When to anneal

[RabbitSlayer]

Holy smokes this one went crazy. Can't remember if I replied yet or not.

Am I the only person who wet tumbles with no pins? I have never even owned the pins. Works great and leaves carbon in the neck.

At least a few top shooters on youtube have said they dont clean brass, including eric and I think it was Lou Murdica.

I started off using the order outlined by one of the people fclass john interviewed in reloading room confessions. He had mountains of metals, so I figured it was a good place to start. I have since made a few adjustments, and I am happy with the results on target and the chrono.

Deprime (cuz I want to inspect the case for damage during this step), AMP anneal, FLS with no expander, wet tumble with no pins lemishine and dawn 15 to 30 min to remove lube. Roll on a towel and let air dry. Dry graphite lube necks & mandrel, trim, chamfer, seat bullets.

I used to FLS, mandrel, then wet tumble. My ES improved when I switched to mandrel after tumble. Not sure if it was due to the necks not getting dinged during tumbling or graphite lube remaining in neck while seating or both.


I keep this with the brass and then with the loaded ammo.

 

[Webster]

Holy smokes this one went crazy. Can't remember if I replied yet or not.

Am I the only person who wet tumbles with no pins? I have never even owned the pins. Works great and leaves carbon in the neck.

At least a few top shooters on youtube have said they dont clean brass, including eric and I think it was Lou Murdica.

I started off using the order outlined by one of the people fclass john interviewed in reloading room confessions. He had mountains of metals, so I figured it was a good place to start. I have since made a few adjustments, and I am happy with the results on target and the chrono.

Deprime (cuz I want to inspect the case for damage during this step), AMP anneal, FLS with no expander, wet tumble with no pins lemishine and dawn 15 to 30 min to remove lube. Roll on a towel and let air dry. Dry graphite lube necks & mandrel, trim, chamfer, seat bullets.

I used to FLS, mandrel, then wet tumble. My ES improved when I switched to mandrel after tumble. Not sure if it was due to the necks not getting dinged during tumbling or graphite lube remaining in neck while seating or both.


I keep this with the brass and then with the loaded ammo.
View attachment 1572297

161 replies. Are we all disfunctional.

 

[Riesel]

Here's why I decap 1st.
Say you were out doing some testing and you had 1 or more rounds that needed to be pulled down for whatever reason, by decapping 1st its safe insurance that no live primer will be subject to go off unexpectedly.
I've also received brass second hand that had live primers on more than 1 occasion.

YUP, that'll wake you up ! ! !

 

[Longtrain]

Check a recent Hornady Podcast, they conclude after a few firings. I do my brass after each firing, am I wasting my time? I don’t think so and a lot of my Lapua Dasher brass has been around going on barrel number 3. Probably 20+ firings on them. I only bump them .001, they certainly aren’t stressed.

 

[Dave M.]

Holy smokes this one went crazy. Can't remember if I replied yet or not.

Am I the only person who wet tumbles with no pins? I have never even owned the pins. Works great and leaves carbon in the neck.

At least a few top shooters on youtube have said they dont clean brass, including eric and I think it was Lou Murdica.

I started off using the order outlined by one of the people fclass john interviewed in reloading room confessions. He had mountains of metals, so I figured it was a good place to start. I have since made a few adjustments, and I am happy with the results on target and the chrono.

Deprime (cuz I want to inspect the case for damage during this step), AMP anneal, FLS with no expander, wet tumble with no pins lemishine and dawn 15 to 30 min to remove lube. Roll on a towel and let air dry. Dry graphite lube necks & mandrel, trim, chamfer, seat bullets.

I used to FLS, mandrel, then wet tumble. My ES improved when I switched to mandrel after tumble. Not sure if it was due to the necks not getting dinged during tumbling or graphite lube remaining in neck while seating or both.


I keep this with the brass and then with the loaded ammo.
View attachment 1572297

This work in process card for brass is a great idea.

 

[searcher]

I anneal after firing, then tumble in walnut media, then size.
Sizing work hardens the brass - so to get the shoulders set properly, best to anneal before sizing.
The polish removes carbon from firing and annealing, as well as sizing lube at the same time.
Annealing with the carbon from firing still on the brass usually leaves darker marks on the necks than if tumbled before annealing - yet seems to just be a cosmetic issue. I've noticed no need to change the AMP setting - so I see no reason to tumble first.

