I know a lot of police departments use the Remington 700 police rifle in 308, but I don't know if they use them as they come from the factory, or if most of them change triggers or any other changes. Does anyone know how accurate they are out of the box ? I'm thinking of buying one to add to my list of rifles.
Remington 700 Police in 308 - How accurate are these rifle out of the box ?
- Thread starter short range
- Start date
I don't own one but go to the range a lot. I've seen them shoot under a half inch at 200 yards and I've seen others shoot over 2 inches at 100.
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It could be a half-MOA gun or it could be a 1.2 MOA. Depends on the tolerances and the barrel. Really luck of the draw situation. These days the advice "shoot it 'til the barrel wears out and replace with a custom barrel" isn't as sensible as it once was, given the cost of bullets, primers, and powder. And, what's your time worth, chasing accuracy with a factory tube?
Most Police Depts. don't use Factory Box Rifles available to the public.
Mike, I think you might be suprised at how many PD's use box stock rifles. It sometimes comes down to a CYA liability thing.
DocEd, is right. A friend of mine is a insturtor for a swat team in a near by city. I was really surprised to find out that they are shooting factory rifles. Some have trigger jobs and bedding done. Thats it, No jewell triggers, or custom barrels. At this time they can only shoot Black hills ammo. Exactly what I was told is it comes down to a liability thing. What was more suprising to me was how some of the guys shot. Guess that is why they are in training. Black hills ammo isn't that bad of ammo, and some of the instructors can do well with it. In the end it really comes down to how well of a disipline shooter the nut behing the butt is.
Keep in mind that the average engagement range for PD snipers is less than 100 yards. With this engagement range I am always surprised that they use 24" barrels I would op for a shorter barrel for those ranges. I have shot enough with the XM-3 to be very confident of its accuracy potential inside of 700 yards and it would be easier to get into position and out of the vehicle. The XM-3 is a short barreled sniper weapon that was developed with a lot of federal funds and has a 20 inch barrel.
Sorry to go off topic,
wade
Sorry to go off topic,
wade
Thanks for the info guys, The thing is that I can't afford a custom rifle, I just bought a 30BR a few months ago, and have pretty limited funds, so about $900.00 is about the top that I'm going to spend on a 308. What I think I will do is buy the 700 police, and if I get one that's not 1/2" MOA at 100 yards, later I will buy a custom barrel.
sdeal5, I looked at your add, The thing is, I have a Savage model 12 BTCSS 223 medium heavy fluted barrel with the laminated thumb hole stock that I'm going to have to trade in on the rifle that I get. Also I think the R5 has a stainless barrel, I'm want a flat black like the 700P.
sdeal5
Gold $$ Contributor
short range---- I understand, no problem. I"ve worked with several of the police-sniper models, and all could be made to shoot quite well, .5 or better, but a couple hsd very rough bores and would foul really badly after just a few shots. Ended up having to use the Tubbs final finish on them, and they slicked up fine. I don"t think you will have any problem, but like the other fellow said, the 5r"s are just awesome for a factory rifle. Good luck.
Just want to echo wwbrowns comment.
Once had a conversation with the Sgt in charge of my home states Swat Team. He said he would never authorize a rifle shot over 100yds. Sort of took me by surprise that did. I would imagine its a liability thing in case of a miss.
My buddies 700 Police is capable of 1 moa on a good day. Not sure if its the rifle or the loads/loader. It sure does have a long throat though.
Once had a conversation with the Sgt in charge of my home states Swat Team. He said he would never authorize a rifle shot over 100yds. Sort of took me by surprise that did. I would imagine its a liability thing in case of a miss.
My buddies 700 Police is capable of 1 moa on a good day. Not sure if its the rifle or the loads/loader. It sure does have a long throat though.
I've only gotten one retail price on the 5R rifle in 308, $1,000.00 out the door, but he won't give me much for my savage 223, he mostly deals in AR's and Berrets. What prices have any of you heard on the 5R, and where ? I'm sure the 5R is a much more accurate rifle. Maybe I should list my savage for sale on the forum, and then buy a 5R.
wwbrown, who makes the XM-3 and how huch do they sell for ?
I looked on the Savage web site at the 10 FCP 308 HS Precision stock. I noticed that it comes in a 1-10 twist instead of 1-12 twist. Why do you think they went with the 1-10 twist ? And why do you think most Police departments go with the Remington 700P instead of the savage with the accu- trigger ? The savage looks like it would be about the same price as the 700P.
Short range,
Now you are talking about something I do know about! If you are a Rem fan then go with the 5r. You will have more confidents in it just because you are a Rem fan. The 5r is a fine rifle, or actually they are probably awesome rifles. I have seen a few at a local range. They do shoot very good out of the box. Your first thoughts of selling your savage on the site and going with the 5r want be a bad choice. How ever I am just one of those guys that sits on the fence when it comes to Savage and Rem. I like them both, and both have their advantages and disadvantages, as far as just comparing the two brands against one another.
I do have the Savage 10FCP with the HS stock. I had my smith replace the factory pillar's and glass bed it. The rilfe at this point does consistently hold .5 moa out to 400yrds. I am positive that it would shoot .5 moa consistently at 600yrd or better if I could do a better job behind the trigger and reading the wind better. I am working on that!
Here is what I like about the 1in10 twist with the Savage. I have been playing some with the 190gr bergers. The 1in10 twist stablize's the 190s easily. As well I believe the 1in10 will stablize the 210s bergers or the 208amax. I haven't played to much with the 190s yet because the 175 bergers are just giving me such great performance out to 600 I can't get away from them to do futher testing with the 190s.
