shoulderd prefit vs gunsmith barrel

[Dusty Stevens]

Dusty, why the nut on this rifle seeing as you have a lathe?

I asked the same thing

 

[Dusty Stevens]

Every innovation, huh? Wow.

Name one that came from the deer woods or prairie dog field

 

[jelenko]

Well said. That is EXACTLY what happens. A guy asks a question, and 20 posts later nothing short of winning the nationals at a bench rest competition will be considered "accuracy". The snobbery is palpable (and that's what it is). I have seen literally HUNDREDS of these threads devolve EXACTLY like that, and so have my friends... It is real thing.

To me, it seems more like the people who compete in benchrest are intuitively responding with what they know and what is important to what they do. I don't feel it's 'snobbery' - if anything more just forgetting that what is critical to their success may be more than is needed in another discipline.

I compete in 'XTC' where a rifle/ammo that shoots even some 1/2 MOA groups - with anything over a 1" group being very rare - is enough to win Nationals. While there is absolutely nothing wrong per se with working on improving my gun/ammo's accuracy, I do know it won't make a difference in my scores.

Further 'away' from the accuracy demands of benchrest would be three gun competition. I haven't competed in 3 gun and don't know anyone who has, but from my understanding of their courses of firing, a 1 MOA gun is fine.

Going back the other way, my perception is there are a lot of readers here that don't participate in formal competition but are motivated to get their rifle/ammo as accurate as possible. Many probably like the detail and care that is involved along with the experimenting. For these shooters, I would think the advice of top level benchrest shooters would be highly valued.

 

[JFrank]

The OP is considering a Zermatt/ Big Horn action( ie floating bolt head ) no mention of discipline.

 

[Alex Wheeler]

I have hunting rifle customers that do more anal reloading than I do for my BR rifle. Its not that they need to but its what they enjoy. Its a hobby for most of us, not a need. There are plenty of guys out there that read these pages who never post that benefit from all the snobs sharing knowledge.

 

[urbanrifleman]

Name one that came from the deer woods or prairie dog field

You really have a very narrow view of what precision rifle users are...

I will just submit, and say that benchrest shooters absolutely have driven a lot of precision rifle technology. You are correct, not all but much...

But let's be honest they shoot highly modified and upgraded Mausers, and bolt gun tech is pretty darn old. David Tubbs ATR makes most bolt gun tech look like a toy... and it was not designed for benchrest shooting.

 

[urbanrifleman]

I have hunting rifle customers that do more anal reloading than I do for my BR rifle. Its not that they need to but its what they enjoy. Its a hobby for most of us, not a need. There are plenty of guys out there that read these pages who never post that benefit from all the snobs sharing knowledge.

Of course this is true, but the flip side of that is that I know a lot of new folks who go down crazy Internet rabbit holes of tech and never benefit at all. In fact, they get worse... I would be included in that group at one time.

But the 6BRA IS THE BALLS!!! I totally stole that one from you!!!

Some people do act like snobs. Not all. But there are quite a few.... heck the PRS guys make benchrest guys look like total slackers when it comes to snobbery... the mellenials are a totally different breed. They literally know everything...

David Tubb put me on track to shooting way better. And his formula was incredibly simple, yet I suppose it wasn't...

 

[Alex Wheeler]

Nothing to steal if it is posted it's for everyone to use. Hopefully they don't go backwards and it is beneficial but at the end of the day it's all information and how you use it is up to you.

 

[Jess Mellen]

I like the good, better, best approach.

 

[urbanrifleman]

I like the good, better, best approach.

Yes!!

 

[hpshooter]

I like the good, better, best approach.

Agree ! Research the options using as many resources as you choose and decide which options best suites your particular needs. May be March vs. Night Force or Sightron vs.Athelon, Jewel vs Bix and Andy or Timney vs factory, or nutted vs shouldered.

Personally, I enjoy the wide range of options expressed on this site to choose from. In the end it is up to the individual shooter to pick what suites their needs and budget.

 

[INTJ]

Of course this is true, but the flip side of that is that I know a lot of new folks who go down crazy Internet rabbit holes of tech and never benefit at all. In fact, they get worse... I would be included in that group at one time.

But the 6BRA IS THE BALLS!!! I totally stole that one from you!!!

Some people do act like snobs. Not all. But there are quite a few.... heck the PRS guys make benchrest guys look like total slackers when it comes to snobbery... the mellenials are a totally different breed. They literally know everything...

David Tubb put me on track to shooting way better. And his formula was incredibly simple, yet I suppose it wasn't...

@urbanrifleman . What you seem to be misunderstanding is that people who compete in benchrest aren't only able to shoot from a bench. It makes me wonder if you even personally know any actual BR competitors.

