Suppressors

[Eddie Harren]

Ask Zak Smith.

I obviously don't know him as well as you do. Could you ask him for me?

 

[dcali]

All I know is when someone's shooting a supersonic centerfire rifle with a suppressor, and I'm next to them, my ears hurt. Maybe I haven't lost as much hearing as some guys, but I intend to keep it that way.

 

[JRS]

I obviously don't know him as well as you do. Could you ask him for me?

Call TBAC and ask to speak to Zak. (307) 534-7818

 

[Geno C]

if you load your rounds subsonic, suppressors will do what they are supposed to do.

Other wise, hang a brake on it.

Really?! Brakes are obnoxious on the line! The only way I would shoot with a brake over a suppressor is if I were shooting a really large heavy recoiling rifle, like a 50. The suppressor doesn't mitigate recoil as well as a good brake and it becomes apparent at these recoils levels. Otherwise; suppressed for me!!

 

[Eddie Harren]

Call TBAC and ask to speak to Zak. (307) 534-7818

Gee, you seem to know everybody.

 

[Twitchy]

If I put a .30 caliber suppressor on a .223 rifle would it be as quite as a .223 suppressor or would the sound reduction be the same?

I use a suppressor for all my rifles except my F-TR guns. A 308 can will work with 223 just fine. There will be a slight difference in tone (in my experience), but nothing too dramatic with regards to the level of noise. I'm sure a sound meter will show a difference, but at the level of loudness 223 makes, it's pretty damn near the same to my ear.

 

[XTR]

if you load your rounds subsonic, suppressors will do what they are supposed to do.

Other wise, hang a brake on it.

There is so much in this thread that sounds like it is coming from people who have not used them.

Yes, a subsonic can be hearing safe. Put subs in an semi-auto and with a good can and the action cycling is the louder than the report. That said, with full up loads you can't do anything about the sonic crack (why I wear protection in the pits at 1000 yards) but put a can on a supersonic and it still reduces the report, which is a large % of what the shooter and to those in the immediate area are exposed.. Reducing the db at the shooter by 20 to 40 is still a lot better on the shooter. Yes, I still shoot full power center fire loads with hearing protection at the range with a can, but the sound is not even close to the same. With hearing protection a suppressed full power load sounds more like an air line breaking than a rifle shot.

There is a recent report that says that the military is considering going 100% suppressed because cans are cheaper than the long term cost of hearing loss.

In any state where it is legal I'd encourage any hunter to put a can on his deer rifle*. and Most of us don't wear protection in the woods. The can may not make it truely safe, but remember the dB scale is a log scale, so the pressure reduction from 140 dB for a rifle shot down to 130 dB or so reduces the sound pressure by a factor of about 4. That's ¼ of the impulse pressure, that's a huge reduction, even if its still not actually "safe" .

For a competition rifle in PRS, seems most of the winners are running brakes. They work better for controlling recoil and don't add 6-7 inches to the barrel.

To the OP, a 308 can/will reduce the 223 by a lot. It won't be as effective, but it will still make a difference. My SILENCERCO Hybrid can take anything from a 460 to 223. It can change the front plate to have an appropriate sized exit, but the only time that changing from the 460 size front plate really makes a difference is shooting 223s because there is just such a big hole for the little bullets; even this it's like 7dB or something like that.

*TABAC used to make one and I know SILENCERCO still makes a light weight non-tactical, non-full auto can rated for 300WM. The SILENCERCO version is rated for like 6 shots per min and is really light.

 

[swd]

if you load your rounds subsonic, suppressors will do what they are supposed to do.

Other wise, hang a brake on it.

All you need to do is go to a match where suppressors are legal and you'll change your mind on that real quick. Supressors are a pleasure to be around, muzzle brakes are not.

 

[dcali]

Wearing earmuffs in the pits is a good comparison. It's still loud even down range. I get the sense that the guys who don't protect their ears when shooting suppressed full power rifles might be the same guys who don't "need" ear pro for rimfires. And quite possibly the same guys who start the hearing aid threads 30 years later.

 

[JaoeyP]

So yes, you'll still have good DB reduction with a 30 cal can on a 22 cal rifle, but likely not as good as if you had a 22 cal can on a 22 cal rifle.

To add a bit regarding what is or is not hearing safe, I work as a manufacturers rep in the industry and sell among other lines Peltor Sport Eyewear and Hearing protection. Here is a pic we use in training regarding decibels and hearing damage. In my opinion, you should wear ear protection ANY time you are shooting, suppressed or unsuppressed. A suppressed rifle shooting supersonic loads can and likely is still damaging your hearing. Also, if you already have hearing loss, it may not bother you as bad, but physically it can still be damaging your hearing. Keep in mind there is a cumulative effect here as well, just because it doesn't bother for a few shots, doesn't mean your safe to shoot suppressed without ear protection all day long.

