USMC is sticking to their guns

[Knotwild]

My money is on 98%+ of our troops not being able to hit the target, especially when it is moving, at anything much beyond 300 yards, if even that far, unless they are a country boy from back in the hills.

The deacon at Church was a career Marine. He was fighting when they were using ACOGS. At that time they weren’t training how to sight in iron sights. When the ACOG was out of action you were effectively just a noise maker. Being a country boy who knew how to shoot - his optic stayed in his pack.

 

[Xerothermic]

It seemed that way then. I have no idea how things are now. It seemed different that the 155 self propelled artillery had V-12 allison gas engines from P-40 flying tiger airplanes and so did the tank retrievers, and the am-tracks. Only the Ontos had dodge 318's. And the self propelled 110's with 8" howitzers had Detroit 8v71 2 stroke diesels . Very nice compared to a V-12 air cooled gas engine from ww2. So yes, The Marines can phase out the old stuff. That's the way it was so maybe it will happen again.

Never heard of a two stroke diesel. Sigh... another thing to research.

 

[dantiff2]

Never heard of a two stroke diesel. Sigh... another thing to research.

Sound awesome wound up but EPA was not a fan!! hahaha

 

[Belly Benchrester]

5.56 just makes sense for an infantry rifle. Light weight ammo, low recoil, keeps heads down at a high rate of fire and last but not least pretty devastating damage

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Never heard of a two stroke diesel. Sigh... another thing to research.

Grew up with an Oliver 1950 tractor with a Detroit 2 stroke. Man those things were loud! They were nicknamed the "Screamin Jimmy". They were deafening to drive all day. No cab either. Definitely not like the tractors of today but Oliver was always innovative and built good tractors in their day.

 

[Doug Casner]

Thats part of the reason I cant hear today. Tractors without cabs. Did that Oliver hit every time it got to the top? The only kind of two strokes I was ever around was dirt bikes. Doug

 

[Knotwild]

Grew up with an Oliver 1950 tractor with a Detroit 2 stroke. Man those things were loud! They were nicknamed the "Screamin Jimmy". They were deafening to drive all day. No cab either. Definitely not like the tractors of today but Oliver was always innovative and built good tractors in their day.

Oliver was miles ahead of John Deere in innovation. They even built a prototype mechanical transmission that worked like today’s power shifts.
Sadly White motor company bought them to keep the truck business going and bled them dry. They even destroyed the prototype transmission.

Ask an oldtimer about a runaway Detroit! The only way to stop it was to stuff a rag in the intake.

 

[NF1E]

No matter what rifle we are talking about it's all about proper training at hitting the darn target whether it's paper or flesh. Conserve ammo by knowing the basics and taking aim. I think, one .308 hit , at any range, bests a hit by .223.
I remember a bunch of Army dudes in our EM club at Chu Lai in 1968 bragging about how many mags of 5.56 each had " dumped" that day. They were proud of the ammo expended even though they never saw a target that needed shooting. Didn't make sense to us Marines, but after a little chat, this was their training. May have carried more ammo but didn't use it correctly in my opinion. Way to easy for an enemy to wait for these goof balls to use up their issued ammo and then do there thing.

 

[jackieschmidt]

Never heard of a two stroke diesel. Sigh... another thing to research.

You must be a young man
The Detroit 71, 92, and 149 series 2-Strokes were one of the most prolific engines ever until basically outlawed by the EPA.

Well, there were other factors. But emissions was a big one.

By the way. The Electromotive EMD 645 and 510 are two strokes, as well as those huge 100,000 hp Diesel’s that power modern container ships.

 

[M-61]

Never heard of a two stroke diesel. Sigh... another thing to research.

Lots of two stroke diesels. All your early Mack trucks were two strokes. Today, meaning current, I don’t think there’s anything but large ( and mean huge really huge) container ships that have nothing lbut two stoke diesels in them. One engine per ship. Max RPM of about 120 rpm. 120 not a typo. Up to 14 cylinders and about an 8 foot stroke.
If you want weird years ago (ww2) there were double headed two strokes which were one connecting rod with a piston on each end. I guess they could in a way be called ONE strokes as each connecting rod produced a power stroke with ONE complete revolution. The Graff Spee is /was an example . Made by M.A.N.

 

[GetReal]

Should have stayed with the M1 Garand. .

Yeah, baby !!!!!

 

[M-61]

I notice the Military is very slow and stubborn to change or adopt anything new
even when it's a benefit

Yes. There is always a problem in adopting anything that’s not combat proven. There is maybe some validity in that. An F-111 is one example. Went to VietNam. A total failure in every respect. And very quickly was removed from service there. But given enough time and of course money it evolved into a respectable aircraft.

 

[Rick300]

When I worked on submarines in the 70's and 80's they all had opposed piston diesels. It was awesome to hear them running....the first time

 

[M-61]

Wartsilla 14 cylinder two stroke diesel has a crankshaft that weighs 300 tons.
Fuel consumption: about 1600 gallons of heavy oil per hour.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Thats part of the reason I cant hear today. Tractors without cabs. Did that Oliver hit every time it got to the top? The only kind of two strokes I was ever around was dirt bikes. Doug

I really don't know as I was old enough to drive em but not really work on them. Mostly handed Dad tools and watched. I do remember the day we traded it for a new 2-105 White though. That became my baby. It was light years better to drive...and it had a cab. A/c even! Lol! I put a lot of hours on two of those over the years and a 2-155. That tractor was a hoss. The 105's ran Perkins engines and the 155 had a Hercules. Both good engines and I was old enough to work on those.

