The Howa Mini (300 blackout) ?

[rookie7]

Good morning,

Years ago I said to myself and LSI that the 1500 mini action would be a perfect fit for the 300 blk.

I had a Ruger Ranch in 300 blk, but sold it when they announced the mini in 300 blk.

They do not stay in stock for very long online with any gun store.

However, I can't find anything from a paying consumer online in regards to a review of the rifle.

I'm waiting to hear from a paying customer before I drop the cash on one.

It seems it would be a very fun rifle supressed or not. (i do not own a suppressor though)

Does anyone here have one? Have a friend that does?

On a side note: folks proclaim the versatility of the 300 blk and the fun factor.

In your opinion or experience - is it really that much more versatile than the 223? Is it really that much more fun than a 223?

I'm referring to rifle length barrels 16" or more - no SBR.

Thank you.

 

[Dave in WI]

IMHO, where the 300 BLK shines is suppressed subsonic loads in SBR semi-auto. Longer barrels, bolt action, reloading, etc., I don't feel you gain much if anything over the other common calibers.

 

[Mike7.62]

Good morning,

Years ago I said to myself and LSI that the 1500 mini action would be a perfect fit for the 300 blk.

I had a Ruger Ranch in 300 blk, but sold it when they announced the mini in 300 blk.

They do not stay in stock for very long online with any gun store.

However, I can't find anything from a paying consumer online in regards to a review of the rifle.

I'm waiting to hear from a paying customer before I drop the cash on one.

It seems it would be a very fun rifle supressed or not. (i do not own a suppressor though)

Does anyone here have one? Have a friend that does?

On a side note: folks proclaim the versatility of the 300 blk and the fun factor.

In your opinion or experience - is it really that much more versatile than the 223? Is it really that much more fun than a 223?

I'm referring to rifle length barrels 16" or more - no SBR.

Thank you.

I have a few. One Spikes 16" AR upper, one Remington AAC M7, one CZ527, and a TC Encore barrel bought from a fellow member here. I use them both suppressed and un-suppressed, and as you say it is a heck of a lot of fun. IMO is is more versatile than the 5.56/.223. I have a few of those too, and as a varmint cartridge the 5.56/.223 is superior to the .300 BLK. As an anti-personnel cartridge they are essentially equal, as the supersonic .300 BLK is within 100 f/s of the 7.62x39 with 125 gr bullets. As a suppressed cartridge, the .300 BLK is in top form, especially if you are a handloader. It is very quiet with the heavier bullets such as the 208 gr Hornady, but it gets stupid quiet with lighter bullets from 85 gr to 110 gr and Trail Boss powder. The light loads won't cycle the AR, but the heavier bullets will. The lightweight bullets are great on smaller varmints inside of 100 yards, and some have used Lehigh Defense HP's at subsonic velocities to take deer with good effect.

All in all, if you don't have a .300 BK, you're missing the boat. I would go with the bolt gun over the Mini-30, as it will be more accurate and the lightweight bullet options are much better.

 

[Knotwild]

In my opinion, the 300 BO has been a waste of time for my purposes. I have an SBR and a 16" AR and I don't like dealing with the trajectory and variety of bullets out there. I guess if I shot it every day, it would be easier for me, but I shoot a lot of pests like armadillos, a bobcat or two, a coyote occasionally, and deer - targets of opportunity. With my .223 a precise shot is easy out to 200 pretty quick.I use a Leupold 2.5 - 8 with the Boone & Crockett reticule and it allows hits on steel to 400 with my load and the hash marks. I can't do that with the BO.

Subsonic is rather expensive and I would hesitate to shoot a deer with a factory subsonic. Plus, I don't reload for mine and I find that some factory is truly subsonic and some is just a bit over and therefore loud with my suppressor. But, I like quiet, so I bought a .45 acp AR to play with. Cheap and pre expanded when it leaves the barrel. If I were going with Howa mini action, I personally would rather play with the Grendel.

So, I'll admit that I'm not a capable enough rifleman to get the most out of a BO and I am disassembling my 16" this week because I don't use it.

Disclaimer
I'm no expert and my life history indicates that I have made many poor decisions, which infers that I have given a lot of bad advice. Therefore, I cannot be held responsible if you make a bad decision and follow my bad advice.

 

[msalm]

In a bolt gun I’d rather have a 7.62x39. Better velocity/trajectory and more suitable for deer. I have a bunch of the Howa Mini’s and many started out as a 7.62. I did several wildcats on the Grendel (22, 6mm, and a 20 cal reamer on order). Even turned a 30 cal bushing for a grendel reamer and opened up a factory 7.62 chamber with it. 125’s at 25-2600 is much more useful to me than any subsonic bullet. Most ALL my rifles are for hunting though so there is that.

 

[mauser284]

IMHO, where the 300 BLK shines is suppressed subsonic loads in SBR semi-auto. Longer barrels, bolt action, reloading, etc., I don't feel you gain much if anything over the other common calibers.

