Wind Quiz

[Corey Schwanz]

This came up in Bryan Litz's Applied Ballistics seminar he hosted in Michigan last month. The bullet that has wind effecting it immediately will be pushed out further than the bullet that has some protection for its early flight. It gets pushed off target sooner. Wind at both locations is still key though.

 

[BLCKWLF]

Now, think about the 500yd wall starting at 250yds...

 

[Joe Salt]

Corey at the ballistics seminar did you do any shooting, were you could watch the bullet vapor trail though a spotting scope? At a 1000 yards you really get to see what the bullet is doing. And yes Brian is right about wind the closest having the most effect.

Joe Salt

Joe Salt

 

[Corey Schwanz]

Corey at the ballistics seminar did you do any shooting, were you could watch the bullet vapor trail though a spotting scope? At a 1000 yards you really get to see what the bullet is doing. And yes Brian is right about wind the closest having the most effect.

Joe Salt

Joe Salt

No, it was all classroom type discussion. The facility didn't have any place to shoot and the weather was awful anyway, haha. That would be a great suggestion for Bryan on future seminars though, if he could find a range to use that had the classroom capabilities with it.

 

[Joe Salt]

At our range at PA. 1000 yard club, on a good day you can stand behind a shooter and tell him how he did. Which reminds me of last year, I was standing behind a friend of mine to see how he was doing. He was still shooting his sighters so as I watched were the trace of the bullet was going, I watched when they put up the record target, when he was done with his ten shots. He turned around and I said to him you just destroyed the center! When he got it back it was a 4"- 100
And when there is over a ten MPH wind now you can really see the effect the wind has on the bullet. Sometimes I wonder how they even hit the target.

Joe Salt

 

[xswanted]

I have a unique perspective on this.

My 800 yard range at home is covered to the right by a large drove of trees and our farmyard for roughly the first 1/3 of the range. The second half is wide open to the right. So sort of like said wall.

Last Monday we were shooting and noticing not much wind drift at 800 yards with a 5-7mph right to left wind.

Two weeks ago there was the same wind form left to right, very close to same angle. And more drift was happening.

I think b wins.

 

[waldo1979]

Shooter A has less drift. Next quiz.

 

[bruce moulds]

same bullet, same twist, same velocity, = same drift.
deflection will however be different.
keep safe,
bruce.

 

[Lightload]

Seems to me that the wind never "points" the bullet left or right. The bullet is moving along with the wind and when the wind stops, the bullet stops moving.
Assuming the bullet is pointed ninety degrees to the berm, it will remain ninety degrees to the berm all the way to the target.

 

[6MMsteve]

Shooter B deflection at the muzzle starts bullet offline but it could be A if he is shooting a LH twist against the wind lol.

 

[fredo]

I just happened to get the Advanced Ballistic App today and was playing with the multiple wind zone capability. I plugged in both of these scenarios with a 308 175 smk, exported the data into Excel and plotted it. B is almost double A.

And there ya have it, folks...

As taliv described, with the wind constantly acting upon a bullet, the resultant horizontal trajectory will be an exponential curve. The longer the wind imparts force upon the bullet, the steeper that curve becomes...

If/when the wind subsides, it's effect on the bullet ceases at that point. The resultant horizontal trajectory will be a straight line from present course. Whatever deflection the wind imparted, will remain a constant angular deviation with reference to the target...

 

[Canadian bushman]

This came up in Bryan Litz's Applied Ballistics seminar he hosted in Michigan last month. The bullet that has wind effecting it immediately will be pushed out further than the bullet that has some protection for its early flight. It gets pushed off target sooner. Wind at both locations is still key though.

Yup, put a fan on the floor and roll a marble in front of it.

Seirra infinity software has had the ability to solve this question for quite a while.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Yup, put a fan on the floor and roll a marble in front of it.

JMHO, but I think a better analogy would be if you dropped the marble from above,(imagine doing this from a tall building, etc) and the marble passing in front of the fan wherever you want to put it. Now, with THAT analogy, does it curve or is it laterally displaced and on a new course, then continue straight down after passing the fan??

 

[taliv]

don't forget to take into account the rotation of the Earth in your dropped marble test


heh heh

 

[Canadian bushman]

JMHO, but I think a better analogy would be if you dropped the marble from above,(imagine doing this from a tall building, etc) and the marble passing in front of the fan wherever you want to put it. Now, with THAT analogy, does it curve or is it laterally displaced and on a new course, then continue straight down after passing the fan??

I believe the result will be the same.

Newtons first law of motion

The difference is:

The marble on the floor represents two diminishing forces. The wind and propellant.

The marble falling has one diminishing and one eternal (Gravity). I.E. the marble will be accelerating.

The winds force and its results will act in the same manner, but will result in different values for and object that is speeding up vs one that is slowing down.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

I believe the result will be the same.

Newtons first law of motion

The difference is:

The marble on the floor represents two diminishing forces. The wind and propellant.

The marble falling has one diminishing and one eternal (Gravity). I.E. the marble will be accelerating.

The winds force and its results will act in the same manner, but will result in different values for and object that is speeding up vs one that is slowing down.

Ok...fire it at 3000FPS straight down....or up. It makes little difference. That's the point. The forward moment is so much greater than the lateral, that it gets lost almost in entirety if not completely. A 10 mph wind is moving at about 14.6fps...vs 3000 forward. Whether it's up, down or sideways has little effect. Don't get me wrong...there may be a mathematically correct answer to this but if you can't out shoot it, what difference does it make? Hence my first reply to this post being "it's a wash".

 

[Canadian bushman]

Ok...fire it at 3000FPS straight down....or up. It makes little difference. That's the point. The forward moment is so much greater than the lateral, that it gets lost almost in entirety if not completely. A 10 mph wind is moving at about 14.6fps...vs 3000 forward. Whether it's up, down or sideways has little effect. Don't get me wrong...there may be a mathematically correct answer to this but if you can't out shoot it, what difference does it make? Hence my first reply to this post being "it's a wash".

Im not sure im understanding the point you are making here?

Is this contending something i stated?

Are you saying the difference between a near wind and far wind scenario is negligible to a projectile traveling 3000fps?

Not trying to be rude, im really unsure.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Im not sure im understanding the point you are making here?

Is this contending something i stated?

Are you saying the difference between a near wind and far wind scenario is negligible to a projectile traveling 3000fps?

Not trying to be rude, im really unsure.

Yes, thats what I'm saying. I think given the example used in this thread, negligible is a good way to describe it.

 

[Canadian bushman]

Yes, thats what I'm saying. I think given the example used in this thread, negligible is a good way to describe it.

I would agree the difference in this scenario is small. Not small enough to disregard, especially if you just lost a match by a point.

However understanding the value the wind has at all angles and distances is important to not mis calculating wind in various other conditions. Especially some where the difference may not be as small.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

I would agree the difference in this scenario is small. Not small enough to disregard, especially if you just lost a match by a point.

However understanding the value the wind has at all angles and distances is important to not mis calculating wind in various other conditions. Especially some where the difference may not be as small.

I'm ok with agreeing to disagree. I don't think there is a shooter alive that can shoot the difference at long range and probably not at 100 either. ..but that's just me. I simply think the value of this scenario is overrated and often overstated.