What causes groups like this ?

[Homerange]

No sir I hate muffs they get in the road. I do however wear ear plugs, I pack them in my pocket everywhere I go. Unlike most people shooting doesn’t physically hurt my ears unless I’m shooting something like a .357 or 30 carbine however obviously it does do damage and even though I wasn’t smart enough to realize it my body was telling me it was bothering me. I think your onto something I don’t shoot cans but I imagine there’s some concussion going on and even though it’s not bothering you in your mind your body says otherwise.
Wayne

There's a considerable range of compact slimline earmuffs available these days, not to mention the various brands of sporting muffs with active noise cancelling.

I've been using the folding compact Peltor muffs for many years and started when doing lots of trap many years ago. Get a report or 2 from your side shooter from a wild swinging bird shot and it's not long before you get good ear protection and as we now know, not only do they prevent hearing damage but also damage to our subconscious which impacts on precision shooting.....just as much as does excessive recoil !

 

[bozo699]

There's a considerable range of compact slimline earmuffs available these days, not to mention the various brands of sporting muffs with active noise cancelling.

I've been using the folding compact Peltor muffs for many years and started when doing lots of trap many years ago. Get a report or 2 from your side shooter from a wild swinging bird shot and it's not long before you get good ear protection and as we now know, not only do they prevent hearing damage but also damage to our subconscious which impacts on precision shooting.....just as much as does excessive recoil !

I’ve got good ones but thank you I’ll check into those. I do wear them on the shooting line just not when I’m shooting. I totally agree with your thoughts on the matter.
Wayne

 

[fkimble@charter.net]

I wear custom ear plugs molded in my ears and good ear muffs. I was diagnosed by the US Army Induction Center back around1968. They told me it was bad enough that they could not draft me! but not too bad to volunteer. So I don't get too upset with the early damage but I try hard to prevent any more damage.

Frank

 

[Konocti's Wigwam]

What causes groups like this?

Well, depends on if it's 100 yards or 1000 yards.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

What causes groups like this?

Well, depends on if it's 100 yards or 1000

I don't really agree here. Given a constant condition, which is pretty much impossible...the shape will be the same but the size will will proportionate. Proportionate is NOT 10x the 100 yd group size either...of course.
Bottom line though, the group shape is not yardage dependent is all I'm saying.

 

[Lillico]

Recoil starts as the firing pin moves forward; ask Mr Newton.

 

[L.Sherm]

I don't really agree here. Given a constant condition, which is pretty much impossible...the shape will be the same but the size will will proportionate. Proportionate is NOT 10x the 100 yd group size either...of course.
Bottom line though, the group shape is not yardage dependent is all I'm saying.

This is why I think its the load predominantly. If you look theres outliers in both groups.

 

[DLT]

I got my new bag (protektor) 13b in yesterday, took it to the range and it shot like dog crap. I grabbed my first sand bag that i originally used (not the camo squeeze bag) pictured and shot a lil half inch group. I loaded up 3 more for my uncle to try and shoot the rifle. He has rough eyes and it was getting dark in a hurry, he grabbed an old protektor bag he uses and shot a 1 hole group with my rifle. Kinda narrows it down to the gun, scope, load all ok Here is what I shot 5 shots.

This is His 3 shot group. Guess I forgot how to shoot or it’s my rear bag

 

[L.Sherm]

Maybe you and the gun are just not a fit, or should I say stock.

 

[DLT]

Maybe you and the gun are just not a fit, or should I say stock.

Makes a man wonder don’t it ? I hope that’s not the case, I like the stock and we all know they ain’t free

 

[rwj]

Recoil starts as the firing pin moves forward; ask Mr Newton.

Recoil plus gun handling. Very small movements caused by variation in grip force, trigger pull, shoulder pressure, and/or cheek weld, are amplified by the target distance. I’ve tried free recoil, but it just doesn’t work well for me. Therefore, my struggle is being consistent with the previously cited rifle/shooter interfaces that sometimes cause flyers!

 

[Maxden]

I built a 4" Long x 1.5" tall ( Tapered ) x 5/8th Wide ( V-shaped, at Bottom, W/ rounded edges ), Oak, "Toe Tracking Runner" for my, Leather Protecktor Bag that, Runs almost Paralel to the Bore. That Plus, Jammed 107 SMK's, get Me into, the 2's and 3's with My, 6 XC. Take a Look at what, the Bench Rest shooters "Toe Area" of their Rifles look Like, on youTube. ( I made a sheet Metal, Bracket for the Front and used, a Long Screw to Secure the Back, to the stock).
I get NO Vertical of my Groups, Now, just Round "BugHoles", with this, Homemade, Toe Runner. Good Luck !
My Pillar Bedded, H-S Precision stock, HAD way too MUCH, Toe Angle towards, the Pistol grip !

Can you share a pic of your setup?