Smokeless Muzzleloader Build

[Jonathan Zimmerman]

I finished my smokeless muzzleloader build tonight. Quite honestly, it does not look anything like a muzzleloader or shoot like one for that matter. I built it from the Instructional DVD set by Richard Franklin. It was a lot of fun, and the benefits will be lasting here in Ohio. This muzzleloader just tripled my effective range on whitetails. I will be shooting out to 300 yards on Saturday, and then when I have more time to test 500 yards. Tonight I got in 5 shots, two just to get my scope dialed in and then a three shot group (pictured). I will list out the components from the build. Have a good one.

Remington 700 Short Action
Jewel Trigger
Krieger Barrel (28", SS, 18 Twist)
HS Precision Stock
Harrels Precision Brake
Nightforce Scope Base
Leupold VXII 6-18x40
275 gr. Parker Ballistic Extreme (No Sabot, true .45 cal bullet)

 

[JKLOSTERMAN]

Please give us more.

 

[RockwellS10]

Very Interesting!!!! Let us know how it shoots at 300 and 500!

 

[AusFclass]

that sounds pritty cool! ;D is that so you can shoot during "muzzle loader" season or something?

how do you make the chamber, what sort of primer and firing system do you use and do you load it with patches and wads like a normal muzzle loader?? sory for all the questions but ive never heard of a smokeless muzzle loader!

 

[SteveNC]

Nice work..enjoy.

 

[Preacher]

No chamber to speak of, just drilled and tapped for a Breech plug...
They use regular rifle primers set into a cut off 7x57 case...
No patches but they do use a wonder wad...
Front loading smokeless powder rifles have been around a while...

 

[Jonathan Zimmerman]

Preacher has got it pretty much right. I used .308 Win cases cut down in mine, and uniformed the thickness on all of them. I do not use a wonder wad either, just a naked bullet seated into the barrel. Again, Richard Franklin sells instructional DVD's on how to do this. I enjoyed the project and thought I would share the results. Tomorrow I will be shooting out to 300 yards. I will set my zero at 200 and then see what kind of drop it has at 300. Have a good weekend. Jonathan

 

[XTR]

I seem to recall a recent story of someone using a smokeless ML that went KA-BOOM on them. I didn't read it but I think it may be over in Snipers Hide. I don't know if it was even the same design as yours but be careful with your loadings.

 

[twoodard]

that has been said ever since the savage came out. I think they are safer than any other ml out there. I have two now one stock ml-ii and a savage striker conversion

 

[Jonathan Zimmerman]

The way the Remington (Not sure how the Savage works) it is headspaced to close tightly on the case or primer holder. It seals the ignition system against the nipple to prevent blowback, so the locking lugs actually have a purpose with this design. In states were a rifle is not able to be used, this extends your range. I did not reinvent the wheel. As Preacher has already stated, these have been around for a while. The testing was done by more qualified people than I. It is a lot of fun to shoot, and for running a 275 grain bullet at 2800-2900 fps it does not have a bad recoil with the brake and weight of the rifle. There is one company making these same rifles claiming to shoot safely up to 3100 fps. With that being said, I feel very confident shooting mine at the velocity 200+ fps slower then theirs. Thanks again guys, Jonathan

 

[wvuredneck09]

the next question is what is your price on one of these?

 

[Jonathan Zimmerman]

I was able to shoot today. I only attempted 2 groups, one at 200 and one at 300. Beyond that I made the scope corrections that I needed and confirmed my 100 yard elevation. With a 200 yard zero I am 2" high at 100 and 9" low at 300 yards. The wind was blowing pretty good, but all things considered I am happy with the rifle. It maintained minute of angle to 300 yards. I am sure it is capable of better, but this will certainly kill a deer next week. If I end up with a deer next weekend, I will post the results here. Thanks again. Jonathan

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

How hard is it to load those Parker bullets. I love the Savage smokeless MZ's and have been planning to do a custom for a while now. --Mike

 

[Jonathan Zimmerman]

Mike,

They are sized individually before they are ready for loading. The force to seat these bullets is the same as loading a good sabot. I used a .22-250 FL sizing die, cut off at about 0.800" and faced in the lathe for a sizer. It measures right at 0.449" and after sizing the bullets, they measure a couple of tenths under 0.450". You would think since the bore is 0.450" you would want something slightly larger but that is not exactly how it works. I tried loading a bullet that was 0.4505" and could not even start it. Bob Parker is who you need to speak with about the bullets, he will lead you in the right direction.

Jonathan

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Interesting. Thanks you.--Mike

 

[DOGCAPPER]

An old gentelman from Ohio that I shot muzzle loaders with built a similar pistol for competion using modern steel 38 barrel....He made a sizing die from a short piece of barrel from the pistol..The bullet came thru sized and engraved with the rifling....Just line up the grooves and load...It shot so good it was banned from competition...So much for innovation...LT

 

[Jonathan Zimmerman]

Now that is an interesting idea. I had never even thought about doing it that way. I guess if I ever build another one, that may be a good test. Thanks for posting that. Jonathan

 

[Longshooter70]

Very nice rifle and build! I've had the itch for a smokeless long range muzzleloader for a while. If you don't mind me asking, what powder are you using and approximate charge weight? I'm sure barrel maintenance is a heck of a lot easier than that of black powder or black powder substitutes.

Thanks,

John

 

[Jonathan Zimmerman]

John,

I am shooting IMR 4198, as recommended by the instructional DVD set (he covers loads in that set). I do not clean the bore between shots, or even run a patch down it. Load and shoot. The most I have had down the barrel was 13 rounds last weekend. The barrel cleaned up in about 10 minutes after that session. I am sold on the smokeless powder muzzleloaders. As far as charge, I can only tell you that in my rifle I have run up to 70 grains. Again, that was my rifle in its configuration and shouldn't be used as a generic smokeless load. Like everything else you read online about reloading, take that with a grain of salt. Others are shooting different powders and loads getting very good results also. I know I have heard of IMR 4350 being used, (I think that was one of the powders that Savage had recommended for their smokeless muzzleloaders). Let me know if you have any other questions, I'll try to help where I can.

Jonathan

 

[Longshooter70]

Jonathon,
Thank you for the information. I've been reloading for a while(20+ years) and I understand your concerns. I've got an extra Rem 700 SA and have been considering having one of these built. I like the idea that you used 308 Win brass trimmed down and primed for your ignition source. Easy to re-prime and I'm guessing they last a while. Just de-prime and re-prime with your favorite primer and run.
What I'm researching now is high bc bullets and maybe a little longer barrel. I think once I find the bullet, I'll look for the optimum twist rate for the barrel and go from there.
While muzzleloader hunting this year I had to sit and watch while several deer passed by at 300+ yards and there was nothing I could do but watch and hopefully set up on them later. I would like to rectify that by next year. I'm hunting a lot of clear cuts and powerlines and it's difficult to set up with favorable winds or find a good tree to climb. If you don't get above the weeds and undergrowth, it's all but impossible to see deer within 50 yards much less at extended ranges.
Thank you for your information. I'll most likely bug you again when it comes time to order a barrel or get pointers on loading.

John