 

[DaveTooley]

I assume the new 6.8 round is mated with a new rifle receiver, bigger than the ar15 platform. Mr. Tooley, it would be great to hear about Remington and the almost new sniper rifle development and history/failure.

I am still flummoxed about the Garand using a 30 cal round instead of the 284/7mm.

There's plenty out there on the 6.8X51 round.

As far as the history of the sniper rifle circus. Here goes.

First a little background.
In 2008 a tier 1 organization was looking for a new sniper rifle. Through friends I was introduced to Accuracy International. I performed a basic modification to the submitted rifles. Got the job of chambering all of AINA barrels that day. At the same time I got a contract for replacement barrels for the currently fielded weapons. Those replacement barrels shot well. Decision time for the selection of a new system. Some wanted AI because I was part of the package. They went with the Remington MSR. Good rifle, poor execution. I got the job of rebarreling those rifles and providing future support for it and another system.

Back to the center ring of the circus. PSR I. Rifles submitted to be shot out of a fixture, no scope, at 1500 M. Alternative calibers welcome. The 300AI and 338AI were submitted. Known today as the 300 PRC.
I don't think the rifles were ever fired because of the test methodology.

PSR II Rifles submitted. Tested at Crane Naval Surface Warfare Center, Crane IN. by the vendor teams.
Remington MSR was chosen. First article submissions would not meet the accuracy standard. I was ready to do replacement barrels, Bartlein was going to supply the barrels, SOCOM was willing to pay the difference between factory and custom barrels. Remington would not go along with it. Contract canceled. PSR II died.

I also did Sako's barrel for PSR II

ASR ( Advanced Sniper Rifle ) I was not involved in ASR. Enter the 300 NM and 338 NM. Barrett was chosen.

That's my involvement in a nut shell. There was a lot of hard work and angst involved.

 

[NF1E]

Yeah, baby !!!!!

I was issued an M1 for ITR in the Spring of 1966 and would have had no problem using one in Vietnam over the M16. It's all in the training and confidence in the tools we have to work with. The M14 had 20 rnd mags, big deal, the M1 is fast to load especially with adrenaline pumping. Sand might have had less detrimental effect on an M1 than our M16. Entry to my bunker at Chu Lai was pretty hard on an M16. Whatta Hobby!

 

[jackieschmidt]

Lots of two stroke diesels. All your early Mack trucks were two strokes. Today, meaning current, I don’t think there’s anything but large ( and mean huge really huge) container ships that have nothing lbut two stoke diesels in them. One engine per ship. Max RPM of about 120 rpm. 120 not a typo. Up to 14 cylinders and about an 8 foot stroke.
If you want weird years ago (ww2) there were double headed two strokes which were one connecting rod with a piston on each end. I guess they could in a way be called ONE strokes as each connecting rod produced a power stroke with ONE complete revolution. The Graff Spee is /was an example . Made by M.A.N.

The Fairbanks Morse Opposed Cylinder 2 Stroke Diesels powered US Submarines and in later years a lot of locomotives and push boats.

Fairbanks Morse Diamond Opposed-Piston Marine Engine

The Fairbanks Morse Diamond opposed-piston engine was an experimental project during WWII. Sponsored by the US Navy, the engine produced 3,000 hp, but only one prototype was built.

oldmachinepress.com

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

There's plenty out there on the 6.8X51 round.

As far as the history of the sniper rifle circus. Here goes.

First a little background.
In 2008 a tier 1 organization was looking for a new sniper rifle. Through friends I was introduced to Accuracy International. I performed a basic modification to the submitted rifles. Got the job of chambering all of AINA barrels that day. At the same time I got a contract for replacement barrels for the currently fielded weapons. Those replacement barrels shot well. Decision time for the selection of a new system. Some wanted AI because I was part of the package. They went with the Remington MSR. Good rifle, poor execution. I got the job of rebarreling those rifles and providing future support for it and another system.

Back to the center ring of the circus. PSR I. Rifles submitted to be shot out of a fixture, no scope, at 1500 M. Alternative calibers welcome. The 300AI and 338AI were submitted. Known today as the 300 PRC.
I don't think the rifles were ever fired because of the test methodology.

PSR II Rifles submitted. Tested at Crane Naval Surface Warfare Center, Crane IN. by the vendor teams.
Remington MSR was chosen. First article submissions would not meet the accuracy standard. I was ready to do replacement barrels, Bartlein was going to supply the barrels, SOCOM was willing to pay the difference between factory and custom barrels. Remington would not go along with it. Contract canceled. PSR II died.

I also did Sako's barrel for PSR II

ASR ( Advanced Sniper Rifle ) I was not involved in ASR. Enter the 300 NM and 338 NM. Barrett was chosen.

That's my involvement in a nut shell. There was a lot of hard work and angst involved.

Cool story Dave! Still livin the dream!

 

[Bob3700]

Dave is spot on. It has been about 10 years in the developement from generating specs, initial prototypes, contract competition, selection, and now procurment. Total cost for everything is less than one B2 bomber.

It is not just the cost of the product, it is all the items u don’t see. When Boeing signs a contract to make F-18s, the actual aircraft price is only a part of the overall contract. They also sell exclusive rights to make n deliver parts ( anywhere in the world) and all the training ( hardware n software) as well. Big money in the latter items.