbag. The gulf between those two categories is so complete it should almost be required to divulge your particular poison in virtually any discussion on virtually any topic relating to rifle shooting. It's comparing apples and folding chairs.

On page one of this thread, the original poster indicated he's not a sling shooter. At that revelation there's no point in anyone in the "holds his rifle" category trying to explain why smallbore rifles are valuable training for centerfire shooting.

The OP's just not gonna get it.

Scott Young

 

[garandman]

On page one of this thread, the original poster indicated he's not a sling shooter. At that revelation there's no point in anyone in the "holds his rifle" category trying to explain why smallbore rifles are valuable training for centerfire shooting.

The OP's just not gonna get it.

Scott Young

Somehow you managed to miss the part where I already noted the value of a 22 trainer for sling shooters. All 3 times I said it.

 

[B23]

Since some mentioned Long range 22lr shooting I thought you may enjoy this video, although, since we're talking about a 22lr I'd call this ELR, not just LR. 17 ft.lbs of energy on impact kinda makes me chuckle but I still think it's pretty cool vid.

 

[asyoung]

Somehow you managed to miss the part where I already noted the value of a 22 trainer for sling shooters. All 3 times I said it.

And you missed that I wasn’t talking to you.

Scott

 

[garandman]

And you missed that I wasn’t talking to you.

Scott

No. I didnt. You were talking *about* me. In derogatory ways. Totally unnecessary. I'll ask you to stop. Thank you.

 

[garandman]

Since some mentioned Long range 22lr shooting I thought you may enjoy this video, although, since we're talking about a 22lr I'd call this ELR, not just LR. 17 ft.lbs of energy on impact kinda makes me chuckle but I still think it's pretty cool vid.

Thanx. I'll check it. Just getting into that game.

Was shooting steel at 200 yd Saturday. You could barely hear the "ting." Lol

 

[asyoung]

No. I didnt. You were talking *about* me. In derogatory ways. Totally unnecessary. I'll ask you to stop. Thank you.

I merely expressed my opinion on what I consider to be distinctions between various forms of rifle competition. That a member of one camp “doesn’t get” some aspects of the other camp seems quite normal and non-derogatory to me. I have certainly heard some neck tension discussions that I didn’t get.

Scott Young

 

[garandman]

I merely expressed my opinion on what I consider to be distinctions between various forms of rifle competition. That a member of one camp “doesn’t get” some aspects of the other camp seems quite normal and non-derogatory to me. I have certainly heard some neck tension discussions that I didn’t get.

Scott Young

I think you're right about the wide distinction between bench and sling shooters.

I do totally "get" that.

My very 1st rifle competition series was a 4 position M1 and then DCM rifle after that.

It's just that I don't shoot that now so 22rf sling rifle has no training value for me now.

So your statements about me "not getting it" were totally unwarranted. Factually incorrect and unwarranted.

 

[DR1586]

Somehow you managed to miss the part where I already noted the value of a 22 trainer for sling shooters. All 3 times I said it.

So 22’s for training do add value for certain disciplines? Am I right in the assumption that what your whole point is that 22RF’s for training add little or no realistic value for PRS, F-Class or other such disciplines which you are currently shooting?

 

[garandman]

So 22’s for training do add value for certain disciplines? Am I right in the assumption that what your whole point is that 22RF’s for training add little or no realistic value for PRS, F-Class or other such disciplines which you are currently shooting?

You can assume that I'm asking anyone to give me any indication of anything that a 22 rim fire is useful for training for center fire.

That's what I've been saying from the beginning. How did you miss that?

Please start reading my posts for content and understanding rather than to argue with me.

Thank you.