Several years ago when I was shooting LR BR I decided to give across the course Highpower a try. The Highpower guys were pretty dismissive of me because, you know, benchrest guys can only shoot from the bench with a scope. I shot two matches and both times I finished in the middle, beating a lot of the guys who were dismissive of me. At my first LR BR match I finished at the bottom and that was after years of developing loads and shooting from a bench with accurate hunting rifles.

When they asked me how a bench guy could shoot competently from other positions--I had never shot seated or prone before or with a tight sling, I said two things. The first is the competitive benchrest is a world away from casually shooting from the bench. The second made them mad, but it is THE one absolute truth in ANY type of shooting:

Don't pull the trigger until the sights are aligned where you want them.

I didn't stick with Highpower partially because the shooters were arrogant but mostly because I just couldn't get excited about a perfect score only needing a 1 MOA group at 600 yds or whatever that huge 10 ring and X ring were.

Oh yeah, there was one or two young young kids who competed and scored well during those two matches, just like can happen in LR BR.......

Something else you either don't get or are purposely ignoring is that because the bench and bags allow for a very stable shooting platform, group and score standards are very high, higher that any other shooting discipline. I think the 600 and 1000 yd 10 and X-rings are half the size of F-Class, the next closest thing.

The big difference with BR is that tuning the rifle and load is as important as shooting technique. SR BR guys load and tune during each group they shoot at a match. LR BR guys like to make a final tuning tweak the day before they match at the range they are shooting. Add to that you must read the wind, gun handling must be incredibly consistent, and the rests and rifle need to be set up to track well. Also, ONE bad shot can take you out of the running.

While I see others like you who have a condescending attitude toward BR competitors, I don't see that from BR shooters toward other disciplines. Each shooting discipline has its own challenges and requirements, and they should all be celebrated. I am especially impressed with Silhouette competitors.

Finally, since you have a business selling stuff to shooters and you are posting on a forum filled with BR shooters, I recommend that you adopt a more positive attitude toward BR shooters. We'd all like to support you, but your attitude makes it hard.

 

[urbanrifleman]

@urbanrifleman . What you seem to be misunderstanding is that people who compete in benchrest aren't only able to shoot from a bench. It makes me wonder if you even personally know any actual BR competitors.

Several years ago when I was shooting LR BR I decided to give across the course Highpower a try. The Highpower guys were pretty dismissive of me because, you know, benchrest guys can only shoot from the bench with a scope. I shot two matches and both times I finished in the middle, beating a lot of the guys who were dismissive of me. At my first LR BR match I finished at the bottom and that was after years of developing loads and shooting from a bench with accurate hunting rifles.

When they asked me how a bench guy could shoot competently from other positions--I had never shot seated or prone before or with a tight sling, I said two things. The first is the competitive benchrest is a world away from casually shooting from the bench. The second made them mad, but it is THE one absolute truth in ANY type of shooting:

Don't pull the trigger until the sights are aligned where you want them.

I didn't stick with Highpower partially because the shooters were arrogant but mostly because I just couldn't get excited about a perfect score only needing a 1 MOA group at 600 yds or whatever that huge 10 ring and X ring were.

Oh yeah, there was one or two young young kids who competed and scored well during those two matches, just like can happen in LR BR.......

Something else you either don't get or are purposely ignoring is that because the bench and bags allow for a very stable shooting platform, group and score standards are very high, higher that any other shooting discipline. I think the 600 and 1000 yd 10 and X-rings are half the size of F-Class, the next closest thing.

The big difference with BR is that tuning the rifle and load is as important as shooting technique. SR BR guys load and tune during each group they shoot at a match. LR BR guys like to make a final tuning tweak the day before they match at the range they are shooting. Add to that you must read the wind, gun handling must be incredibly consistent, and the rests and rifle need to be set up to track well. Also, ONE bad shot can take you out of the running.

While I see others like you who have a condescending attitude toward BR competitors, I don't see that from BR shooters toward other disciplines. Each shooting discipline has its own challenges and requirements, and they should all be celebrated. I am especially impressed with Silhouette competitors.

Finally, since you have a business selling stuff to shooters and you are posting on a forum filled with BR shooters, I recommend that you adopt a more positive attitude toward BR shooters. We'd all like to support you, but your attitude makes it hard.

Condescending attitude toward benchest shooters? Just wow.

WOW. (As I return home from shooting benchest).

 

[INTJ]

Condescending attitude toward benchest shooters? Just wow.

WOW. (As return home from shooting benchest).

That is how you present yourself here. It's up to you if that is how you want to be seen........