Some issue loading Hornady V-Max in .223 Rem ?

[mic2377]

223 lee crimp die is a collet crimp not a roll or taper and does not have a carbide ring. THAT is a pistol crimp die that has that. Don't crimp the bullet, you will ruin it. All that is needed is proper neck tension.

And you need the VLD type of chamfer tool.

+2 on the VLD chamfer tool and ensuring the case neck tension isn't too high. The VLD chamfer tool alone solved every issue I had.

 

[bozo699]

223 lee crimp die is a collet crimp not a roll or taper and does not have a carbide ring. THAT is a pistol crimp die that has that. Don't crimp the bullet, you will ruin it. All that is needed is proper neck tension.

And you need the VLD type of chamfer tool.

Heck I forgot all about the collet crimp dies , thanks for correcting me on that
Wayne

 

[243winxb]

hornady V-Max tipped 55gr

I am using a Lee seater

Use a Lyman M die to open case mouth.
*Second step enters
case about 1/16" to
allow bullet to start
freely."

Rifle Neck Expanding M Dies

A Lyman Original Improves accuracy of cast and jacketed bullet reloads. Doesn't stretch cases as does standard expander button. Extends case life. A "Must-Have" die for the cast bullet or flat-base bullet user. The first step expands the inside of the case neck to just under bullet diameter for...

www.lymanproducts.com

 

[Rank Amateur]

223 lee crimp die is a collet crimp not a roll or taper and does not have a carbide ring. THAT is a pistol crimp die that has that. Don't crimp the bullet, you will ruin it. All that is needed is proper neck tension.

And you need the VLD type of chamfer tool.

Yes, collet crimping is the action that “corrects” minor deformations to the mouth/neck caused by pushing bullet into the case when not concentric. No, you won’t ruin the bullet, unless you over-crimp and crush it. The die can be adjusted to merely squeeze the neck back into round, or it can be adjusted to squeeze a roll crimp into the mouth. I’ve crimped thousands of V-Max bullets into .223 cases for use in AR varmint rifles where a slight crimp enhances precision and protects against setback. Yes, the .223 Lee Factory Crimp die will produce roll crimps and will roll the case mouth into bullet cannelure (as found in some V-Max bullets).

 

[tommeboy]

The stem in the Lee 223 seater is fine with the vmax bullets. The Hornady die you are going to have problems. with the vmax bullet. You might need to polish the seating stem in the hornady. At least I did for the 223 seater I had. The Lee stem fits the 60gr vmax really well.

What I do is to chuck up a bullet I am using in a drill. Then I take lapping compound and coat the bullet. Then insert it into the stem a spin away for about 30 sec. That should take care of any rim the plug puts on the bullet while seating. If it is hitting the tip of the bullet them drill it a little deeper. Just make sure not to use too big of a bit.

How I set up standard seaters is to screw the die down onto a piece of brass till it touches the mouth. Then I screw out the die 1 turn and lock it down. Don't use a m-die on a 223. You will have NO neck tension if you do. It is not needed on a 223 with jacketed bullets. It is designed for seating lead bullets so you don't shave lead.

 

[DShortt]

IF the M die is made correctly, all it will do is slightly bell the case mouth so that the bullet will enter straight. If the M die is actually expanding the neck and neck tension is lost, then the first part of the M die stem is incorrectly made. If the neck tension was too high, either because the sizing die used is incorrectly made or the brass has an unusually thick neck wall, then it may open the entire neck diameter some, but again. If the M die stem is made correctly it should still leave adequate neck tension.
This is typically only a problem on flat base bullets. Boat tail bullets will enter the case mouth and act like their own expander.

Edit to add - if you got this brass already sized and primed, it's possible that whomever prepped the brass was doing a neck tension experiment of some sort and used a sizing die that normally takes an expander button but had that removed also.

 

[K22]

these cases were bulk, I purchased like 8 years ago, and were pre primed! I checked and the appeard sized as well. The turning the case things is interesting. I am hoping the Hornady seater will work better, with THEIR bullet! I spoke with Hornady Tech, and felt it should, and also mentioned the chamferring need. One other note they mentioned was to slight lube of the neck prior to loading the bullet? I will have the Hornady seater die next week. I have other Lake City cases, that I sized and might give those a try. But would like to use theses preprimed cases...got like 1500 of them! 8 years ago, price was like half of now! and don't need ot get primers...oh well..we shall see.

You should not have to lube the neck to seat bullets in fact, I would not do this since you may contaminate the powder / primers.

If I am interpreting this correctly, it sounds like you never sized the cases but are using casing that presumably have already been sized which is dubious at best. This is the first issue I would address. You could run the cases through a neck sizing die with an expander ball (de capping pin removed) to resize the necks without contaminating the primers by using a dry lube such as graphite. Try a few and see if this solves the problem.

Like others have noted, you need to have the seating die set up correctly with regards to the crimping function of the die. The Vmax bullets do not have a crimping cannelure, so I don't think trying to roll crimp cases for these bullets in a good idea.

 

[Rank Amateur]

You should not have to lube the neck to seat bullets in fact, I would not do this since you may contaminate the powder / primers.

If I am interpreting this correctly, it sounds like you never sized the cases but are using casing that presumably have already been sized which is dubious at best. This is the first issue I would address. You could run the cases through a neck sizing die with an expander ball (de capping pin removed) to resize the necks without contaminating the primers by using a dry lube such as graphite. Try a few and see if this solves the problem.

Like others have noted, you need to have the seating die set up correctly with regards to the crimping function of the die. The Vmax bullets do not have a crimping cannelure, so I don't think trying to roll crimp cases for these bullets in a good idea.

