Shoulder Bumping & Neck Sizing

[Butte Sink]

Good Afternoon All,

I'm totally new to reloading and studying all I can.
Questions I have-- I've decided that with using my FL die that I'm going just bump back the shoulders of the fire formed brass "Nosler" that I have.

I started thinking and wondered if reloaders neck size after doing this? or will the FL die resize the neck and take out all the imperfections if any?

I'm loading hunting rounds for a 300 RUM, 280 AI and my sons 7MM REM MAG.

Thanks for any info!

 

[boltman13]

What you are contemplating is to minimally resize the case body with a full length sizing die. It will resize the neck and probably a little of the case body as well. If you really want to only bump the shoulder and not touch the rest of the body it takes a special die. Forester makes a "Shoulder Bump Die that does that and resizes the neck with different size bushings. For hunting rifles it is probably more than you need. You might also think about a collet neck sizing die and full length resize when chambering gets a little difficult, usually after 3-4 reloads. Best of luck.

 

[BoydAllen]

If your brass is once fired, using a suitable gauge such as the one Hornady has mislabeled their "headspace gauge", first try setting your die to replicate the head to shoulder dimension of once fired brass, (remembering to remove the primer before measuring the fired case). Try a case sized this way in your rifle. If it chambers OK then you are home free. The FL die will size the neck. Is your die one piece, or does take bushings so that necks can be sized differently depending on which bushing is used? In any case, be sure to lube the insides of your necks before sizing and if that lube is some sort of liquid or wax clean it out after sizing so the powder does not stick to it when you charge the cases. A good rule for reloading is to put powder in all of your cases and with them all in the same loading block, with good light. look down into all of them to be sure that they are all filled to the same level, assuming that they are the same load.

 

[Shynloco]

Butte Sink,
First off, welcome aboard! And since you are new to the site, may I suggest you follow Boyd's words as he's one of our resident experts on reloading and shooting. And for what's it's worth, RCBS makes a device (in various calibers) called an RCBS Precision Mic that assists in easily measuring the shoulder angle of your fired or unfired cases. I have one for each of the calibers I reload for and makes it simple to BUMP the shoulder only two thousands upon FL resizing. Of course you have to adjust the FL Die so it BUMPS ONLY 2 thousands, as turning the mic down all the way to contact with the Shell Holder may well give you much more of a shoulder angle.

At any rate, good luck and have fun with your reloading. There's a great deal of info you can learn from others on this website, as well as see varying opinions on how to accomplish a given task. If unsure, just ask and find what process works best for you. Happy shootin!

Alex

 

[fguffey]

I started thinking and wondered if reloaders neck size after doing this? or will the FL die resize the neck and take out all the imperfections if any?

My opinion; there is no telling what a reloader will do after sizing a case. My dies and presses have threads, threads make it possible to adjust the die to the shell holder. I can adjust the die to return the case to minimum length from the shoulder to the case head (same as full length size). I can back the die off to reduce the dies ability to size the case; I can size a case to 5 different length from the datum/shoulder to the case head with the aid of a feeler gage.

Sizing cases for short chambers; same thing, with the aid of a feeler gage I can size cases that are .012" shorter than a minimum length full length sized case from the shoulder to the case head.. I have neck sizing dies, I do not use them but I have them just in case. There is nothing like getting all the use out of a die by simply learning how to adjust it.

I understand the infatuation with bumping; I find it impossible to bump a shoulder back. I have come to the conclusion reloaders do not know/understand what happens to the shoulder of a case when it is sized and or fired. I understand it sounds cool but my shoulders do not move. Then only way I can move a shoulder back on a case is with a die that does not have case body support. The question asked is about a full length sizing die; the full length sizing die has case body support. The neck sizing die does not have case body support. Meaning? I can move the shoulder of a case back or to make it more clear I can shorten a case by moving the shoulder back with a short neck sizing die. But there is a problem; without case body support the case will be turned into an accordion/case with bellows.

F. Guffey

 

[M-61]

Quote from fguffey...
"I can move the shoulder of a case back......"

Would that by chance be 'bumping' ?

 

[IPSCNUT]

Quote from fguffey...
"I can move the shoulder of a case back......"

Would that by chance be 'bumping' ?

Some folks like to argue with, as well as challenge themselves!!!!!!

 

[M-61]

TO the OP:
There are a large number of posts regarding belted magnums, where they eventually headspace, and 'bumping' shoulders. A quick search will pull up a lot. I'd suggest reading them and get an idea of what is happening and what you are doing, and ask away. You can search here or the web, just type in 'Bumping shoulders on belted cartridges.'
Here's one:



http://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/belted-magnum-headspacing.3406956/

 

[6MMsteve]

My opinion; there is no telling what a reloader will do after sizing a case. My dies and presses have threads, threads make it possible to adjust the die to the shell holder. I can adjust the die to return the case to minimum length from the shoulder to the case head (same as full length size). I can back the die off to reduce the dies ability to size the case; I can size a case to 5 different length from the datum/shoulder to the case head with the aid of a feeler gage.