I got my Savage 10FCP for $852 out the door. Topped it with a Leupold Mark 4 8.5x25x50 with the TMR Recticle. I really can't be happier with it for a factory rifle. In the future I will replace the factory barrel with a Pacnor super match, or a Broughton 5c. I will make that decision once another project is up and running.
The Accutrigger is a good trigger. How ever I have had the opportunity to pull a Jewell. Wow they are a awesome tigger!! but a little $$ is requried not to bad if you want the best tho! Some say that Fred at SSS has a tigger that is just as crisp as the jewell. Can't comment on that, I haven't touched one of his triggers yet.
Yes Most police or swat team snipers are going with the Rems. The freind that I spoke of in my earlier post has convinced his department to switch to Savage. How ever I still believe it really comes down to the Nut behind the Butt, as well in some situations and getting away from what Police are limited to, factory rifles can and do shoot extremly accurate with someone that can load percision ammo. I'm not trying to say that factory rifles can shoot with custom rifles! No way will that ever happen! To compare a factory rifle to a rifle built on a custom action such as a Bat isn't fair!
In the end if you go with the 5r or the 10FCP you want be disappointed! Look at it like this.
1. What do I want Savage or Rem?
2. Witch would fit what I want best?
3. What can I do with either rifle in the future?
4. Witch will fit my budget at the present time?
Good Luck to you either way!
I hope this helps some
Mark
Now you are talking about something I do know about! If you are a Rem fan then go with the 5r. You will have more confidents in it just because you are a Rem fan. The 5r is a fine rifle, or actually they are probably awesome rifles. I have seen a few at a local range. They do shoot very good out of the box. Your first thoughts of selling your savage on the site and going with the 5r want be a bad choice. How ever I am just one of those guys that sits on the fence when it comes to Savage and Rem. I like them both, and both have their advantages and disadvantages, as far as just comparing the two brands against one another.
I do have the Savage 10FCP with the HS stock. I had my smith replace the factory pillar's and glass bed it. The rilfe at this point does consistently hold .5 moa out to 400yrds. I am positive that it would shoot .5 moa consistently at 600yrd or better if I could do a better job behind the trigger and reading the wind better. I am working on that!
Here is what I like about the 1in10 twist with the Savage. I have been playing some with the 190gr bergers. The 1in10 twist stablize's the 190s easily. As well I believe the 1in10 will stablize the 210s bergers or the 208amax. I haven't played to much with the 190s yet because the 175 bergers are just giving me such great performance out to 600 I can't get away from them to do futher testing with the 190s.
I got my Savage 10FCP for $852 out the door. Topped it with a Leupold Mark 4 8.5x25x50 with the TMR Recticle. I really can't be happier with it for a factory rifle. In the future I will replace the factory barrel with a Pacnor super match, or a Broughton 5c. I will make that decision once another project is up and running.
The Accutrigger is a good trigger. How ever I have had the opportunity to pull a Jewell. Wow they are a awesome tigger!! but a little $$ is requried not to bad if you want the best tho! Some say that Fred at SSS has a tigger that is just as crisp as the jewell. Can't comment on that, I haven't touched one of his triggers yet.
Yes Most police or swat team snipers are going with the Rems. The freind that I spoke of in my earlier post has convinced his department to switch to Savage. How ever I still believe it really comes down to the Nut behind the Butt, as well in some situations and getting away from what Police are limited to, factory rifles can and do shoot extremly accurate with someone that can load percision ammo. I'm not trying to say that factory rifles can shoot with custom rifles! No way will that ever happen! To compare a factory rifle to a rifle built on a custom action such as a Bat isn't fair!
In the end if you go with the 5r or the 10FCP you want be disappointed! Look at it like this.
1. What do I want Savage or Rem?
2. Witch would fit what I want best?
3. What can I do with either rifle in the future?
4. Witch will fit my budget at the present time?
Good Luck to you either way!
I hope this helps some
Mark
Since I actually own a .308 700P, and have even shot it in competition I don't have to qualify my statements.
I bought it to have a rifle to shoot in mid range competition when I needed one in a hurry. The chambering job leaves a lot to be desired, with a very large neck diameter (overworks the brass) and way too much freebore. The chamber isn't exactly on line with the axis of the bore either, it's a little off. The stock has a little too much palm swell. While it's easy to add a little swell (Bondo works), can't take enough away. The firing pin hole is overly large, craters the primer with even the mildest loads. The new trigger isn't that impressive, doesn't have a lot of feel to it.
In other words it's a typical factory rifle.
One the plus side it will consistantly shoot 3/4 moa or slightly better inside 300 yards with well developed handloads. The barrel might even be exceptional, especially for a factory tube as it doesn't shift POI as the barrel gets hot. I suspect the chambering job is why it isn't any more accurate.
All that said, I'm in the process of building a full custom .308 on an aftermarket 700 clone in order to have things the way I think they should be. That being no compromises.
I bought it to have a rifle to shoot in mid range competition when I needed one in a hurry. The chambering job leaves a lot to be desired, with a very large neck diameter (overworks the brass) and way too much freebore. The chamber isn't exactly on line with the axis of the bore either, it's a little off. The stock has a little too much palm swell. While it's easy to add a little swell (Bondo works), can't take enough away. The firing pin hole is overly large, craters the primer with even the mildest loads. The new trigger isn't that impressive, doesn't have a lot of feel to it.
In other words it's a typical factory rifle.
One the plus side it will consistantly shoot 3/4 moa or slightly better inside 300 yards with well developed handloads. The barrel might even be exceptional, especially for a factory tube as it doesn't shift POI as the barrel gets hot. I suspect the chambering job is why it isn't any more accurate.
All that said, I'm in the process of building a full custom .308 on an aftermarket 700 clone in order to have things the way I think they should be. That being no compromises.
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