Why doesn't Hornady make match grade bullets capable of competing with Berger bullets?

[DiRTY DOG]

With the size and breadth of Hornady's research and production, why don't they produce match grade bullets that are capable of competing with Berger bullets? Like benchrest, F Class, world record class bullets.

Seems Hornady's engineers and ballisticians etc enjoy talking the talk, but they can't walk the walk.

Let's not even mention brass quality.

 

[C.E.Smith043]

Call them and ask them.

 

[Mcrider55]

For every person espousing berger, there are just as many doing the same for Sierra, Hornady, and others.

These are Ford vs Chevy discussions.

 

[Bill Norris]

With the size and breadth of Hornady's research and production, why don't they produce match grade bullets that are capable of competing with Berger bullets? Like benchrest, F Class, world record class bullets.

Seems Hornady's engineers and ballisticians etc enjoy talking the talk, but they can't walk the walk.

Let's not even mention brass quality.

Not to be a smart a$$ but they may not have the brains & technology to compete with Berger. Talking the talk is one thing but walking the walk is a different story entirely.

 

[Charlie-NY]

It may all be about marketing. Right now, Hornady seems to have many accurate bullets that sell for less than Bergers and they are able to mass produce them at a rate that they keep on coming. Berger is "out-of-stock" all the time. So, trying to produce a bullet equal to or better than a Berger might just not make marketing sense for Hornady.

 

[jelenko]

As mentioned, Hornady may simply not want to compete in the market for benchrest bullet.
I'm guessing that the market for benchrest bullets is small compared to non benchrest market.

 

[karrarararararar]

Who is Hornady's market? I doubt it's benchrest and F Class. Also consider price. Aside from A-Tips, Hornady's are ⅔ the price of Bergers.

 

[bozo699]

They never have, they never will! They make decent hunting bullet. Good varmint bullets and plinking bullets. Some people want a economical car to go from point a- b so they buy a geo metro other people want to get there in a hurry so they buy a corvette and others want to get there in comfort and style so they buy a Cadillac.
Wayne

 

[Ranger188]

It would be interesting to see what percentage of bullets are sold
in loaded ammo compared to by themselves in a box. (their total global sales)
That might answer your question.

 

[bozo699]

It would be interesting to see what percentage of bullets are sold
in loaded ammo compared to by themselves in a box.
That might answer your question.

Who shooting benchrest or for that matter on this forum shoots factory loaded ammo?
Wayne

 

[K22]

For a long time, Sierra was king of the precision competitive target shooting world. Now, from what I read, it's Berger.

The one aspect of Hornady that I've observed is that they have an abundant supply of bullets. Some of them that I've used are excellent for the most reloaders, non-competitive target shooters and hunters, such as the 55 Vmax, 60 Vmax, 75 Vmax, 125 SST.

However, the best bullet on the market is no good if you can get it. It's the reason I moved away from Sierra which I used for over 40 years with outstanding results. But I couldn't get them so that cut it. I almost walked away from Nosler too but recently they increased their supply to reloaders. However, I'll walk away from them too if Nosler goes the route of Sierra.

PS: Hornady brass is not a bad as some report. I imagine like with anything else, you can also get a bad lot. But I used their 223 Rem brass, and it performed well for me. In fact, I consider it better than the recent runs of Remington and on par with Winchester, but Winchester has had a lot of defective cases in lots I purchased over the last 10 years or so.

 

[bozo699]

For a long time, Sierra was king of the precision competitive target shooting world. Now, from what I read, it's Berger.

The one aspect of Hornady that I've observed is that they have an abundant supply of bullets. Some of them that I've used are excellent for the most reloaders, non-competitive target shooters and hunters, such as the 55 Vmax, 60 Vmax, 75 Vmax, 125 SST.

However, the best bullet on the market is no good if you can get it. It's the reason I moved away from Sierra which I used for over 40 years with outstanding results. But I couldn't get them so that cut it. I almost walked away from Nosler too but recently they increased their supply to reloaders. However, I'll walk away from them too if Nosler goes the route of Sierra.