Sizing cases for short chambers; same thing, with the aid of a feeler gage I can size cases that are .012" shorter than a minimum length full length sized case from the shoulder to the case head.. I have neck sizing dies, I do not use them but I have them just in case. There is nothing like getting all the use out of a die by simply learning how to adjust it.

I understand the infatuation with bumping; I find it impossible to bump a shoulder back. I have come to the conclusion reloaders do not know/understand what happens to the shoulder of a case when it is sized and or fired. I understand it sounds cool but my shoulders do not move. Then only way I can move a shoulder back on a case is with a die that does not have case body support. The question asked is about a full length sizing die; the full length sizing die has case body support. The neck sizing die does not have case body support. Meaning? I can move the shoulder of a case back or to make it more clear I can shorten a case by moving the shoulder back with a short neck sizing die. But there is a problem; without case body support the case will be turned into an accordion/case with bellows.

F. Guffey

 

[fguffey]

Some folks like to argue with, as well as challenge themselves!!!!!!

I said I find it impossible to move the shoulder back on a case with a die that has case body support; no one says "Yes you can". Reloaders claim they can but move the shoulder back, they never say how. I have given reasons/rational why the shoulder can not be moved back with a die that has case body support. I have even offered methods and techniques for determining if the shoulder did move or as I say; prove the shoulder did not move back; it is strange, when I challenge reloaders the social dysfunctional outnumber the ones with good character.

F. Guffey

 

[Toby Bradshaw]

I said I find it impossible to move the shoulder back on a case with a die that has case body support; no one says "Yes you can".

Yes, I can, and so can anyone else (except you, apparently). See below. It's done all the time in forming one case from another, and all the time (to a lesser extent -- 0.001"-0.003") when bumping shoulders.

Reloaders claim they can but move the shoulder back, they never say how.

With a die that supports the case body.

I have given reasons/rational

Do you mean rationale? Because rational and you shouldn't appear in the same sentence.

why the shoulder can not be moved back with a die that has case body support.

Still demonstrably wrong, but by all means keep spewing misinformation if that's what blows your skirt up.

 

[fguffey]

And To avoid confusing a reloader with shop skills I said I can shorten a case from the shoulder of the case to the case head, the part no one seems to be able to comprehend is the part about moving the shoulder of the case back. I can not move the shoulder of the case back if the die has case body support.

F. Guffey

 

[Toby Bradshaw]

And To avoid confusing a reloader with shop skills I said I can shorten a case from the shoulder of the case to the case head, the part no one seems to be able to comprehend is the part about moving the shoulder of the case back. I can not move the shoulder of the case back if the die has case body support.

F. Guffey

++ungood (for you Orwell fans in the audience)

 

[6MMsteve]

And To avoid confusing a reloader with shop skills I said I can shorten a case from the shoulder of the case to the case head, the part no one seems to be able to comprehend is the part about moving the shoulder of the case back. I can not move the shoulder of the case back if the die has case body support.

F. Guffey

 

[ttfreestyle]

I guess I really don't understand how to size my brass, before I size I check the shoulder with a shoulder comparator(hope that's the correct terminology) then after I fl size with my harrells bushing die that measurement is one thou less using the same tool As best I can measure. Is this not bumping the shoulder?

 

[LHSmith]

I guess I really don't understand how to size my brass, before I size I check the shoulder with a shoulder comparator(hope that's the correct terminology) then after I fl size with my harrells bushing die that measurement is one thou less using the same tool As best I can measure. Is this not bumping the shoulder?

According to Funk and Wagnal's, Webster's, and even the highly touted Urban Dictionary......yes bumping is actually an everyday act that can be performed on planet earth.
Someone has a long history of not being able to grasp the concept that brass does indeed flow......quite easily at that.

 

[MrBottleneck]

 

[dkhunt14]

Quote from fguffey...
"I can move the shoulder of a case back......"

Would that by chance be 'bumping' ?

I thought the same thing. Was going to ask but you beat me to it. Matt

 

[ireload2]

Guffey
You are the only one posting that is confused. Why don't you sign up for ESL and learn the language the rest of us speak.
Most of the people here can reload, shoot, speak English and think better than you. You need to catch up with the rest of the shooting world.
Did you ever shoot a real bench rest rifle?

Another question. I guess you find it impossible to form .303 Brit cases out of .405 Win brass using all conventional dies? I have no trouble doing it.

And according your statements apparently you cannot make 6.5X53R Dutch Mannlicher out of .303 British because you cannot figure out a way to change the location of case shoulders.

Can you even post photos?

And To avoid confusing a reloader with shop skills I said I can shorten a case from the shoulder of the case to the case head, the part no one seems to be able to comprehend is the part about moving the shoulder of the case back. I can not move the shoulder of the case back if the die has case body support.

F. Guffey

 

[Dos XX]

Now who can argue with that?