You have to remember that 99% of the cartridges that people have developed for the AR-15 platform make absolutely no sense on paper or in the real world unless you artificially limit your self to a cartridge that can be fired through an AR platform from a magazine. The second you do not have the limitations of an AR-15 magazine then all of those cartridges become the opposite of intelligent! Anything you can do with the 300 AAC Blackout can be done better with almost any other standard cartridge in a bolt gun. If you want to shoot insanely heavy subsonic ammo it can be done in a 308 Win or 30-06 even better and you would then have the a lot more cartridge versatility!

I have not used the Howa Mini in 300BLK but Howa build a better product than Remington or Savage in terms of out of the box materials, machining precision and quality control. So I would not worry about buying a Howa Product at all. I own a bolt action of theirs and they are fantastic in fact they are a bargain gem! You get far more than you are paying for with a Howa!

 

[Dusty Stevens]

I cant see a need in the 300bo to start with and its sure not as versatile as a 223 which was your main question. Its only use is in sbr rifles with a supressor- neither of which youre looking for and even if so it doesnt really serve a purpose except shoot quietly. Just my opinion of course- dont flame me blackout boys!!

 

[mac86951]

I'm in agreement; I don't see a benefit to 300BO; but if you want subsonic, cast your own and they'd be fun in a bolt action. As for the Howa; there are a few sticking points such as replacement magazines; light weight stocks, and such that make the mini action not super special; good action, but plastic parts mean caution.

Is a 223 bolt face what you'd want if you don't like the 300BO? Then it's an action worth getting; but I'd otherwise recommend a full short action length for it's future versatility barrel chamber aside.

-Mac

 

[rookie7]

The main point of the thread was to see if anyone here has specifically the Howa 1500 mini action in .300 blackout.

As I mentioned in my OP - when they announced the 300 blackout in the Howa 1500 mini I sold the Ruger Ranch.

This past few months I've been searching and waiting for reviews that were not from gun rags.

In these past few months, I will admit I have asked myself more than a few times why I actually need a 300 blackout since I don't shoot subsonic (and I don't own a suppressor).

Y'all have provided good input even though no one owns the rifle/cartridge combo in question; except I think Mike 7.62 is confused and is thinking I was asking about the Ruger Mini 30 semi auto.

 

[Mike7.62]

True, I did think you were referring to the Mini 30, as the reference for "mini" came after the Ruger Ranch portion of the sentence. Mea culpa.

I will say that if you're not going to handload for the .300 BLK, or use it suppressed, then you are better off with the 5.56/.223 just on the variety of factory ammo available, and its cost when compared to the .300 BLK.

I like my .300 BLK in all of its forms, including the AR platform. I have found that it is better suited to that platform than the 7.62x39, and that out of equivalent barrel lengths that there isn't a dimes worth of difference between the two. Also the .300 BLK feeds better due to magazine design and availability, and doesn't weaken the bolt with an oversized bolt face as does the 7.62x39.

I also have two CZ 527's one in .300 BLK and the other in 7.62x39, and I do prefer the latter because it is finished and fitted better than the former, not because of any better performance of the cartridges involved. IMO, whether you are a factory ammo user or a handloader the .300 BLK has a much better range of bullet weights available than the 7.62x39, at least if you are using .311 bullets in the 7.62x39.

Just my opinions based upon using all three cartridges in many different platforms.

 

[Andrew Dumond]

I know this thread is a few months old, but since I actually own the rifle in question...

I purchased one of the 300 Blk heavy-barreled actions from Brownells and dropped it into a Bell and Carlson M40 stock and then topped it off with a MDT 20MOA scope base, low Warne rings and a Nikon Prostaff P3 2-7x32 scope. Since I do shoot it suppressed, it also has a Rugged R3L flash hider for my Surge 762. Total weight is 8.3 lbs.

Now that you have the specs, here are my thoughts...

The action is smooth and the finish was very good. However, I was very disappointed that Howa decided to use a plastic trigger guard/magazine well. The magazine release was also in a less than optimal location; directly in front of the magazine, allowing it to be easily actuated by any slight contact. I quickly replaced the whole assembly with one from DIProducts Inc (including their mag release lever). The fit was perfect and positioned the inserted magazine at just the right height.

The rifle shoots great and is more accurate than the 16" 300 Blk AR-15 that I sold in order to fund the entirety of this build.

The weakness in this rifle lies in its magazine. The follower is most definitely NOT anti-tilt. I have fed 125gr, 147gr and 200gr without any issues, but the 220gr ammo has a tendency to slip off the bolt (pushing down on the remaining ammo in the magazine and sending the round into the chamber at an angle too steep to go into battery). Backing up the bolt a little to attempt a second try at the round doesn't help any either, as the case is now wedged against the shoulder of the round below it and the tip of the bullet is in the locking lug channel (I think... It's hard to tell with everything jammed up in there). You have to drop the magazine to clear the malfunction. It tends to only do this when the magazine is half empty. This leads me to believe that the spring is too weak to cycle the heaviest subsonics.

