My bleed is very even an at a minimum an flat
Time to make the donuts....
- Thread starter AlNyhus
- Start date
Tim Singleton
Gold $$ Contributor
My assumption has always been it is jacket wall variation
When I have ran into this and have gone to a different jacket using the same punch this went away
liseo
Silver $$ Contributor
Al
Yes, I made some conical (domed ?) punches, as they seemed to give better results.
Yes, the cores are also domed on both ends.
About nub, I believe is a optical ilusion
See punch attached picture
Attachments
liseo
Silver $$ Contributor
brcman
No, they release from the punch easily.
Yes, the bleed in uneven, and the reason for my doubts
Liseo, domed/concave faced core-form (convex on both ends of core); flat/perpendicular core-seat punches will eliminate a fair amount of head scratching. It appears that you have the ability to make this happen.
Think flow dynamics.
Perusing the OLD J4 prints, for 1.300" long jacket, the J4 print displays [T.I.R.] tolerance of 0.0003" wall-thickness variation @ 0.150" from the inside-base, then, at 1.175" from inside-base, 0.0007". The tapered section begins at 0.31" from the base, and runs to the mouth. The taper is specified as 0*-34', with angularity tolerance of +/- 30 minutes. Note: for wall-thickness variation, T.I.R. is poor terminology: both inside and outside walls may be perfectly ROUND, but not concentric, thus creating variation of wall-thickness = center-of-gravity offset.
Rigidly mounted misaligned punch(es) can also cause your issue, as can/will relatively small diameter flat-ended cores, which are free to tip/tilt once under pressure, thus flow to the least resistance. If you're not doing so, as opposed to locking punches rigidly in place with punch-nut, try o-rings, between the punch-head and the lock-nut faces, just finger tight, to secure the punches. RG
Think flow dynamics.Perusing the OLD J4 prints, for 1.300" long jacket, the J4 print displays [T.I.R.] tolerance of 0.0003" wall-thickness variation @ 0.150" from the inside-base, then, at 1.175" from inside-base, 0.0007". The tapered section begins at 0.31" from the base, and runs to the mouth. The taper is specified as 0*-34', with angularity tolerance of +/- 30 minutes. Note: for wall-thickness variation, T.I.R. is poor terminology: both inside and outside walls may be perfectly ROUND, but not concentric, thus creating variation of wall-thickness = center-of-gravity offset.
Rigidly mounted misaligned punch(es) can also cause your issue, as can/will relatively small diameter flat-ended cores, which are free to tip/tilt once under pressure, thus flow to the least resistance. If you're not doing so, as opposed to locking punches rigidly in place with punch-nut, try o-rings, between the punch-head and the lock-nut faces, just finger tight, to secure the punches. RG
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liseo
Silver $$ Contributor
Al, yes, I sectioned some bullets.
Below, from left to right, domed core seater, flat core seater, Berger Juggernaut, and Sierra MK 168.
Attachments
liseo
Silver $$ Contributor
I always ask a friend, who is a good shooter, to test them. He has several rifles assembled by Borden.
In the last test, we did 5 groups of 5 shots with each bullet at 100m, comparing 30 caliber bullets produced by me with those by Berger( Juggernaut.)
On average, my bullets produced groups that were slightly better.
But I wish they were noticeable better.
I would like them to group like some BIB bullets I acquired a few years ago (high expectations, I know,,,lol)
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jackieschmidt
Gold $$ Contributor
After reading these post, I cut a fresh seated core, (30 caliber) and sectioned a bullet.
As you can see, there is no bleed by, and the core remains flat at and true as it is pointed.
AlNyhus
Silver $$ Contributor
Randy's advice on 'o' rings is nugget of pure gold.
On my Blackmon core seater setup, the addition of an 'o' ring between the seater punch and the lock nut effectively acts like splitting the difference between punch sizes. (in terms of bleed by). I've A-B-A'd this many times and the results are always the same, no matter what punch diameter I work with. Whether it's vertical or horizontal, the same principles of self centering apply. Like the concert documentary of Led Zepplin: 'The Song Remains The Same'.
For tightness of the nut, a .015 gap between the nut and the punch holder on this setup is a perfect balance of self centering and enough tension where the nut doesn't back off. When changing punches, a .015 feeler gauge makes it so easy......even a poor white kid from the wrong side of the tracks (like me) can do it.
On my Blackmon core seater setup, the addition of an 'o' ring between the seater punch and the lock nut effectively acts like splitting the difference between punch sizes. (in terms of bleed by). I've A-B-A'd this many times and the results are always the same, no matter what punch diameter I work with. Whether it's vertical or horizontal, the same principles of self centering apply. Like the concert documentary of Led Zepplin: 'The Song Remains The Same'.
For tightness of the nut, a .015 gap between the nut and the punch holder on this setup is a perfect balance of self centering and enough tension where the nut doesn't back off. When changing punches, a .015 feeler gauge makes it so easy......even a poor white kid from the wrong side of the tracks (like me) can do it.
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Tim Singleton
Gold $$ Contributor
Liseo
was this a different lot of jackets?
I like your safety tip on that punchRandy's advice on 'o' rings is nugget of pure gold.
On my Blackmon core seater setup, the addition of an 'o' ring between the seater punch and the lock nut effectively acts like splitting the difference between punch sizes. (in terms of bleed by). I've A-B-A'd this many times and the results are always the same, no matter what punch diameter I work with. Whether it's vertical or horizontal, the same principles of self centering apply. Like the concert documentary of Led Zepplin: 'The Song Remains The Same'.
For tightness of the nut, a .015 gap between the nut and the punch holder is a perfect balance of self centering and enough tension where the nut doesn't back off. When changing punches, a .015 feeler gauge makes it so easy......even a poor white kid from the wrong side of the tracks (like me) can do it.
liseo
Silver $$ Contributor
Yes, another brand
I place a nylon washer on the back side of the nut that allows the punch to float an self align
I make 116 on j4 30 cal I use a 2670 punch on a old lot of jackets 925 length
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