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Started fireforming the 6 Dasher yesterday

I hoped to start in on this two weeks ago but was delayed by two weekends of deer sausage making and my gunsmith buddy Butch Hongisto being down with migraines and a painful foot ailment. Oh well, we all know about delays, I'm not complaining.

When I got set up for loading at the range, I realized that I didn't have my Sinclair OAL gauge in either of my two range boxes. Ugggggg, I lent it to Milton 2 weeks ago and now he is gone all this week snow goose hunting.

Since I was only fireforming, I didn't bother taking my RCBS Chargemaster along. Instead, I used my Harrell's powder measure and 10/10 scale to drop 32 grains of Varget over Remington 7 1/2 primers and 95 grain Berger VLD's. Killshot used this load, with 105 or 108 Berger VLD's for his forming, so I did also. I thought about bumping the powder up a touch but Quick Load had it right below max pressure for 6 BR with the 95's and listed it as over pressure with the bigger Berger's. Caution prevailed.

I had to feel my way into a jam length since I didn't have my OAL gauge; starting long and going a touch shorter until I could get the bolt handle to lock down with reasonably hard resistance. Then I added .015 to the Forster micro seating die and used that as my length. It gave nice engraving on the bullets.

OK, one loaded round and off to the firing line to see what would happen. The fired case looked nice to me but I had another 6 Dasher guy inspect it for his opinion. He said the neck was great, that the corners were good, and that they would sharpen up the rest of the way on the next firing. The case measured 1.539. He told me to leave my powder alone for now, I was close enough.

That was the first shot out of the Broughton 8 twist barrel, so I cleaned it as, I always do with a new barrel. I was really surprised to see the amount of blue on the patch. I had never seen that much on any of my Broughton barrels. Normally, it is only a faint trace of color. So, I kept up the one shot....clean.....regiment. Second shot was no where near as blue. Third shot left next to nothing. Not enough to say nothing, but close. I kept at it until I had 5 shots down the tube. By the fourth, it was nothing.

Those first 5, clean bore shots resulted in a round .965 group at 100 yards. Next, I fired a 5 shot group at .663. Cleaned the barrel again and had absolutely no copper fouling. That was followed by a 15 shot group that measured .609. Again, no copper fouling. I had 20 more rounds loaded and split them into two 10 shot groups, cleaning in between. They measured .495 and .352, respectively. That last group only had .186 of vertical, wind was causing the horizontal spread. It was windy and I hadn't even considered using windflags; it's only a fireforming day afterall.

I did lose one case out of the 40 to a split neck. All of the fired cases ranged between 1.537 to 1.540. I'm wishing they were longer and maybe they will be after sizing and another firing or two. What was really amazing to me is how this barrel seemed to shoot in throughout the afternoon. Every group was tighter than the previous one. I spent the rest of the afternoon loading the remaining 60 fireforming loads and can't wait to get back to the range and finish the "drudgery" stage, so I can begin load development with the 105 Hybrids. It is apparent that this baby wants to shoot.

One thing I did notice and I'm hoping for some feedback from you guys. This is in a standard length Remington 700 action, that also wears a Broughton 6.5 x 284 barrel. When I eject a spent case right after firing, it will sometimes have a flattened edge on the case mouth. If I pause for a moment, or just pull the bolt back a half inch or so, to give the case time to cool down some, I don't get the flat spot. Is that normal, a result of the long Remington action, Remington actions in general, or what? I have never experienced this with any Lapua brass in any other cartridge. Maybe because of such a radical shape change and the soft brass from the annealing? I don't know.

Thanks for reading,
 
Do you have the ejector removed from the bolt on this particular action? While the brass is hot the ejector may have enough pressure to force the spent cartridge to the side of the chamber or receiver and cause the dent in the mouth? Just speculation on my behalf! If the ejector is still installed, try removing it and see what happens. That is if it doesn't cause headspace issues in its absense?

Mike
 
That blow length is way to short, i throw anything away less than 1.548. send me PM and i will go through the way to get your length.............jim
 
install a "softer" spring in the ejector...its too stiff and with a Remington action there is no cone breaching to slow down the side thrust when the ctg case clears the rear of the breach and it is slamming the case mouth against the inside of the action,,,,Century spring (800-237-5225) has it (R-3)...cut it aprox 1/4" (1-5/8" +/- a lil') longer than the factory spring...it is much "weaker" but works great....Roger
 
The factory ejector was in place. I figured it was because the hot brass was being slammed against the inside of the action, as you said. Will order up a new ejector spring, as also suggested.

Jim, I sent you a PM. But NO WAY I am throwing away all of that brass, for now. I look forward to reading of your solution. Really.

And thank you all.
 
Steve, I never received your PM. How long is your chamber? did you make a false shoulder? did you dry your chamber out? take the lube off the cases? Take the spring out of the ejector. use fed. primers. If your chamber is highly polished it will make short ones.....jim
 
I can tell you right now...blow length will be longer if you use the false shoulder method. Quite honestly, I don't know why. I have tried both ways...in fact I now jam AND use a false shoulder. PLUS, I have also tried the COW method!!

This subject has been covered quite a bit over at BRCentral. There are some fellows over there who are EXTREAMLY knowledgeable...they say that the firing pin strike WILL move the case forward in the chamber no matter how much you jam the bullet. My guess is that this is why some people get erratic FF lengths......again...MY GUESS...I just know that the blow lengths are longer and MORE COSISTANT when I use the false shoulder AND jam.

It Reilly doesn't take that much more time to do, and it is almost a grantee that you will have properly formed cases.

Whenever I start with new brass, whatever the caliber, I iron out the necks....there's ALWAYS s bunch of cases with a ding in them, and the only way to clean them up is by expanding the necks. I purchased an expander die from Sinclair along with the propper expander mandrels for each caliber, for both neck turning and necking up. Since I am doing this step anyway, I just neck up to 25 cal and then squeeze them back down.

As far as accuracy, I threw together 100 fireforming rounds for break in in my new Dasher tube, and for a shoot coming up this weekend.....It is shooting in the .2's all the way out to 500...... Now granted, these are 3 shot groups, but impressive none the less. 31 g Varget and 105 Berger BT's. I had no intention of ever shooting the 105's at anything, but it sure shoots.
 
4X is right use the false shoulder. The pin strike will move the case forward into the chamber until the extractor stops it.
 
I had used CCI450`s once for fireforming, no more. My smith Stephen Hall suggested Fed 205`s because they are softer and will not drive the case forward as bad as the harder 450. I knew he was a great machinist, but also shares very sensible info all the time too. I have learned all the ways in the world how NOT to do something. :-[
 
tclaunch said:
I had used CCI450`s once for fireforming, no more. My smith Stephen Hall suggested Fed 205`s because they are softer and will not drive the case forward as bad as the harder 450. I knew he was a great machinist, but also shares very sensible info all the time too. I have learned all the ways in the world how NOT to do something. :-[

My question to you is...do you FF using the jam method, or do use the false sholder? I can't possably see the case moving forward with ANY primer while using the false sholder method.

I use the FF loads for "F" class and other "non IBS" events. I wouldn't want to give up the accuracy I am seeing with my currant FF loads by switching primers.

I was just curious...I have never tried to FF with the Fed 205's. Are you saying that the case is being driven forward when using the false sholder and the 450's, or just using the jam method/450's?
 

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