 

[Wild Bill IV]

Wet tumble gives you a really clean/sticky surface, so I have to treat the insides of the necks with Neolube. If I didn't clean, or did a vibe tumble, I could skip some steps, I think.

Aaron:
Instead of allowing it to dry, drop the wet cases in isopropyl alcohol (dehydrator)! Allow the alcohol to vaporize and get that dry feeling instead of sticky!!! Try it on a few cases!!!!

Bill!!!

 

[Wild Bill IV]

View attachment 1570008

Are you an engineer???
BILL

 

[Dave M.]

Are you an engineer???
BILL

I am and that shit is pretty funny. Reminds me of a lot of people I work with that truly love to argue.
Dave

 

[Wild Bill IV]

Not all of it.
On youtube you say what you want and delete posts. No one can challenge you. Some guys have left forums for that reason. Same with facebook you can ban people and delete posts. Some dont like to be challenged. Thats cool. Some of them put out good stuff. But at the end of the day its for the $$$. Thats a fact. Forums are the last place that people can call bs. And we are not paid to post here. Just something to consider.

Well stated!!!
I remember the days of neck size only fad!!! That is when the wipe on and off wax and paste lubes were developed!!! $$$$!!! I used them for a while and switched backed to the high pressure oils after studying lubricity in engineering studies! Viscosity is one of 3 important properties for proper lubrication!!! Viscosity allows thin film lubrication and greatly reduces adhesion which can stretch cases on form die withdrawal!! And I also noticed the pastes and waxes took more pressure on the the press handle!!! And yes, I did neck size only on 25-06 until bolt drop became harder and harder!!! I was a fish and bit!!!! Now, I take every word of advice with a grain of salt and a knowledge of physics and chemistry!!!

My biggest complaint about this forum is the term "Tension"!!! Well over half the forum members misuse, abuse, and have no knowledge of the force called tension!! They are also confused on tension vs class fit!!! And tension is zero without the bullet's force of compression opposing that force!!! Newton's 2nd law of equal and opposite forces!!!

Back on the subject of annealing!! When the internet started using the old telephone line modem, I did research on annealing!! Came across an article written in the UK about military cases rupturing in the body!! The cause of rupture was too much twin growth due to 350°C (662°F) quenching temp!! The temp was changed to 300°C (572°F) and the twin growth was reduced!!! So, annealing with out coolant below the annealing mark could cause problems!!!

I also came across a graduate thesis sponsored by Norma!! The intern studied the grain sizes and harness of the 10 (308 Win) and 11 (300 Win Mag) annealing stages and pulled 10 samples of each stage for 4 days of production!!! His conclusion was the hardness increases as the distance increases from the mouth!! He complied data on the necks at 3 places from the mouth to the shoulder and the hardness increased going toward the shoulder!!! And, he also found that one day annealed necks were softer than two days and more cases!!! Yes, true tension can only be measured after a two day resting/relaxing time!!! ALSO KNOW AS GRAIN GROWTH TIME!!!

NOW, lets use a little thermodynamic and speed this cure time up a notch!! After annealing, place the cases in a freezer for a couple of hours!!! Then let them set over night at the bench and allow them to come back to ambient temp before priming, charging, and seating!!! Now, the true tension can be measured with the seating pressure!!!!

 

[Wild Bill IV]

I am and that shit is pretty funny. Reminds me of a lot of people I work with that truly love to argue.
Dave

I have an Industrial Physics degree and worked as an engineer!!! Yes, applied physics!! F-bomb theoretical physics!!! Had several arguments with Corporate engineers for Appropriation Requests (AR) for the plant I was working at!!!!

 

[ebb]

Forums ya gota love em! Its the place where a poster can say he has a 30BR and the chamber was cut with a Robinette reamer, he describes the reamer and gives the part number from the manufacturer. Randy himself says that that is not a Robinette reamer and the poster tells him he is full of shit. I look at Rabbit slayers super nice check list, I don't even know what #6 T and C is. But most of the time my reloads go off on time and hit the target.

 

[ebb]

Clean brass keeps crap from getting in my reloading dies and wearing them and damaging my brass.

 

[Bottom Fodder]

I let my cases “rest“ a few days after annealing, I had read to do that years ago