PS: Hornady brass is not a bad as some report. I imagine like with anything else, you can also get a bad lot. But I used their 223 Rem brass, and it performed well for me. In fact, I consider it better than the recent runs of Remington and on par with Winchester, but Winchester has had a lot of defective cases in lots I purchased over the last 10 years or so.

I pretty much agree with you all the way to the brass part,….. it’s a little tiny bit better than Remington but not by much.
Wayne

 

[Tommie]

If there was enough profit in true match bullets, Hornady would already be doing it.
Period.

 

[Bottom Fodder]

Does Hornady sponsor any competitive shooters, do they have “team Hornady”
that competes. I brought up Hornady bullet in another topic mainly because you can find them for sale. And now they seam to be a hot topic on this site but very few positives other for hunting

 

[gat]

Hornady 6mm 105gr HPBT Match shoots spot on with Bergers of the same weight out to 650ish then Bergers really shine. I shoot Hornady for 600yd matches the change to Bergers for longer work. Lotta deer, bear, even moose seemed pretty impressed with Hornady soft points. Pdogs too!

 

[memilanuk]

However, the best bullet on the market is no good if you can get it. It's the reason I moved away from Sierra which I used for over 40 years with outstanding results.

That was a lot of my frustration with Sierra, back in the day. Their S142MK shot *great*, in it's time. But they only made X amount per year. Match shooters using them in the 6.5-284 for LR, or the 6.5-08 for XTC (yes, I had one of those) bought them en masse... and if you didn't get enough to last you the entire season, you were pretty much SOL. You *might* be able to find some little rinky-dink local shop that had some rat-holed away - or you might have to suck it up and shoot the 140MK - still a good bullet, but a notch or two down from the 142 as far as BC.

Or you could start shooting Berger 140VLDs, and pretty much get them whenever you needed them.

 

[bozo699]

If there was enough profit in true match bullets, Hornady would already be doing it.
Period.

There’s plenty of market for it, Berger and other custom bullets can’t come close to keeping up!…. Hornaday doesn’t have the equipment nor knowledge to make them besides they have a large part of the market for other disciplines and needs and they do well in that market.
Wayne

 

[hoz53]

With the size and breadth of Hornady's research and production, why don't they produce match grade bullets that are capable of competing with Berger bullets? Like benchrest, F Class, world record class bullets.

Seems Hornady's engineers and ballisticians etc enjoy talking the talk, but they can't walk the walk.

Let's not even mention brass quality.

hornady has proved they have an advanced degree in marketing with the 6.5 manbun and then the prc series. They are to busy making factory loads for these to be bothered with putting alot of exra effort into new bullet design and $ into new equipment to make match bullets whan they are allready stretched thin and making tons of $ doing what they are doing now.

 

[Bill Norris]

hornady has proved they have an advanced degree in marketing with the 6.5 manbun and then the prc series. They are to busy making factory loads for these to be bothered with putting alot of exra effort into new bullet design and $ into new equipment to make match bullets. hornadys bullets have always been considered second class compared to Sierra.
I have shot hornadys and at times got good accuracy but it never seems be consistent.
hornady just bought RCBS to. Im sure they are very busy and making a bunch of $ with what they do allready and have no desire to branch out into match bullets more than they have.

I think Hodgdon was the buyer of RCBS.

 

[DocBII]

Good day,

My experience with Hornady over the past three decades is that they are learning. They are learning what is expected from a quality perspective, a consistency perspective and a marketing perspective. They used to be a hunting class manufacturer and have moved up to serious consideration for some accuracy applications. Not just my opinion, others have related to me they look for Hornady bullets to obtain accuracy at distance.

Gone are the times when bullet lots varied by 0.050" in OGL or OL, tipped or non-tipped. Bullet lots tend to be more consistent when the bullet is newly released, this holds when for old types and newer types. They still have problems using an old SKU for a new design, which generates confusion and unhappiness.

Old case problems range from improper annealing to completely screwed up flash holes. The last case of 1200 had more than enough to cover any issues with quantity. If you want consistent cases, be prepared to do the work to get them. I haven't finished working and using these cases, but each lot of 50 for matches and hunting loaded out to be within 1 grain of weight @ 435gr. and +/- 0.002 in OGL.

HTH,
DocBII