As I was simply looking to build an accurate, relatively light, magazine-fed bolt action rifle chambered in 300 Blk for recreational target shooting from 50-200 yards... It fits the bill.

 

[Andrew Dumond]

Forgot to mention that I also had to trim off a bit from the front of the scope mount in order to use low rings.

 

[300_whisper]

That looks like a pretty little hunting gun right there. Well done. I personally love the .300BO. It’s the 21st century .30-30. Nothing more, nothing less. It’s fun to shoot and tinker with.

 

[Oso]

I own a Howa Mini chambered in 6.5 Grendel and the barreled action is still sitting in its box from Brownells. It is a nice sized action with descent trigger. However, by all accounts the Howa Mini's are plagued with the spotty quality of their plastic magazines with variations in dimensions from batch to batch, poor mag follower (also plastic), and an underpowered mag spring. The result is often that it will either not feed rounds or only 1-2 of rounds out of the magazine. The only thing worse then the poorly manufactured plastic parts is the customer service. Some people have no issues with their magazines, but more common than not to expect issues.

Everyone keeps hoping someone will step in with an aftermarket replacement metal magazine...hint hint MDT do this please. Bell & /Carlson rolled out a new Kevlar stock and convinced DIP Products to produce a replacement bottom metal that is actually metal.

I have the CZ 527 in 300BO with 18" barrel that runs 2400fps with 125gr SMK and it is solid 1/2" gun. The best hunting round is the Barnes 110gr TAC-TX, which is devastating on deer and hogs. There are some guys pushing 150-300 yards using the Speers 150gr Gold Dot and it is hard to argue with their results. If you're serious about subsonic hunting then heavy bullets designed for .308 meant to be sent at 2700-2800fps just are slugs that don't expand or cause hydrostatic shock when subsonic... go buy some Lehigh Defense Maximum Expansion bullets...not cheap but equivalent of hitting with a broadhead arrow at 1000fps

 

[Spook]

I liked it better when it was a 300 Whisper. Pretty "over it" at this point even though I have several rifles/barrels laying around here....somewhere?
Back when I thought I invented the 30 Grendle I realized how less than perfect the BO was.

 

[rookie7]

Thank you to everyone for your input. Since I started this thread with the intention of buying the Howa in 300 blackout I have changed course. I have given up on the blackout and am no longer in the game.

I sold my Ruger Ranch in 300 blk back last year with the intentions of buying the Howa. However, I bought the Howa 1500 mini in 6.5 grendel with heavy barrel at the first of the summer instead.

I like loading for the grendel, and feel it has more accuracy potential than the blackout. I may be wrong and have no empirical data to back up my statement, but that is how I feel.

At least with the grendel I have the choice of more temp stable powders compared to the normal powders used for the 300.

I also purchased the DIP bottom metal and mag release. Much better than the trash that comes with the rifle. However, their mag release isn't without fault. One can have an accidental dump of the mag in a hunting situation with it. I found this out first hand this past fall when trying to get on a coyote.

I did send DIP an email a few months back asking if they have considered a BDL floorplate for the mini. They said they were in the discussion and development stage with an engineer.

Keeping my fingers crossed.

 

[Oso]

Without a doubt the 6.5 Grendel is inherently a more accurate round with greater distance capability. The 300BO is a great short-distance hunting round that operates flawlessly in an AR15, and no recoil. For these reasons I got into Blackout. If Alexander Arms hadn't done their money-grab maneuver with the patent when the 6.5 Grendel cartridge was first developed then perhaps I would have gone straight to it. However, they/he delayed widespread acceptance by 5-10 years, which allowed the 300BO to gain a solid foothold. Under 300 yards the additional 200-300 fps that 6.5 Grendel provides over 300BO doesn't make a huge difference. The additional ballistics (velocity and lower BC) of 6.5 Grendel really begin kicking in at 300 yards and further.

My original plan for my Howa Mini (6.5 Grendel) was to kit it out in an MDT LSS-XL. I have also considered the B&C stock. I keep holding on my build until there is either a replacement metal magazine or a replacement blind/hinged internal magazine.

 

[rookie7]

The new Heatseeker Chassis from Sharps Bros for the Howa mini looks nice.

 

[Oso]

The new Heatseeker Chassis from Sharps Bros for the Howa mini looks nice.

It looks interesting... I would want to hold one before I bought it. I would want to test out the carbon fiber front rail. I just don't have the experience on its locking/retaining mechanism compared to the typical AR15 style mounting. The other thing that got my attention was the long rear tang/stock interface. It would be nice if they put out a short video discussing the chassis' design and key features.

 

[mac86951]

And offered and AR mag option.