 

[gravelyctry]

Ask Zak Smith.

" A suppressed .223 is not hearing safe."




Mr. Wizard, does this apply to 22LR as well? How about 9mm Luger?

Mr Eddie
I lost a lot of my hearing by a fairly young age before I started shooting high power rifles much at all. I used to shoot rim fire a TON when I was younger.

I wear hearing aids, and at my first appointment with the audiologist (not sure if that’s what they’re called for sure) the guy said more hearing damage is done by the 22 than anything other round due to numerous reasons. It’s very common, people perceive it to be quiet enough that they don’t wear ear pro, and they tend to shoot it a lot.

Neil

 

[JRS]

" A suppressed .223 is not hearing safe."




Mr. Wizard, does this apply to 22LR as well? How about 9mm Luger?

This should help:

Glock 17 9mm - 163 dB
Sig Sauer 228 9mm - 160 dB
22LR (rifles) 139.6-143 dB
22LR (pistols) 154-158.1 dB
22 short (pistols) 155.1 dB

 

[Larryh128]

So yes, you'll still have good DB reduction with a 30 cal can on a 22 cal rifle, but likely not as good as if you had a 22 cal can on a 22 cal rifle.

To add a bit regarding what is or is not hearing safe, I work as a manufacturers rep in the industry and sell among other lines Peltor Sport Eyewear and Hearing protection. Here is a pic we use in training regarding decibels and hearing damage. In my opinion, you should wear ear protection ANY time you are shooting, suppressed or unsuppressed. A suppressed rifle shooting supersonic loads can and likely is still damaging your hearing. Also, if you already have hearing loss, it may not bother you as bad, but physically it can still be damaging your hearing. Keep in mind there is a cumulative effect here as well, just because it doesn't bother for a few shots, doesn't mean your safe to shoot suppressed without ear protection all day long.

Thanks for posting, after looking at it, I'm not going to a stadium football game. Well don't anyway but a good reason now. LOL.

 

[shoot4fun]

This should help:

Glock 17 9mm - 163 dB
Sig Sauer 228 9mm - 160 dB
22LR (rifles) 139.6-143 dB
22LR (pistols) 154-158.1 dB
22 short (pistols) 155.1 dB

Good info. I never shot any semi-auto pistols suppressed other than 22LR but I did shoot a fair amount thru the MP5 I had suppressed. I could always tell the last round was louder due to the bolt hold open on any semi/FA weapon I shot suppressed.
With me it has become kinda like the old "if a tree falls in the woods and no one is there to hear it...." thing. I have no doubt about these numbers but they are lost on me, especially if my hearing aids are not in.
My audiologist told me I was at the point where HP didn't make any difference to me without hearing aids now (I still wear HP tho) and I'm pretty sure the ringing in my ears is loaded than 154 dB.

 

[spife7980]

I have a omega 30 and my cousin has another. We put a 22 end cap on one and left the 30 anchor brake on the other. Shooting 223 through it I couldn't notice a difference on the rifle but people a few yards away said that the end cap was indeed quieter.

Shooting through a can while technically fine... is still loud. You can still feel the pressure on your ears and it isnt what I would call comfortable. My ears wont ring with one shot but 5 or 6 real quick and they will start to. For that reason I always wear muffs unless Im out hunting. Its just to easy to not become deaf.

 

[yukonal]

To the OP...a 223 can on a 223 will be more effective.

You should still wear hearing protection with your suppressed rifles. Altho it's the wrong attitude, if I'll fire one shot while hunting, I'll forgo hearing protection.

Multiple shots at the range, or hog killing with my AR's, protection is a must.

 

[germanlongbow]

I've been shooting for 20 years, the last 4 with suppressors. I used to think you didn't need ear protection. Wrong. I've lost about 30 % of hearing from last hearing test since shooting cans without ear protection. A suppressed subsonic 22 is the only thing I will set next to anymore without ears on. Your fooling yourself if your not wearing plugs at the least and a good set of muffs.

 

[John from MN]

It seems worth mentioning that how well a can does its job depends heavily on the environment it's being used in.

I built a platform into a pole shed for shooting prone without have to lay in snow during the winter months. I would never shoot from that position without earpro, even with my can on.

It doesn't bother me to go prone on my septic tank mound and send a few rounds out to my steel to check zero or dope when I need to. The ground falls away and there is nothing but grass or snow nearby.

 

[JRS]

Hearing protection is also used by air gun shooters, although they produce only 88 dB to 94 dB, depending upon caliber and gun, which is essentially the dB produced by popping the top on a full soda can.

 

[ND shooter]