Well, I guess that depends on which 55gr flat-based Hornady V-Max bullets are being used. https://www.hornady.com/bullets/rifle/22-cal-224-55-gr-v-max-with-cannelure#!/

 

[effendude]

Wow,
Maybe I've been fortunate but I've never had to re-chamfer fired/sized brass for V-Max bullets in my 223's, all used in AR-15's. Before the Dillon 1050, I loaded on my Forster Co-Ax and didn't notice anything either. New brass with a sharp case mouth edge would shave some jacket material if the kids didn't chamfer them before the initial loading. I use the Dillon dies on the Dillon, Forster for my F-Class rounds.

 

[brccd]

Well, I guess that depends on which 55gr flat-based Hornady V-Max bullets are being used. https://www.hornady.com/bullets/rifle/22-cal-224-55-gr-v-max-with-cannelure#!/

these are without cannelure...didn't realize they have a version with it?!

 

[brccd]

You should not have to lube the neck to seat bullets in fact, I would not do this since you may contaminate the powder / primers.

If I am interpreting this correctly, it sounds like you never sized the cases but are using casing that presumably have already been sized which is dubious at best. This is the first issue I would address. You could run the cases through a neck sizing die with an expander ball (de capping pin removed) to resize the necks without contaminating the primers by using a dry lube such as graphite. Try a few and see if this solves the problem.

Like others have noted, you need to have the seating die set up correctly with regards to the crimping function of the die. The Vmax bullets do not have a crimping cannelure, so I don't think trying to roll crimp cases for these bullets in a good idea.

correct...kind of depending on someone elses sizing...
as suggested...run cases through neck sizer...see how that helps...but chamferring seems to definitely improve things. Waiting for the Hornady die...another test variable!

Next question...is using the vmax bullets that much better? Is this worth this effort? Assuming these are maybe being used for 100 yds...

 

[effendude]

correct...kind of depending on someone elses sizing...
as suggested...run cases through neck sizer...see how that helps...but chamferring seems to definitely improve things. Waiting for the Hornady die...another test variable!

Next question...is using the vmax bullets that much better? Is this worth this effort? Assuming these are maybe being used for 100 yds...

You are overthinking this. Try Full Length sizing a few pieces of the "Processed" brass. Then try seatin the bullets. You don't need a new seater, or to lube the necks. Just size the brass properly
Scott

 

[tommeboy]

If you do end up using a m-die, go here NOE he makes a bunch of sizes to get the neck tension you want. But I do not recommend them for the 223. Not enough neck. If you set it up to just start to expand on the second stage of the expander you could use it. But your brass will have to be exactly the same length. So if you set it up like the maker want you too it will be way too much.

Th expander NOE makes you can get the diameter on each step the way you want. They are actually made for cast lead bullets but can be used for anything.

 

[tred1956]

I started using Vickerman seater dies when I began loading 17 & 20 Caliber bullets. Just makes it a lot easier for my old hands. LOL Like them so much that they are all I use now. I still size new brass and chamfer before first loading. Not saying this is the best way just saying it works for me. No problem with flat base bullets.
Safe shooting
Doug

 

[243winxb]

depending on someone elses sizing...

Expanding the necks, correctly, will help. The chamfer is needed. But should not be over done. Next time, buy boatail bullets.

 

[K22]

correct...kind of depending on someone elses sizing...
as suggested...run cases through neck sizer...see how that helps...but chamferring seems to definitely improve things. Waiting for the Hornady die...another test variable!

Next question...is using the vmax bullets that much better? Is this worth this effort? Assuming these are maybe being used for 100 yds...

I have a lot of success with 223 Vmax bullets, both the 55 (12" twist) and the 60 (8" twist). If used under 200 yards or so, the flat base is actually an advantage accuracy wise if precision shooting is your game, at least that's what the benchrest guys tell me and I would think they know.

The 60 max bullets shoot significantly better in my 8" twist rifles than the Nosler 60 BT with the added advantage that they are more economical.

Any time you use "prepared ready to load" cases from outside sources I would be suspicious since you have no idea how they "prepared" them. Often, when I see reloaders having problems it's because they use either previously fired cases from unknown sources or cases which they have not process. If you start with virgin cases and follow sound case prep procedures, you can avoid a lot of problems and headaches.

 

[GotRDid]

Well, I guess that depends on which 55gr flat-based Hornady V-Max bullets are being used. https://www.hornady.com/bullets/rifle/22-cal-224-55-gr-v-max-with-cannelure#!/

Yep,
On sale at MidSouth as of now….

 

[brccd]

Expanding the necks, correctly, will help. The chamfer is needed. But should not be over done. Next time, buy boatail bullets.

yes, getting boat tails next batch!

 

[brccd]

I have a lot of success with 223 Vmax bullets, both the 55 (12" twist) and the 60 (8" twist). If used under 200 yards or so, the flat base is actually an advantage accuracy wise if precision shooting is your game, at least that's what the benchrest guys tell me and I would think they know.

The 60 max bullets shoot significantly better in my 8" twist rifles than the Nosler 60 BT with the added advantage that they are more economical.

Any time you use "prepared ready to load" cases from outside sources I would be suspicious since you have no idea how they "prepared" them. Often, when I see reloaders having problems it's because they use either previously fired cases from unknown sources or cases which they have not process. If you start with virgin cases and follow sound case prep procedures, you can avoid a lot of problems and headaches.

yes, another lesson learned...I did check the cases prior in a gauge though, and they were good. It was after loading the bullet before doing a chamfer, found problems...chamfer well, line bullet up, then was a clean load and fit in the gauge! Seems like more work to load these flat bullets!

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

I always understood that chamfering/deburring case mouths are necessary steps in reloading, especially gas guns.